Mod The Sims - Discrimination of teens in Sims 3.

summersong86

10th Jan 2010, 04:33 AM

LOL--I find the way teens are treated in Sims3 to be completely realistic as that was what it was like for me as a teen. I was in a hellish college prep high school and barely had time to sleep. I saw my friends only in school. There was no time outside of school. But getting back to sims, I see your point. I played a teen Sim for awhile and the game constantly goaded her into the most fiendishly workaholic pressure cooker schedule imaginable--possibly even worse than my real life one had been. It made me wonder if this game is designed by the same killjoys who want to make USA public schools operate year-round and 8 hours a day. You know, the same kind of people who enroll their 2 year olds in a college prep pre-school. Oh, I meet a ton of them. They seem to want to report me to CPS when they find out my child is a "free range baby" who stays home and actually PLAYS WITH TOYS of no known educational value instead of attending multilingual calculus judo violin ballet ninja camp for ages 12 months to 5 years. Bad mommy! Now my precious will never grow up to become a multilingual ballerina ninja lawyer mathematician musician like all the rest of the kids here in Stepford.

The adults in Sims3 don't fare any better as far as a nightlife is concerned. If you try to have a conversation with any adult sim past 7:30 pm they are either starving or drowsy. There is just the most ridiculously narrow window to socialize in this game. I usually am lucky to get dates to stay awake and pleasant long enough for a nice sit-down meal at the Bistro. And afterwards it's a real trick to keep them staying around long enough to say a proper goodbye to them. The whole time, they have the sleepy-face icon above their face. Ugh.

jazzem

10th Jan 2010, 04:35 AM

i have to say i think that its reasonably realistic. If a teen DOES get an after school job it DOES leave them with little free time. If you are caught out late at night the cops WILL simply take you home (and if my teen was brought home in a cop car, i might be inclined to give em a little lecture!) and so i dont really have a big issue with it. I tend to grow em up pretty quick anyways. Although it would be nice to be able to "run from cops" or something and have a percentage chance of success... it would also be nice to (like in sims 2) be able to get them part time jobs in the career that they are going to move into as an adult.

SuicidiaParasidia

10th Jan 2010, 04:37 AM

They seem to want to report me to CPS when they find out my child is a "free range baby" who stays home and actually PLAYS WITH TOYS of no known educational value instead of attending multilingual calculus judo violin ballet ninja camp for ages 12 months to 5 years. Bad mommy! Now my precious will never grow up to become a multilingual ballerina ninja lawyer mathematician musician like all the rest of the kids here in Stepford.

this made my day.
...whatever happened to just letting kids play, anyway? it makes me more thankful to have a set of parents like i did, who'd give you a hotwheel car and tell you to go play in the mud. :lol:

summersong86

10th Jan 2010, 05:02 AM

You can't play in the mud anymore. Don't you know, your kids could pick up bacteria and parasites. If you do, you must douse them from head to toe in Purell sanitizer afterwards or you're a bad parent. Seriously, I ended my subscription to one parenting magazine because it had a photo of celebrity babies at the park or in other activities where they pointed out safety and health hazards with all these captions underneath that said stuff like "Well now we hope so and so will be a good mom and make sure she cleans the kids hands with santizer after they are finished with the jungle gym." And so many parents really take that sort of thing to heart. Amazing and sad. My husband works in the publishing business on the tech support side and he tells me with most of these publications the writers and editors just pull this stuff out of their butts to make deadline anyway. Some rare few really do research and put thought into what they write. But the vast majority of crap we get exposed to in the media and incorporate into our psyche is stuff someone under a deadline simply pulled out of their butt. Kind of like Sims do with monkey wrenches, automobiles and such! We are a society that lives and dies by what stressed out unthinking people pull out of their butts!

Now getting back to topic, getting teens to have any sort of social life in Sims3 involves creating a fabulous rec room and inviting them over to your house. In that respect, it once again is a bit like real life. My sim, Clementine, had a romance going with teen Bob Newbie by inviting him over. But it was hard work to keep his focus on her. The other adults in the house kept spontaneously socializing with Bob. I was constantly having to put them to other tasks so the kids could get some time together. Of course, homework was always looming in the background. Clemmie could barely get a few words with Bob before you could see the kids would need to get some sleep soon and I had to make sure homework got done before then.

Honestly the ONLY way I was able to create a successful happy fulfilled teen with a social life of a whopping THREE friends was to play on aging off, story progression off (Epic lifespan, too--not that it matters much with aging off). When it takes our equivalent of 15 minutes for a sim to just sit their azz on a bed to relax, read a book, whatever, you have to figure they are incapable of getting accomplished in any given day even a fraction of things that an average person can do.

Garek Maxwell

10th Jan 2010, 05:38 AM

...which is rudely interrupted by the cops.
who, of course, apprehend anyone who just so happens to be out catching butterflies past 10pm, irl.

Is that what they're calling it these days?! The Mary Janers and what not?! Sim cops can't let these possible hooligans get away with their antics! First its butterflies, then it's life in prison for drug trafficking! Good riddance I say! These trouble makers should learn to stay off mah lawn! D:<

ani_

10th Jan 2010, 06:57 AM

summersong86: You had the best posts ever :D

No free time is the reason my sim teens never get a job. Unless somebody actually would want a spesific job, then I wold grant them that. But all teens just want A job, which they will forget about by the next want rollout, so I never give it any attention.

My sims also almost never date while teens, this is due to using the rule of six, which means they are teens for only about a week, and it's very rare that I have teens in multiple households at the same time. My sim's life doesnt really start till they are YA, which I have tweeked so it's 30 days, instead of the normal 20.

Redphobia

10th Jan 2010, 07:06 AM

Actually, i think sim teens have it the easiest.
They really don't have to do homework (go to school and work on late homework)
and they can do a lot of stuff adults can do. Although i have never given them jobs since the parents supply the money.
teen relationships for me are simple. I usually have a certain sim to become popular, while there other sibling is the more skill focused sim. Which is probably why I haven't complained about teens. And I completely agree with the cops busting you for breaking curfew, I can never get away with that

J. M. Pescado

10th Jan 2010, 07:36 AM

LOL--I find the way teens are treated in Sims3 to be completely realistic as that was what it was like for me as a teen. I was in a hellish college prep high school and barely had time to sleep. I saw my friends only in school. There was no time outside of school.That's the way it SHOULD be. Do you WANT a bunch of bratty, annoying kids running amok?

It made me wonder if this game is designed by the same killjoys who want to make USA public schools operate year-round and 8 hours a day.ABSOLUTELY! Then we would NOT HAVE TO SEE THEM. Just look at how annoying they are constantly 12ing all over the Internets. Is that what you really want? Better to stick them in school and make sure they're too busy to be annoying. When you're older and are stuck with your own annoying 12, perhaps you will understand why. Consider this: If you think they shouldn't be in school that long, why are they still SO STUPID? Clearly they do not spend ENOUGH time in school!

The adults in Sims3 don't fare any better as far as a nightlife is concerned. If you try to have a conversation with any adult sim past 7:30 pm they are either starving or drowsy.Ah, yes, that's the motive railroad for you. There's actually a piece of code in the game that produces this railroad effect, and the numbers used don't actually match what sims normally experience. Which is why they seem to always need to pee.

chyrun

10th Jan 2010, 01:15 PM

That's the way it SHOULD be. Stupid 12s NEED to be kept busy, otherwise they go and start huffing paint thinner and spraypainting walls. Haven't you seen what happens when you let them have free time in REAL life? They go and annoy everyone by 12ing all over the Internets! Is that what we want? HELL NO! Vile little hooligans NEED their oppression.

I have to agree with you :D Except in my country they don't 12 on the internets, they 12 on the streets which is far more annoying. 12s should simply be locked away forever. :P

ocgforme

10th Jan 2010, 01:41 PM

I don't give my teen sims jobs, period. It's too bloody annoying.

As for their social needs, MOST of the time it's perfectly easy just to keep the homework up, let the teen socialize while at school, and work on skilling up in their free time.

As for real life, I have two teenage boys. I tell them that society WILL see them as troublemakers, so they have to be doubly careful NOT to give that impression, though I certainly don't expect sainthood. But I'm also arguing AGAINST my 17yo getting a job right now because to me his schoolwork comes first. Right now, we're paying his ticket, and he should take maximum advantage of that while he can. I've DONE the work/parenting/school juggle and it is a nightmare.

summersong86

11th Jan 2010, 11:46 AM

Pescado, when my own kid turns 12, I'll be 50. So, I'll probably be menopausal. That means there will be a pre-teen female and a menopausal female under the same roof! :blink: :wtf: My poor husband! He'll probably want to stick us both in boarding school. :lol:

The reason kids seem stupid is because the schools suck the love of learning right out of them and turn it into a boring desk job. And that's for the best case scenario of a good school in a good area. The worst case scenario is when the school is full of drugs and gangs and about as safe and hospitable as prison. That would be the kind I attended prior to making it into that college-prep oriented high school I mentioned. As annoying as the 12's may be, in all fairness I have to say it's still the adults who make the world and the kids have no choice but to find their way in it, according to the rules the adults set and the circumstances the adults create. So behind every brat is an adult or several adults not doing their job. To a point, though. Even kids need to have that epiphany where they realize even really good, really legitimate excuses won't carry them any further and they either straighten up and fly right...or they don't. Consequences are a bitch we all have to contend with sooner or later.

So, in this respect, I'm not so sure Sims3 is really all that unfair to teens in a way that real life is not. It does railroad them into circumstances they can't really change too much, and locks them into a series of goals--choices--consequences and doesn't give them much time to go through that series without ending up exhausted, stressed and struggling for a social life. Really, those are the teen years in a nutshell! Which explains why us old farts are so glad to have it behind us and most of us wouldn't relive those years even if it does mean getting back some looks that faded out. And it also explains why the teen stage of sims isn't much fun, either.

Anyway, I was at my best looking in my 30's--give me THAT era back. Keep those teen years, ugh. Maybe the teens are annoying because that time of life is so freaking effed up! You're smart enough to see the system is broken, smart enough to figure out how to fix it but lacking knowlege and perspective to know for sure, and powerless to do anything about it all anyway. By the time you do get the power to change things, you forget what the heck it is you wanted to change and why, because the system has crushed you under its feet into a shell of the human being you were supposed to be! Well, that's my take on it, anyway. :D

aeval99

12th Jan 2010, 08:04 PM

I never have my teens get jobs, they just don't have the time for it. They don't tend to socialize outside of the friends they bring home from school and their families. Actually, being a teen in my game really sucks. Their life consists of going to school, skilling and look after their younger siblings, with the occasional spa day or movie thrown in here and there.

I had much more fun when I was a teen, even if I did have a part-time job. Of course I was a bit of a hellion too.

summersong86

12th Jan 2010, 08:36 PM

That IS a problem--there's really only the stupid rabbit hole spa as a hangout place where a sim can get "de-stressed". There ought to at least be a mall rabbit hole, too. Or something else beside Day Spa which really isn't some place teens, at least not teen boys, so far as I have ever seen, would go to just chill out. The movie theater is okay but too bad it's not a multi-plex with shows all day long. I do hope the next expansion pack also gives us something more of a night life.

Playing as Jon Lessen, I did have him do an autograph session and it was around 2 a.m. Guess who showed up to worship John and get his autograph? Bob Newbie! I think Dallas Shadow showed up, too, but a bit earlier. So I guess the teens do sneak out sometimes to meet their rock gods. Big Whoop!

twallan

12th Jan 2010, 08:53 PM

Playing as Jon Lessen, I did have him do an autograph session and it was around 2 a.m. Guess who showed up to worship John and get his autograph? Bob Newbie! I think Dallas Shadow showed up, too, but a bit earlier. So I guess the teens do sneak out sometimes to meet their rock gods. Big Whoop!

Actually, inactive sims are not constrained by the Teen Curfew hours. Inactive teens can gallivant all night long if they so choose.

On the other hand, the Child Curfew is enforced on all children, active or inactive.

Cheers. :)

jazzem

13th Jan 2010, 03:50 AM

Hey when i was a teenager i wanted to grow up so i could have all the power! Then a grew up and i have the power... and the rent, and the phone bill, and the food bill.....

HAHA anywhos. I have to say i COMPLETELY agree with Summersong, behind every brat is at least one adult that didn't do their job properly, and no, that does not mean getting them into that perfect preschool, that means (as a parent at least) spending that time and setting those boundrys!

I also feel sorry for my hubby, as we have 3 girls, so once they hit puberty, he will have FOUR women around em all PMSing at the same time (and if our girls take after me it will be a warzone) he SAYS hes gonna build himself a man-shed in the back yard but i say no way in HADES is he leaving ME at home on my own with 3 teens!!!!!

so off topic hahahaha how on earth did a discussion on sims turn into a debate on parenting and 12's not being occupied enough!!!!

summersong86

13th Jan 2010, 04:24 AM

Jazzem, your husband can always get himself a "man-cave". You'll know which room it is because it will have the biggest tv in the house in it, lol. Honestly from what I have found, talking to friends who have more guys in the house than girls, it's not really that peaceful to have lots of boys, either.

Thanks for the info, Twallan. I haven't yet played a child sim in Sims3. Children in Sims2 and even toddlers seem to have had a fairly rich and full life. And of course with hacked objects there was added fun. I used to like to get rideable farm animals for the little ones to ride and build up athletic skill.

Comparing teens between Sims2 and Sims3, I had a teen Britney Spears and teen Kevin Federline in my Sims2 town and had a funny storyline going on for them. But I couldn't seem to duplicate that level of intricacy for my storyline with Sim3 teens Clementine and Bob Newbie. I seem to find that they have probably the same amount of activities as Brit and Kev had within the house open to them, but despite having about the same number and variety of activities they can engage in, the activities seem to devour the game clock faster so that they can do only one activity before I have to send Bob home to his parents. I wonder if this is actually true or just my mistaken perception. It's been awhile since I have played teens in either game so my perceptions may be off. But I do know I did my level best to repeat the funny relationship that Brit and Kev had, but I just couldn't quite get Clem and Bob to be as fun to watch together. I'm sure that will come with more expansion packs, though.

I still have Brit and Kev available to me. I just haven't been in a Sims2 mood of late but at some point soon I will revisit my town and play with an eye toward comparing the two games more.

What I DO like about teens in Sims3, at least with the ones I've seen or made for myself so far, is that they age up in looks more gracefully than their sims2 counterparts did. If I make a pretty teen in Sims3, chances are if I age progress her in CAS to check her out as a young adult, I'll be pleased with the results. Same thing with going backwards from YA to Teen in CAS. That seems to be true with the boys as well. With Sims2, I was usually in for some unpleasant surprises checking out a sim's appearance in age progression or regression in CAS.

I do also like that now you can choose how a student spends their time in school. I like the option of being able to work hard or goof off. When I went back to play my teens in Sims2, I missed that. They just went to school and there was no sense of how they were progressing in their day, let alone a way to have a say in it.

unlikely

13th Jan 2010, 01:54 PM

The curfew makes for some weird storylines, though. A sim of mine had finally built up her relationship with this girl high enough to attempt a first kiss, but they could only meet at night because the girl had a part-time job. By the time they would get to the same place together, after having a chat and when ABOUT to initiate the kiss, the police would come and take my sim away for being out past curfew. This happened at least 3 nights in a row and by the time the weekend came around, the love-interest girl had aged up to YA and their budding relationship was not to be! Instead, when my sim aged up she immediately got pregnant from a guy she never spoke to again...

si_co_bee

13th Jan 2010, 03:37 PM

get the NRaas education mod... it allows for homeschooling, aka no school.

ok i looked that up and cant find it..... it sounds like something i wanna have!!

and as for teens being repressed.... it doesnt end just when you get out of your parents home. if u try to get a job as a teen and your not in school still they just look at you like your an alcoholic party beast, which i am quite the opposite..... death to the immature teens who ONLY think about alcohol and partys and not bout the future....

and as for not letting your teen work... i can only say this: it makes it more difficult to get a job later! i didnt get many jobs because when they asked me why i didnt get a job in high school i had to say my parents wouldnt allow it and they all looked at me like "YEAH RIGHT!! ALCOHOLIC PARTY BEAST" ugh its so degrading....

twallan

13th Jan 2010, 05:25 PM

ok i looked that up and cant find it..... it sounds like something i wanna have!!

My mods are hosted at the site linked in my signature.

Cheers. :)

summersong86

13th Jan 2010, 07:18 PM

The curfew makes for some weird storylines, though.the love-interest girl had aged up to YA and their budding relationship was not to be! Instead, when my sim aged up she immediately got pregnant from a guy she never spoke to again... :cry: Yeah, that sort of ugliness happened to one of my sims when she was courting a guy I'd custom made for her. He got partnered to some sim who didn't even ever seem to actually exist--I never saw her anywhere. In a fit of spite I turned off storyline progression and never permitted it to ruin my plans again. I'm still very stuck in the control freak Sims2 environment. It's not been easy for me to let go, especially when the EA brand of story progression seems to put in pointless stupid couplings and pregnancies just for the sake of keeping the town populated. I prefer to control the population myself by just adding sims. Better yet, I have everything turned off, aging, story progression and I'm playing Sims2 style and building each household up to approximately equal points. At some point, like a time bomb, I'll re-engage aging and story progression just long enough to let some couples have babies and develop a little. Then it all goes back off again until I'm darned good and ready to permit the next stage of life to occur. And I'm keeping a backup of my "frozen" town just in case I don't like what story progression and aging do. I'm a complete tyrant, I know it.

twallan

13th Jan 2010, 07:34 PM

In a fit of spite I turned off storyline progression and never permitted it to ruin my plans again.

I played in a similar manner... Turned EA Story Progression off as soon as I found it simply didn't work. After that I choose to start switching households and control everyone in town.

My primary 'hood runs on Epic life-span, so I can leave the Aging enabled, but still have time to visit and play all the interesting families.

----

Once StoryProgression mod was up and running though, I simply turned off pregnancies, and let my mod handle the progression.

I still run on Epic, and still micromanage a number of the families in town... But it can be fun to sit back and watch the sims live their own lives, and make their own decisions.

Cheers. :)

jazzem

13th Jan 2010, 08:03 PM

you can "break couple up" (build up your relationship then ask them to break up with sim x) although i too wish that EA story progression thing was better and made more sense... Awesomemods not working for me :(

Purity4

13th Jan 2010, 08:54 PM

sakrayami

15th Jan 2010, 09:39 PM

Lol, i learned a lot from reading this thread. :D And specially Summersong had some good points. I am glad i didn't have a dad like Pescado, i would definately grow up to be a rebel, painting trains and buildings in the nighttime. Hehe. I might try the story progression off too, and simply do not give the teens jobs, just ignore it. It's a waste of time anyway, i want them to build up some few skills, go fishing, do gardenwork and learn how to cook. :)

J. M. Pescado

16th Jan 2010, 04:33 AM

You can't play in the mud anymore. Don't you know, your kids could pick up bacteria and parasites.But that's the entire point! Bacteria and parasites are good for 'em, it toughens them up and builds up their immune systems. Sure, a few of them might die, but that's only because they were weak defectives and had it coming. It's good for the gene pool!

summersong86

16th Jan 2010, 06:01 AM

But that's the entire point! Bacteria and parasites are good for 'em, it toughens them up and builds up their immune systems. Sure, a few of them might die, but that's only because they were weak defectives and had it coming. It's good for the gene pool!LOL, yes, actually some exposure to bacteria is good. Parasites--well, not too sure about them. I had just typed but erased a paragraph of observations made on my mother's upbringing in third world post-war conditions but that was too far off topic to keep. And I thought the discussion about foot-long parasitical worms might gross too many people out. :P Suffice it to say, I kind of prefer my life of moderation and balance--yes to SOME bacteria, a big NO to the parasites! :lol: Now as for the gene pool, theoretically I come from excellent stock, as both my father's side and mother's side experienced harsh culling out of weaker children. But somehow the idea that generations of weaker babies died so that my family's gene pool would culminate in the production of the glory of me is just impossible to comtemplate with a straight face. :lol: And if you see my cousins, ahh well, let's just say Darwin would be doing this: :faceslap:

Getting back somewhat on topic, I definitely am very tempted to try a story progression mod. I've been looking for some time at the one developed by Twallan. I'm just a bit hesitant though to even install the modding framework. I want to see what the next EP and round of patches brings and see if those throw off the hard-won stability people are just starting to enjoy after the last round we just endured.

I'm not unhappy playing the game the way it is now, but it would indeed be interesting to see what an unborked story progression would add to the gameplay. All this talk of teens is making me want to create some teen characters in the near future. Even with the limitations on teens I was really enjoying my Clemmie. The fact that the game was constantly trying to railroad her into the life of a cloistered nun was actually part of the fun and charm of playing her character. I always got a strange sense of satisfaction in blatantly ignoring all the little challenges she was getting issued and still finding ways of making her an A-student anyway.

SuicidiaParasidia

16th Jan 2010, 09:58 AM

You can't play in the mud anymore. Don't you know, your kids could pick up bacteria and parasites. If you do, you must douse them from head to toe in Purell sanitizer afterwards or you're a bad parent. Seriously, I ended my subscription to one parenting magazine because it had a photo of celebrity babies at the park or in other activities where they pointed out safety and health hazards with all these captions underneath that said stuff like "Well now we hope so and so will be a good mom and make sure she cleans the kids hands with santizer after they are finished with the jungle gym." And so many parents really take that sort of thing to heart. Amazing and sad. My husband works in the publishing business on the tech support side and he tells me with most of these publications the writers and editors just pull this stuff out of their butts to make deadline anyway. Some rare few really do research and put thought into what they write. But the vast majority of crap we get exposed to in the media and incorporate into our psyche is stuff someone under a deadline simply pulled out of their butt. Kind of like Sims do with monkey wrenches, automobiles and such! We are a society that lives and dies by what stressed out unthinking people pull out of their butts!

i...i ate worms, before. ):
*still alive and parasite free* and like pescado said, bacteria is good for your immune system. if kids werent exposed to anything, a cold could KO them later in life.

id rather they die when theyre babies with less suffering than as adults who know what theyd be missing out on. ):
but agree. the media is fulla shit. :D

and late reply is late, but id like to add to your statement of: I'm not unhappy playing the game the way it is now, but it would indeed be interesting to see what an unborked story progression would add to the gameplay.

... i actually dont seem to have any fun with babies through teens. all thats really left to teens is collecting, befriending, and...thats about it. unless theres something i dont know about. i usually just use that stage to prepare them for adulthood ( cooking skill is a MUST--no burning the %$&@#*(^&$ house down, god damnit! ). i probably push them harder than the game does, since they have 5 days of school and 2 free days.... which is boooooooriiiing. epic boredom, even. school sucks up all the time i would usually use to have them go out and socialize in interesting ways, and when they come home theyre too tired/bored to do anything useful. /rant

unborked story progression is a wonderful idea. i just wish EA knew this, too.

summersong86

20th Jan 2010, 11:21 PM

Well I don't know, SuicidiaParasidia, I found Clemmie to be the MOST fun character in my household to play. Perhaps part of it is I was playing that household with my 5 year old watching and she, being a kid herself, identified and cheered along Clemmie and she suggested things for Clemmie to do. Playing from an adult's perspective, I wouldn't have thought of a teen character as interesting on my own, but with a kid next to me making suggestions, Clemmie became a central character while I had that household (it's still around but in limbo because it got corrupted AND because it was an old pre-patch, pre WA save format).

She could do pretty much what the adults in the house do. Sex of course, is out of the question, but she could still have her puppy love crush on Bob Newbie Jr. That was very cute and charming to play out, actually. And I don't know, I remember Clemmie doing a lot with her time. School and homework did eat into her activities a lot, but she did still get out into the community and have some fun. She was able to make only a handful of friendships, though, compared to the adults who, even if they work can end up befriending half the town.

Well we heard already from one teen, the OP, about how frustrating teens are to play in this game. It would be lovely to hear from more people actually in that age range or younger and get their thoughts on playing the teen stage. They might have ideas and be doing things with their characters a lot of us adults are overlooking.

I'm sorry there was more I intended to say when I sat down to make this post but there is the oddest sound coming from my computer. It's driving me to distraction. I hope the danged thing isn't ready to break on me again.

J. M. Pescado

21st Jan 2010, 01:17 AM

unborked story progression is a wonderful idea. i just wish EA knew this, too.They don't. Too bad you don't have AWESOMEMOD, because you SUCK TOO MUCH, no?

jonha

21st Jan 2010, 01:24 AM

Also, jonha has uploaded one to MTS, but I don't think it's been updated recently.

There is a version for 1.8 and WA 2.3. I don't think a more recent version is necessary. :wtf:

ucaree

22nd Jan 2010, 12:19 AM

That's the way it SHOULD be. Do you WANT a bunch of bratty, annoying kids running amok?

ABSOLUTELY! Then we would NOT HAVE TO SEE THEM. Just look at how annoying they are constantly 12ing all over the Internets. Is that what you really want? Better to stick them in school and make sure they're too busy to be annoying. When you're older and are stuck with your own annoying 12, perhaps you will understand why. Consider this: If you think they shouldn't be in school that long, why are they still SO STUPID? Clearly they do not spend ENOUGH time in school!

Ah, yes, that's the motive railroad for you. There's actually a piece of code in the game that produces this railroad effect, and the numbers used don't actually match what sims normally experience. Which is why they seem to always need to pee.

The entire post made me laugh because it's all so true. In regards to TS3, it's all about choice. Not all sim teens have to work, go to school or obey curfew. However if you choose to fail or stay out late then there will be negative consequence (just like in real life, kids seem to forget there's also curfews in real life lol). Most of my sim teens do not have a job and spend their free time building their skills for their future career. And my teen sims always seem to be rather popular. I always make sure everyday they go to school that they "talk to their friends" by the time they're adults they usually have 5-10 friends/best friends.

simbalena

22nd Jan 2010, 12:46 AM

I would prefer it if the curfew was more realistic, e.g. the police only come for the teen if someone sees them out past curfew, and the teen can run and hide from the police.

J. M. Pescado

22nd Jan 2010, 12:49 AM

That's in AwesomeMod. Too bad you DON'T HAVE IT, because YOU SUCK.

simbalena

22nd Jan 2010, 01:05 AM

Yes, I think you might be right :(

mangaroo

22nd Jan 2010, 01:15 AM

Mr. Pescado, please stop flirting with everyone.

J. M. Pescado

22nd Jan 2010, 01:35 AM

I do not flirt. I have the Unflirty trait.

CharmingFirewaller

22nd Jan 2010, 01:55 AM

Mr. Pescado, please stop flirting with everyone.

LOL... :rofl:

simbalena

22nd Jan 2010, 02:03 AM

I like his flirting :)

CharmingFirewaller

22nd Jan 2010, 02:21 AM

I like his flirting :)

You vixen! :lol:

ZippyZX3

30th Jan 2010, 03:02 AM

I deleted my school, Kids have more time to do things now.

SuicidiaParasidia

30th Jan 2010, 05:09 AM

They don't. Too bad you don't have AWESOMEMOD, because you SUCK TOO MUCH, no?

wow, late reply is late. ( on my part. )

no. but you totally wish i did suck, dont you? ;)

Well I don't know, SuicidiaParasidia, I found Clemmie to be the MOST fun character in my household to play. Perhaps part of it is I was playing that household with my 5 year old watching and she, being a kid herself, identified and cheered along Clemmie and she suggested things for Clemmie to do. Playing from an adult's perspective, I wouldn't have thought of a teen character as interesting on my own, but with a kid next to me making suggestions, Clemmie became a central character while I had that household (it's still around but in limbo because it got corrupted AND because it was an old pre-patch, pre WA save format).

sadly i do not have my own 5 year old and i have the feeling that my neighbors would object to the spontaneous "borrowing" of such a child. so i wouldnt know as far as that goes.

She could do pretty much what the adults in the house do. Sex of course, is out of the question, but she could still have her puppy love crush on Bob Newbie Jr. That was very cute and charming to play out, actually. And I don't know, I remember Clemmie doing a lot with her time. School and homework did eat into her activities a lot, but she did still get out into the community and have some fun. She was able to make only a handful of friendships, though, compared to the adults who, even if they work can end up befriending half the town.

except stay out after dark, reap the benefits of certain traits ( limiting. ), and of course, woohoo. i might be more romantically inclined if teens could 'confess attraction' to adults without a mod, too... seems highly unrealistic that teens would be stuck with other teens and/or never get it on. ( and since the sims is supposed to be simulating RL, ha ha, well...yes. unrealistic. )

Well we heard already from one teen, the OP, about how frustrating teens are to play in this game. It would be lovely to hear from more people actually in that age range or younger and get their thoughts on playing the teen stage. They might have ideas and be doing things with their characters a lot of us adults are overlooking.

I'm sorry there was more I intended to say when I sat down to make this post but there is the oddest sound coming from my computer. It's driving me to distraction. I hope the danged thing isn't ready to break on me again.

technically i am barely out of my teens. :P but even as a teen i was nowhere near as outgoing or friendly as a teen would need to be to go out and live life at that stage. so again, i wouldnt really know. but ive heard stories...as have we all.
*goes to chug nyquil* rassin frassin cold/fever.

kaylasims3xox

23rd Jun 2010, 11:57 PM

well my sims game that im playing right now is modded thanks to this website (:
my teen sim and her fiance live at home with her toddler brother and their twin daughters. the mom of my sim died. therefore, the teens are the oldest in the house. they have no adults around at all, except for when the ghost of my sims mom comes in for a visit at night or when someone like zelda mae stops by
about the freedom thing, the lack of adults gives my sims a lot of freedom, but they have to get a babysitter all the time
my sim recently skipped school because i wanted her to have a home birth and i thought that the baby was due that day
however, i agree that they dont have freedom. the cops sit outside their house :p :P :bunny: :llama: :cry: :!: :mod:

tjstreak

24th Jun 2010, 01:20 AM

Well, your kids don't HAVE to go to school or do their homework. That's a choice. Of course, there are consequences for making certain choices.

In my real community, we generally have two groups of kids. The first group comes from middle class families and generally aspire to higher education, good jobs and the like. (In short, they buy all of the B.S. which is given to them by misguided school guidance counsellors). These kids go to school, then football practice, band, private lessons (for whatever) before they spend hours completing their homework. 99% of this stuff has absolutely zero relevance for anything they will ever do in their lives, while they are not taught stuff which might be truly useful for them.

Then there is the other group of kids. Those who are disruptive in class, never do their homework, and will cut class for no reason at all. Our community also has the highest teen pregnancy rate in the State. They do not aspire for a college education and may spend the rest of their lives working for McDonalds while aspiring to move up to being a clerk at WalMart.

Which group of kids live happier lives? Probably the second. (I was in the first group and largely view my high school and college years as a waste of time and money.)

There may be definite advantages for you kids to be cutting class, and not doing their homework. They might be better off fishing, socializing with other sims, collecting stuff and otherwise trying to maximize their happiness. The main downside seems to be that they might pick up a negative trait or two. Little ones, of course, might be hauled off by the evil social worker. (Do social workers automatically have the evil trait? If not, they should! "Look, I just took your kids away! Ha! Ha! Now Suffer!")

There is a lifetime reward which allows you to change negative traits. (Or you can use a cheat!) So are you better off going to school and being a good drone, or building up a bunch of lifetime happiness and simply buying off the bad traits?

Plus, a lot of the homework seems to be like some of the term papers and the like that we saw in Sims 2 University -- completely useles!. Once you have an "A" in a class, the homework really does not help you and not doing it really does not hurt you. In fact, if you take advantage of an opportunity or two, you easily can raise a "C" to an "A" So cut a few classes and make it up by cleaning up some bug cages.

The trouble it, the game sometime makes being bad very hard to do. I had a kid I had distined to be a teen delinquent. I gave him a leather jacket, a mustache, piercings and a tattoo (one of the old style). I would have given him a motorcycle if the family had the money. But he still graduated with an "A," despite my efforts to the contrary!

One of the most fascinating aspects of the Sims is that they are a reflection of our own values and personalities.

Celebriton

24th Jun 2010, 04:08 AM

Teens in Sims 3 have no free-time, they live in a dictatorship. :wtf: They are supposed to work right after school, even in weekends. Teens have no time for girlfriend/boyfriend, they have to do lessons, work, eat and sleep. On top of that, they can't stay out too long, the police is coming after them treating them like criminals driving them home in a police car. Where a yelling mom or dad is waiting to act even more like dictators.

They also get extra tasks from school, which is ridicilous. I know i can ignore it, but usually when i play with teens i give them the job where they can sleep while working. :) And i use "testingcheatsenabled true" to keep their needs up - else they won't reach do to do the homework or gain skills. I know there must be some hacks somewhere where teens can have some freetime, and stay out late. But i am not sure if i will use it untill i am sure it does not crash my game. Any advices for a "safe" mod to use, so my teens can be out later and get out of this dictatorship? :mod:

What kind of question do you ask?

Everybody do the samething as you discribe it in East Asia. This is normal, what do you hope for teenager and children, more time to play???

This is for their future too, if they want to recieve better life in the future, higher salary up to USD 10-20 higher than average workers a month, etc........they need study harder and no time for playing. :p

CormorantEnt

24th Jun 2010, 04:53 AM

Which group of kids live happier lives? Probably the second. (I was in the first group and largely view my high school and college years as a waste of time and money.)

My family has had to deal with both extremes. I would not say that either extreme by itself will bring happiness to anyone.

No matter how booksmart someone is; if they don't have common sense, then they're never going to be happy. There will always be that one swindler who gets them and crushes their dreams.

And living the opposite way is nice for a while - until your closest associates all become criminals and end up in jail and you can't afford your own bills and medical needs; and your kids turn to crime to not starve.

Knowing what Higher Being or higher cause you have wrapped your life around, and that you're headed in a direction beneficial to that, will bring a lot more sense of resolve to someone than either extreme of the economic or educational ladder.

I realize the Sims has never been adequate for exploring that. However, I find that those who do live this way tend to become more balanced in terms of social development versus academic development.

Truly beneficial education is also at least 70% self-taught or done through self-research. This is difficult for the modern education system to adapt to, as it is built entirely on the Statist assumption that central planning always knows best.

Yet, I see your point. I went to Lansing Community and to Ferris. In terms of content covered in the academia, LCC was probably more comprehensive most of the time. Overall, not much difference.

However, Ferris was far more organized. Plus, the student body living on campus was dependent on each other for a lot of things. Therefore, there was an environment present that encouraged limited socialization and...dare I say it...clique alliances.

At LCC, it was an every-man-for-himself mentality. The guidance counselors at both colleges, I've found, were less-than-reliable for helping me out. I learned a lot more about how to apply my education through trial and error than I ever did from their suggestions. It's not to say they were useless, just not adequate.

Concerning Sims, I tend to agree with you that teenage Sims should not be under so much demand. In Nightlife, I usually use the Education Adjuster to set their school as "no school." I force them to have As and argue that they were home schooled.

That way, I can use them as actors and actually get something done with them. I just use money cheats all the time as well, because if we can't follow them to work, jobs are meaningless.

I'm still very stuck in the control freak Sims2 environment.

Sounds like those are things I'll have to keep in mind once I have a computer than can handle Sims 3. I would like to be able to use it for storyboarding, but much like you, I don't think I could ever leave behind Sims 2 and its absolute control.

Mobility and environment detail are things I thirst for; but to forfeit total control is to forfeit what the game would founded upon. Sims 2 anatomy may have its flaws, and the engine may be broken in many ways, but I'll hang on to it even after I can support Sims 3. Why? Because like you, I LOVE being in control!

Sims 3, from what I'm reading, is too much like Spore. And I have no use for Spore.

Ranissa

24th Jun 2010, 05:35 AM

Sims 3, from what I'm reading, is too much like Spore. And I have no use for Spore.

What? You lost me. I exert complete control over my Sims in 3 at all times. Granted, I use mods but the Sims I care about do little without my okay.

Otherwise, I think being a kid is like being an adult: you get out of the experience what you're willing and able to put into it. I spent my teen years chained to the yoke of college-prep and then spent my extra-long college years learning how to have fun. Now that I'm an adult with a family of my own, I'm just now learning how to do everything in moderation, from enjoying my son and husband, friends and relatives to going back to school for an actual career.

In the Sims, my teenagers get to an A and then do the things they want to do. I don't give them jobs because they don't get to move out with their money so what's the point?

As an example, I have a teen whose LTW is to be an author. He's already 4 points into the writing skill with two published works under his belt. He also has a committed girlfriend, likes to do the laundry for his mom, helps with his three younger siblings and is the darling of his girlfriend's family. He's holding out for the lifetime reward for writing but is already sitting on 10k points. I'm pretty happy with him! Hee.

J. M. Pescado

24th Jun 2010, 11:47 AM

The key to understanding life is the realization that it is never, at any point in your life, ever a good plan to act your age. If it's an age-appropriate thing to be doing, it's probably the wrong thing to be doing. If I conducted myself in an age-appropriate manner, I would be dead! It is, however, important to always remember what is best in life: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women.

tjstreak

24th Jun 2010, 02:15 PM

Concerning Sims, I tend to agree with you that teenage Sims should not be under so much demand. In Nightlife, I usually use the Education Adjuster to set their school as "no school." I force them to have As and argue that they were home schooled.

Actually, this was not my point. With the Sims, you can experiment. You can have one good kid who goes to school, does his homework, graduates, gets a job, has a family, retires and dies.

Or, you can have a bad kid, who cuts class, doesn't do his homework and does not follow the program.

Or better yet, you can have both in the same family.

One of the strange lessons of the Sims is that the well trodden route is not the best. Getting and remaining in a ho hum career for your life is not the route to either wealth or happiness. It's the sims who travel a different path, who go into business for themselves (e.g. gardening, fishing, writing, painting, adventuring, etc) who do the best.

So the problem may not be too much homework or too many demands from a career. The problem may be the decision to let other people (teachers, bosses and the like) to dictate how you will live your life.

Yes, the Sims does have important life lessons.

Sims_Lover

24th Jun 2010, 03:30 PM

I find the teens very boring. I usually just age them to young adults A.S.A.P. LOL

CormorantEnt

24th Jun 2010, 06:48 PM

Actually, this was not my point.

Thanks for clarifying. That makes a lot more sense.

Vanito

24th Jun 2010, 10:59 PM

My child sims dont go to school because they dont learn much there anyhow. Rabbotholes are boring.

Aya_Alexa

24th Jun 2010, 11:07 PM

all my kids are all school and no play, lol i don't know why. i guess i don't want them staying home since its really stressful for me tending to their needs.

CleoSombra

25th Jun 2010, 02:23 AM

Actually, this was not my point. With the Sims, you can experiment. You can have one good kid who goes to school, does his homework, graduates, gets a job, has a family, retires and dies.

Or, you can have a bad kid, who cuts class, doesn't do his homework and does not follow the program.

Or better yet, you can have both in the same family.

One of the strange lessons of the Sims is that the well trodden route is not the best. Getting and remaining in a ho hum career for your life is not the route to either wealth or happiness. It's the sims who travel a different path, who go into business for themselves (e.g. gardening, fishing, writing, painting, adventuring, etc) who do the best.

So the problem may not be too much homework or too many demands from a career. The problem may be the decision to let other people (teachers, bosses and the like) to dictate how you will live your life.

Yes, the Sims does have important life lessons.

In the real world, you can't make a living off of 10 plants.

In the sims, you can. Outstanding and perfect plants can be 10-15 simoleons a pop and if you harvest 10 a day, that's 150 dollars. That's about the same as a day of work in a career.

In the Sims, regardless of what your book is about, you WILL get some royalties. Regardless of what your name/notoriety is, your painting WILL sell for soemthing. That's not true in the real world.

If a sim wants to join the science career or the education career and they're happy doing it, and they want to make friends with their coworkers and they do, and they want to get a promotion and they do, I say they're living happy lives. So what if they are taking a mainstream career?

J. M. Pescado

25th Jun 2010, 06:07 AM

In the real world, you can't make a living off of 10 plants.You can, but it's a bit more challenging, since you have to avoid being busted by the Feds.

Shoosh Malooka

25th Jun 2010, 07:40 AM

OP Sakrayami: I understand, TS3 seems like a way to do things you can't do in rl yet has these limitations - no alchohol only juice, no partying, no teen woohoo or marriage or driving, and no experimental substances. But your sim doesn't need a job because there are no separate accounts afaik. But if you are roleplaying them as working teens then cheat away or accept that taking honors classes and having a job that pays well ( without asking for a degree ) and having a life is very difficult / impossible. You can get away if you use reward items like the mood master thing, iron bladder, and dirt resistant to cut down time if it doesn't bother you to have your sim never use the toilet or shower.

Just so you know, everyone, adults and children, has curfew. Get AwesomeMod so that police aren't psychic and won't send you home unless the see you. And last is this: When you get around the age of 24 you will realize that teens are a bunch of whiney, think everyone should respect them yet they don't have to respect anyone, shop at Hot Topic, think crime and drugs are cool, selfish little brats. Teens should be herded like cattle and branded numbers on their rears so the cops can keep track of them, because they deserve it for their appalling attitude and sense of entitlement.

summersong86

25th Jun 2010, 04:56 PM

You can, but it's a bit more challenging, since you have to avoid being busted by the Feds. :rofl:

When you get around the age of 24 you will realize that teens are a bunch of whiney, think everyone should respect them yet they don't have to respect anyone, shop at Hot Topic, think crime and drugs are cool, selfish little brats. Teens should be herded like cattle and branded numbers on their rears so the cops can keep track of them, because they deserve it for their appalling attitude and sense of entitlement.
Today 01:07 AM

Funny, that's what we 40-somethings say about people in their early 20's. :lol: :Pint:

J. M. Pescado

25th Jun 2010, 05:19 PM

The rule is that those DAMN KIDS are all like that. As you get older, the age it takes before someone stops being THOSE DAMN KIDS gets larger.

Ranissa

25th Jun 2010, 05:24 PM

The rule is that those DAMN KIDS are all like that. As you get older, the age it takes before someone stops being THOSE DAMN KIDS gets larger.

I agree with Pescado. Now the interwebs must explode.

tjstreak

25th Jun 2010, 05:27 PM

In the real world, you can't make a living off of 10 plants.

In the game you can. Try life fruit farming and have an omniplant which you feed expensive books.

At one point I had one agricultural sim who would sell her produce for about 20,000 simoleons a week!

In the Sims, regardless of what your book is about, you WILL get some royalties. Regardless of what your name/notoriety is, your painting WILL sell for soemthing. That's not true in the real world. .

I see the gardening, fishing, book writing, painting, etc. etc. as being surrogates for private enterprise. This is particularly true with inventing.

The real money, however, is in heavy industry (in Sims terms, making supernovium) I had one sim make over 1 million simoleons in pretty short order.

One of the aspects of the sims game is that it really does not allow for the possibility of failure. Every politician, if they stick around long enough, will become Leader of the Free Wold. Every business person will become the CEO of a megacorporation. Every musician will become a rock star. Every military grunt will eventually become an astronaght. All your sim has to do is go to work everyday and eventually he/she will succeed.

Anyone who has owned a business in the real world knows that failure is a real possibility. In fact, 95% of businesses fail within the first five years. (Or more accurately, the money from their small business loans run out by this time, and they no longer can claim losses from their business on their tax returns to offset other income.) People get fired all the time, often for no reason at all.

The other side is that most sims, even at the top of their careers do not make a lot of money. Most cannot buy a nice house without using cheats, or even a fancy car. One has to be creative to get rich.

J. M. Pescado

25th Jun 2010, 05:33 PM

The real money, however, is in heavy industry (in Sims terms, making supernovium) I had one sim make over 1 million simoleons in pretty short order.If you don't have the fix in AwesomeMod, compendium is the way to go: Since every time you recompend a compendium, it gains percentage value, you get runaway exponential growth VERY quickly and will easily blow out int32 within a hundred moves, and int64 will overload in a hundred more. That's quadrillions of bucks.

Anyone who has owned a business in the real world knows that failure is a real possibility. In fact, 95% of businesses fail within the first five years.The goal of a small business is to sell it to some bigger sucker before they realize that your business has no profit model. The business fails if you can't find a sucker.

The other side is that most sims, even at the top of their careers do not make a lot of money. Most cannot buy a nice house without using cheats, or even a fancy car. One has to be creative to get rich.You're kidding, right?

NekoCat

25th Jun 2010, 07:02 PM

There was a mod for Sims2 (I can't remember where I got it - here or somewhere else) that had a boarding school. You loaded the yuppy larvae into a bus on Monday morning and it returned them on Friday. :anime: You only had to "play" them on Saturday and Sunday. Hows that for a solution to the curfew? Ha, ha, you could send them to the Police Station rabbithole and pretend they're in juvie...

FlyingEvil

25th Jun 2010, 08:07 PM

Dear Santa, for Xmas I wish for a teen expansion for my Sims 3 game, I also wish for them nifty Star Trek sporks, but we all know you're Chinese (all my gift says their made in China) and only eat with chopsticks, so no sporks for me... Anyway, I want a teen expansion with graffiti skill and pimples. And maybe some "steal my moms car" and shoplift interactions. Thank you!

Drakron

25th Jun 2010, 10:03 PM

One of the aspects of the sims game is that it really does not allow for the possibility of failure.

In The Sims 3 that is true, not in The Sims 2 or The Sims were they could be demoted or even fired.

The problem is the game was developed to make sure the player could never "lose" and so the moment the player understand that critical failure cannot happen in any circumstance there is no point in playing, at least not bothering with gameplay elements that are simply padding.

This is a trend on new game were they are making the games a non-challenge (or when a challenge happens is due to poor design and not intended) and that is why we have stupid things as "no bills" aspiration rewards.

ChristinaCrino

25th Jun 2010, 11:48 PM

The Sims seems to represent teens pretty well. School, homework, job; school, homework, job; school, homework, job; school, homework, OHAI FREE TIME :D!; school, homework, job; homework, job... etc. Oh, and they play guitar/sing for eons if you leave them to their own devices. Rather realistic. Minus the singing part, I fail at singing.

PubertyBarbie

26th Jun 2010, 01:48 AM

This whole thread had me lol'ing. Especially Summersong's posts.

Girl, you really need to be a writer. That chiz is hysterical.

My teens aren't A+ students, a lot like how I am! I leave time for myself (being 17) to go run around and socialize with my friends, have a part time job, and do my school work. I try my hardest in school, but my hardest isn't, "MUST-GO-HOME-AND-STUDY-UNTIL-I-THROW-UP-TRIG." I almost wish the education system in this game was different, I wish they split it up into private/public again. I want my gifted teen simlets to go off to some private school that throws up homework on them until their balls are blue and suffocated. I want my less gifted teens, the ones who want to get that part time job (which should realistically only be three days a week, I mean come on. The way they have it set up is silly! Or maybe let the kids create their own work schedule some how, that would be very nice) or socialize with a thousand and one of their friends go and do exactly that.

In all honesty, my Sims get B's in school. Some have jobs, others don't. Some have a happy medium of work and play. I just wish the education system was different.

J. M. Pescado

26th Jun 2010, 03:06 AM

The problem is the game was developed to make sure the player could never "lose" and so the moment the player understand that critical failure cannot happen in any circumstance there is no point in playing, at least not bothering with gameplay elements that are simply padding.You can be demoted and fired in the Pudding same way as in TS2. Left to themselves, sims seem quite adept at managing this.

This is a trend on new game were they are making the games a non-challenge (or when a challenge happens is due to poor design and not intended) and that is why we have stupid things as "no bills" aspiration rewards.The ironic thing is that the No Bills aspiration award is possibly one of the lower-yield rewards in the game. It costs a fair chunk of points, so you had to at least manage to play the game decently to get it, and for all your trouble, it probably only saves you like $100 a week in the average case. Bills have never been a significant gameplay element unless you mismanage things. Heck, they're not really significant in real life unless you're mismanaging your finances...which, sadly, most people do. It is apparently harder to succumb to the temptations of being a moron when you're controlling people in third-person. Just think of all that useless crap you keep buying that you would never give to your sims. If you stopped buying all that crap in real life, you'd be in much better financial shape. You, too, can live in a tent like a sim.

PubertyBarbie

26th Jun 2010, 04:24 AM

There still is challenge in TS3, so I don't know why that would even be an argument. Truthfully, I don't think the game is meant to be a third-person shooter or RPG, you know what I mean? Campaign options aren't really an "option" in TS3, it's really just a simulator of life with wacky occurrences and embellishments. :P

Perhaps it's less challenging than it was in TS2, but I don't think there is an incredible significance in the change.

And LOL at J. M. Pescado, for he is indeed right. MAYBE THIS GAME IS A LESSON TO SOCIETY. :o Ahaha, JK, but still. I think bills are more of a problem IRL then it is in the Sims, because even if you manage them properly, there are still fees that apply to reality and don't in the Sims. :P I.e. Hospital Bills - sometimes those far exceed what people are able to pay.

tjstreak

26th Jun 2010, 05:23 AM

Since every time you recompend a compendium, it gains percentage value, you get runaway exponential growth VERY quickly and will easily blow out int32

Well yes and no. Trying to make money making compendium is like a ponzi scheme. Compendium works best with expensive metals -- the more expensive the better. Supernovium works best with inexpensive metals. Which metals predominate in the game: cheap stuff like copper and iron.

So, if you have a bunch of copper and iron, supernovium is the way to go. On the large display case, use four parts of whatever cheap metal is plentiful (usually iron or copper), then use one part of the other metal, one part gold, one part silver and one part something else. Use the cheapest stuff you can use. Figure that the cheap metals are about 25 each and the expensive one is about 200, you have about 375 in it. This will yield a piece of compendium worth about 450, or a piece of supernovium worth around 7500. One gives you a 25% profit, the other a whopping 2000% profit.

Now keep in mind that making the transformation costs 500. If you make compendium, you go into the hole about 50. If you make supernovium you have a net profit of 7000.

When you have a bunch of supernovium, it is now time to start making compendium. I have not played with the ratios yet, but you want to use say four parts of supernovium with something else. I haven't tried it, but you might try to go with 7 parts supernovium with 1 part of something else. That will give you a piece of compendium worth around 40,000. (4 parts supernovium = 30,000 plus the whatever else = approximately 40,000). In future iterations, you might try 7 parts supernovium with your ever increasing compendium -- gaining 25% with each iteration.

In the course of a single afternoon, your sim can make well in excess of 40,000. He basically runs the display case 8 times. This is much much better than any regular job in the game.

[The no bills reward] probably only saves you like $100 a week in the average case. Bills have never been a significant gameplay element unless you mismanage things.

Have you seen the typical home which is uploaded -- they are freakin mansions. It takes a sim two hours to go from the top floor to the bottom floor. If he needs to take a leak, he will pee all over himself before he can reach the john!

I while ago, I designed a simple little house for around 4000. It was 3x3, on a 10 x 10 lot. While the idea was initially a joke, it probably is the best house I ever designed. It played like a charm.

First of all, bills were about 75 a week. And when your sim starts with 16,000 and only spends 4000, do you know what they can do? A lot.

For example, they can buy an interest in a business and receive an income of 1000+ a week without doing a lick of work. And they still have enough money left over, after buying their home and an interest in a business, to take several trips abroad.

The lack of crap forces them to go into the community to do things like exercising, and/or laundry. This actually helsp their socialization. They no longer can sit at home all day. They have to go out and meet with other sims.

Sometimes, less is more.

summersong86

26th Jun 2010, 06:05 AM

I want my gifted teen simlets to go off to some private school that throws up homework on them until their balls are blue and suffocated.My husband and I just got our daughter accepted into a private school specifically to AVOID homework. We're kind of hippies that way. We feel that most schools excel at sucking all the fun, wonder and joy out of learning, especially as they are now so focused on teaching specifically so kids can score high on standardized tests. At any rate, it's costing us big, but we did find an excellent, highly reputable Montessori school that does not impose homework, testing, or even a grading system on students. Students do a LOT of work, but it's during school hours only, and evaluations are a part of the process, not the end goal of the process. I did get to see the work the kids were doing and even interview some of the students. I was astounded at the quality of their work, how articulate each child was, and how clearly happy they were and proud of their school.

I'm not a snob and I'm far from rich, but after interviewing the older kids in the neighborhood about how they feel about our local public elementary school, my husband and I decided okay, stick with my 20 year old car, clip coupons --in short, do whatever we have to in order to get our daughter started on an educational path that fosters a lifelong love of learning. I didn't invest the past 5 years homeschooling her just to stick her in a brick box where they will make her hate science the way our entire neighborhood's kids hate it. Before making the hard decision to shell out thousands a year for a 6 year old's schooling, I interviewed practically ever kid in our neighborhood who is enrolled at the local elementary. Their hatred of science is unanimous. Okay I can understand being bored by history and math. But who isn't enchanted by bugs? By the planets? By the oceans? Who isn't driven to distraction at the wonder of how everything and anything works?

And frankly, history is incredibly fascinating if it's taught properly. Unfortunately, it so rarely is. :rolleyes: I also found out math is not so unbearably hard to learn as well, if it's taught the way my daughter's school teaches it. I got to watch the classes in action and it's just a joyous thing to see. I wished I could be one of the students, just so I could learn math "organically" the way those kids were learning it.

And LOL at J. M. Pescado, for he is indeed right. MAYBE THIS GAME IS A LESSON TO SOCIETY. :o Ahaha, JK, but still. I think bills are more of a problem IRL then it is in the Sims, because even if you manage them properly, there are still fees that apply to reality and don't in the Sims. I.e. Hospital Bills - sometimes those far exceed what people are able to pay.

Amen to that. Last summer one of my cats bit me on the base of my thumb. I ended up in the hospital for 4 days and racked up a bill slightly in excess of $20,000. Never ever EVER bathe a 25 pound cat.

Ranissa

26th Jun 2010, 03:46 PM

I while ago, I designed a simple little house for around 4000. It was 3x3, on a 10 x 10 lot. While the idea was initially a joke, it probably is the best house I ever designed. It played like a charm.

First of all, bills were about 75 a week. And when your sim starts with 16,000 and only spends 4000, do you know what they can do? A lot.

...snip...

Sometimes, less is more.

This is what I do for the Sims I plan to be self-employed. I plop them down on an empty lot. I proceed to buy them a toilet, a shower, a fridge, a stove and a bed. Maybe a bookcase. Often I put walls around them and a roof over their head because, hey, I don't like living in a tent and I like *some* realism.

At the beginning, these people do nothing but learn, plant/fish/paint/write and gather. Often while they are reading a skill book or working on a skill, I will be scouring the neighborhood for bugs, plants/seeds and ore.

Right now, my gardener sim has made it to 3/10 perfect plants, has about 4k simoleons in the "bank", has a live-in girlfriend, two young sons and his house has grown to include two bedrooms, two baths, a kitchen table and chairs and even an outdoor grill.

The Sims isn't "hard" and, imo, never has been since Sims 1, if you are smart about how you manage your time and resources.

As for the "dumbing down" of gaming...it's gaming. I'm sorry, I don't want to spend hours playing a game I have no chance of "winning" without, you know, more hours invested. Gaming is supposed to be a momentary distraction from life, not life itself.

Summersong: I have been reading more and more about schools like this. As my son will be heading into school around the time I have my doctorate, I try to keep an eye on the trend, hoping it will continue. While I still have hope for our educational system, I imagine my husband and I will be looking into schools like this in the near future. Congratulations on finding one you like!

novabossa

26th Jun 2010, 04:23 PM

xD I don't play teenagers often, but with the the pair I have right now, I'd say that I don't enjoy playing teenagers at all. (which is a shame since I'm a teen myself...)

The teen with the part time job hardly has a social life since she's too busy trying to keep her motives up, gain skills and complete her homework. Though, the other teen with no part time job, is doing really well. I usually let her host parties so she can socialize with her friends/acquaintances from school.

And summersong86, I absolutely abhor science. D: I could spend hours reading up on how things work around me/ the universe/ etc since I do find it interesting, but what the school teaches me puts me to sleep in 5 minutes. (Or at least it gets me really bored, since I would never be able to put my head down on a table and simply sleep.) They get me confused too, like how I found out that I've been taught the wrong things in chemistry today. Ah, and it's great that you got your kids into that lovely school :D

PubertyBarbie

26th Jun 2010, 08:20 PM

My husband and I just got our daughter accepted into a private school specifically to AVOID homework. We're kind of hippies that way. We feel that most schools excel at sucking all the fun, wonder and joy out of learning, especially as they are now so focused on teaching specifically so kids can score high on standardized tests.

Oh my God, I know how you feel. I'm happy your daughter is in a Montessori school, my parents went to see one over here because they wanted to evaluate how my sister did under different learning conditions (she's 6) but decided that they were just going to leave her in the Catholic school she and my brother attend.

I completely understand what you mean about the standardized tests. I was bread to take them and JUST score high on them, as I have been in the private/Catholic school system my entire life (and they really have no option or say in the matter).

I hate math, science, and above all history. These subjects not only give me trouble, but BORE me to death and each one is a regents class. Regents are big tests that we train for the whole year to take. So our courses are "regents based curriculum" which in turn means, "lol, did you see why the NYS Board of Education did there? GOTCHYA! Now you're stuck teaching all this and there is absolutely no wiggle room." Teachers hate this as much as we do because it limits their ability to teach in their specific style.

Once again, Kudo's to you for going above and beyond for your daughter. It'll pay off, trust me.

Amen to that. Last summer one of my cats bit me on the base of my thumb. I ended up in the hospital for 4 days and racked up a bill slightly in excess of $20,000. Never ever EVER bathe a 25 pound cat.

Oh my Jesus. D:
Yeah, noted. Lol.

summersong86

28th Jun 2010, 08:04 AM

Well I feel very sad to hear of anyone hating science or any other subject for that matter, but trust me, I understand. I went through all of that, too. But don't let your youth and energy go to waste. It's so easy to fall into the trap of feeling there's nothing to be done and therefore doing nothing.

But with initiative, anything is possible. There are endless opportunities to educate and improve ourselves if we make the effort to find them and make the most of them, especially in this age of ready access to information via the internet. Of course, we have to be savvy and learn to discern information from DIS-information! But I am saying there's no need to let your intellectual curiosity wither just because there are shortcomings in your formal education.

Find people who are successful in fields in which you have an interest and ask politely to interview them. Ask just a few questions to find out how they got where they are. What does it take to be successful in that field? How do you best get started? It's amazing how many people have a mentoring instinct when they find someone young and energetic who takes the initiative to make a sincere attempt to put their foot on the same path. If you do get the brushoff, don't give up. Look up someone else. Make contacts until you find someone willing to spare a few minutes. From such an interview you'll find you can formulate your own curriculum. From there you can find how to educate yourself. All it takes is rewiring one's beliefs that everything has to be provided to us ready-made. Truly successful people make their own way because they are savvy enough to recognize the ready-made way is geared to the lowest common denominator.

Neither my husband nor I was ever the type to just show up and put in our hours then punch out the clock and go home. Both of us always were intensely curious about every aspect of every business we worked for. And we sought out great mentors. Actually a few sought US out because they saw we were hard working and mentally engaged in our careers.

I'm a stay-at-home mom now, but while I was working, I made the most of it. LOL--they had to hire 3 people to replace me when I left my last company! Actually I think a 4th person also took some of my duties. My husband had quite a meteoric rise in his own career path. That's because he, like myself, never hesitated to take on every opportunity to improve himself on the job.

I would love to see education reform and indeed my husband and I do our part as concerned citizens to stay informed and vote wisely. But the problems are deeply entrenched, as is the corruption that defies change and progress. I believe it all can be fought and change can be wrought, but meanwhile time will pass and students will be stuck with the status quo. So it's going to have to be up to the kids themselves to take it upon themselves to say "No excuses! Nothing is going to hold me back from my goals and aspirations." That means staying away from the keg. That means putting down the weed and definitely staying away from the meth and the crack. That means keeping one's britches on unless one is fully able to accept the possible consequences of conceiving a child before being done with education and being financially able to support a child or facing the physical and psychological ramifications of abortion or giving up a child for adoption. It means a whole LOT of things a lot of people do not want to hear about or think about. I mention these things not to be preachy but because I saw such things derail young people in my family or among my friends who had a lot of promise and potential. People want what they want and they want it now, and they want it handed to them on a silver platter. That's true for the parents, the kids, the politicians and the schools. And frankly I think that's why everything has gotten so bleeped up. I have the privilege of being 43 years old and having had long-lived grandparents and great grandparents I got to meet whose lives span as far back as 120 years ago. From talking to them and growing up under their influence, I know it was different back then and one of the key differences between our world and theirs was that previous generations were composed of very independent minded people who believed in personal responsibility and personal initiative. And absolutely no bleeping excuses! They also took it for granted that you had to often delay immediate gratification to attain long-term goals.

So, I say be an individual and steer your own ship. Yes, the waters are troubled, but ultimately it IS YOUR ship and if you're not concerned about avoiding the rocks, don't expect anyone else to be. The system and even unfortunately, sometimes the parents are bleeped up beyond belief. Still, no excuses. Those eff ups can be overcome. I know that firsthand. I have dear friends who know it firsthand.

It kind of reminds me of sims. Those stupid opportunities that pop up that let the sims advance--well it's funny but sometimes it works that way in real life, too. I usually cancel the pop-ups/opportunities in Sims3. But in real life...honey, I take 'em! :lol: Of course, in real life I don't have a hissy fit and point to my mouth and wave my arms wildly if an opportunity arises while I'm hungry. I just hit a vending machine and grab some chips! :rolleyes:

J. M. Pescado

28th Jun 2010, 10:15 AM

Compendium works best with expensive metals -- the more expensive the better.If you're going to use the compendium exploit, Compendium works best when the same bar is repeatedly recompended iteratively to gan 25% interest on each iteration, in combination with some cheap and disposable filler. It quickly ceases to matter how expensive the metals are, as even if you started out with a single chunk of compendium worth a measly $1, in under 100 compendings, you'll blow out int32 and mess the game. Using a chunk of Supernovium can jump start the process faster, but after a point, the main cost in the process becomes the amount of thought you want to put into the process. It is simply far easier to mindlessly shovel bars onto the machine than to try to make sure you always have 5 different ones.

simbalena

28th Jun 2010, 12:06 PM

I'm happy your daughter is in a Montessori school, my parents went to see one over here because they wanted to evaluate how my sister did under different learning conditions (she's 6) but decided that they were just going to leave her in the Catholic school she and my brother attend.

Off topic - I had hippy parents and went to a Montessori school between the ages of five and seven. It was ok for playing but educationally it held me back. Some kids should be allowed to learn to read when they're five... or four. And it's ok to play with dolls with faces! And it's ok to paint with paint that makes precise lines! If you're going to encourage free spirits then let them be fucking free spirits rather than limiting to what your idea of what a free spirit is!!!

Blessings on the blossom,
Blessings on the fruit
Blessings on the leaves and stems,
And blessings on the root.

/rant

RoseCity

28th Jun 2010, 12:49 PM

I'd like to jump in with a defense of Montessori schools and the Montessori method because my younger daughter went to one ages 3-8. She learned to read when she was 4 - I remember they were these little books that came in a little plastic suitcase about a guy named Bob. The Montessori curriculum is child directed so if the teacher didn't let you learn to read, she wasn't following the method correctly.

J. M. Pescado

28th Jun 2010, 02:11 PM

I am also inclined to attribute this to other issues, yes.

NekoCat

28th Jun 2010, 03:33 PM

My state makes you take tests no matter what type of school you're in, even if you're homeschooled. Good thing, too, because no matter how much you complain its the only way to know if the students have figured out what 2x2 is and if the teachers are even doing their job. Kids love to goof and would like nothing better than to sit for 6 hours a day gossiping and I've had teachers who did the same thing. They would then pad the grades (everyone got B's or C's) to cover their a**. I didn't even have a real, 5 day week math class with a book and dedicated teacher until 8th grade and we weren't graded until 4th grade because it would "hold us back". Of course, there was no science, no history, very little math and a lot of reading or gossiping. And no homework at all. I feel like I spent 12 years teaching myself since I was one of the few who would actually study in class instead of gossiping with the teacher. As much as people complain about tests, the education level of my state has gone up dramatically since it started.

Which makes me think, I wish the school system in the Sims was divided up better into grades. It would be an additional challenge. Like, the kids and teens have to reach a certain skill level (collecting, logic, whatever) in order to move up a grade, and if the kids haven't by the time their ready to become teens they have to remain kids for a certain period of time. I wonder if that can even be done? Doing all that within the curfew would also be a good challenge (I like playing challenges, lol.)

Chrizta0000

28th Jun 2010, 05:00 PM

I never have these problems with my teen Sims. And they all get jobs.
I have them talk to friends in school and they hang out on the weekends or on days off.

summersong86

30th Jun 2010, 10:08 AM

Off topic - I had hippy parents and went to a Montessori school between the ages of five and seven. It was ok for playing but educationally it held me back. Some kids should be allowed to learn to read when they're five... or four. And it's ok to play with dolls with faces! And it's ok to paint with paint that makes precise lines! If you're going to encourage free spirits then let them be fucking free spirits rather than limiting to what your idea of what a free spirit is!!!

Blessings on the blossom,
Blessings on the fruit
Blessings on the leaves and stems,
And blessings on the root.

/rantSayyyyWhatttt?? That's one weird school you went to. My husband did check into all of that. Some schools that call themselves Montessori are indeed pretty whacked out. This one is reputable and its graduates largely go on to very highly regarded middle schools and high schools. The 4 and 5 year olds I saw were working on their writing and reading and math and even geography! We do get a 4 week trial period and if it is too wacky, we're outta there and on to other options. It's not so much we are "free spirits" just for the sake of being free spirits. I wouldn't send my kid to some oddball school just for the sake of saying "look, we're free spirits". A tattoo of a unicorn on my ankle could say that for me a lot cheaper! ;) It's all about education.

When I say we are "hippies" I mean that sort of tongue in cheek, because our neighborhood is extremely uniform in how the kids are being raised. It's very "Stepford-like" in many ways. Any variation from how the herd does things is viewed as "hippy". For example, we stand out as oddities because we only rarely and sparingly use lawn pesticides or herbicides (yet have a very beautiful yard anyway because I pull weeds by hand) and we don't attend a Protestant church--or any church for that matter (yet we are Christians who live the faith to the best of our abilities) and we aren't putting our daughter in the local public school. That's it, and yet that's enough to be viewed as a "hippy" around here. It does not mean I wear tie dye clothes or grow real weed along with the few odd clovers and dandelion weeds I allow to spring up because I avoid lawn chemicals. ;)

Okay getting back ON TOPIC, the SIMS teens (and kids)--it does frustrate me that the game doesn't generally factor in the building of REAL skills toward their progress in school. It's so very frustrating to have to spend time on the homework animation that adds nothing interesting. I wish at least there could be a choice of type of homework project the kid is doing--for example a book report. And then let the book report add to the writing skill. I think perhaps writing a book report did come up as an opportunity. But I'm not talking about pop-ups. I wish you could get a menu of options of skills you can build when you select the homework.

Also, I was wondering--did I mess something up or does the game really put all teen and child school progress back to a default of C student if you save the family to the library? I had put some families from the library into Twinbrook. I could have sworn I'd worked all of these kids up to at least B student level with high performance levels, but when I went to play them in Twinbrook they were back to C's and zero level school performance.

And it has been lately driving me nuts that townie kids are always coming home on the bus with my kids. Why? Why? They can't even do homework with my kids. That's crazy. I want the option to say NO, so-and-so can't come home with my kid when I get that pop up notice saying they are coming home. I've had a tight time of it carving out opportunities for the parents to build relationships with their own children so I don't appreciate some random townie kid horning in on family time. I'm not running a daycare! I had to let the townie kid wander around the house doing her own thing while my kids sat together and did homework at the dinner table. Is that a bug? I could have sworn it was once the case that the classmates could be clicked on to do homework with your kid. Did a patch mess that up or am I remembering it wrong? I know you can boot the townie kid out just like you can for any other visitor but it just feels awkward to do that. And sometimes the little stinkers are running around so fast I can't find them right away. Grrrr.

Ranissa

30th Jun 2010, 04:09 PM

And it has been lately driving me nuts that townie kids are always coming home on the bus with my kids. Why? Why? They can't even do homework with my kids. That's crazy. I want the option to say NO, so-and-so can't come home with my kid when I get that pop up notice saying they are coming home. I've had a tight time of it carving out opportunities for the parents to build relationships with their own children so I don't appreciate some random townie kid horning in on family time. I'm not running a daycare! I had to let the townie kid wander around the house doing her own thing while my kids sat together and did homework at the dinner table. Is that a bug? I could have sworn it was once the case that the classmates could be clicked on to do homework with your kid. Did a patch mess that up or am I remembering it wrong? I know you can boot the townie kid out just like you can for any other visitor but it just feels awkward to do that. And sometimes the little stinkers are running around so fast I can't find them right away. Grrrr.

You have a bug. My young teen gentleman that I enjoy so much always does his homework with his girlfriend, as she is almost always at his house. The same goes for her younger brother and his best friend, who comes home with him on the bus 3 out of 5 days.

Your RL work philosophy is exactly what I hope to instill in my son. I bounced from job to job and place to place until I had three very wonderful mentors who helped set me on the right path. They also encouraged me to look for mentors and opportunities right under my nose which is certainly what landed me a plum position in my doctoral program. While I, too, have hope for our educational system, I won't hold my breath while looking for alternative solutions.

Edit: NeckoCat, the problems you talk about in your school will not be solved by state-wide testing. Those problems come from poor administration, poor hiring practices and a complicit school board. In fact, state-wide testing will often just cause teachers to cram a bunch of knowledge into the heads of their students right before the test in order to "pad the grades", as you mentioned. Having taught in such a school, I should know. The week leading up to test-taking week was a beehive of activity, and not the necessarily healthy sort.

I also like to point out that not everyone is a good test-taker though they may be incredibly bright. Standardized tests only really measure how clever you are with strategy, not how much you have absorbed the material. Ask almost any college student who prepared for the GRE - the books don't teach you the material, they teach you test-taking strategies.

summersong86

1st Jul 2010, 06:48 AM

Ranissa--thanks for letting me know the kids can still do homework together.

But awww mannnn! A bug! My game is bugged??!!! My daughter have advanced the storyline in our current version of Twinbrook so far. We have older saves but the bug has been present since we first fired up the game on a brand spanking new hard drive and new OS and fresh install. Poo! Poo I tell you!

It's not the only bug I have. I noticed a few have sneaked in. It's been a mildly buggy experience so far. I had this one weird bug where my burglar sim would get arrested every single time she was getting close to a promotion and would therefore get the notice "Missing Work!" and end up missing her promotion when it was expected.

DarkCougar555

1st Jul 2010, 08:44 AM

I don't know why homework is so long to be complete. I use 30 min speed up mod for homework, so I usually increase teens' ranks that is a bit of easier. Cos it will reduce the number of days and it will give teens more free time after their schools. My teens tend to finish their homework before their jobs start. Maybe it is just my own way. =)

tjstreak

2nd Jul 2010, 05:36 AM

even if you started out with a single chunk of compendium worth a measly $1, in under 100 compendings, you'll blow out int32 and mess the game. Using a chunk of Supernovium can jump start the process faster,

Which is why a two part strategy works very well. Instead of starting with a 1 simoleon piece, it is more efficient to make Supernovium. Seven supernovium runs gets you started at approximately 30,000 simoleons. Now, your 25% increase with compendium starts to mean something. In fact, the 30,000 level is where making compendium starts gaining an advantage over making supernovium. 25% of 30,000 is about the same as what you would get for making one piece of supernovium.

The optimum strategy is to make 7 ingots of supernovium. At this point you use your 7 ingots of supernovium, plus something else (but not mummitomium) to make your first bar of compendium. At this point you keep on reusing your compendium bar, with something else (eg. 1 compendium with 7 iron) and keep on running it again and again. Using this method, my latest sims family had approximately 1.3 million simoleons in TWO DAYS. And they weren't even particularly hard days.

grillcheesesammich

2nd Jul 2010, 05:45 AM

I cleansed my town of teens with all the joy and enthusiasm of a tank full of mall cops. buh-bye

tjstreak

3rd Jul 2010, 06:08 AM

My state makes you take tests no matter what type of school you're in, even if you're homeschooled. Good thing, too, because no matter how much you complain its the only way to know if the students have figured out what 2x2 is and if the teachers are even doing their job...As much as people complain about tests, the education level of my state has gone up dramatically since it started.

I love the right winger's plan to improve education: eliminate teachers unions, lower teachers pay, make teachers work the year round, decrease their benefits, eliminate their job security, and micro-manage them. By doing all this, teaching will become a more attractive profession and better qualified teachers will be drawn to it.

I have a friend who was a superintendent of schools. With respect to teaching his comment was the more politically connected teachers can always be assigned the better students. This way, the test scores for their classes are always higher than those for other teachers, making them look like better teachers than they really are. Whereas teacher who is new to the school and has no connections gets the worst students, making their performance worse than it really is. Test scores, like so many other idiocy factors, are easily manipulated.