Culture and Heritage

[paksetti]

Being a European Mutt, having no idea what my heritage is (possibly German, because of my last name), sometimes I feel a little "left out" that I don't have a long line of people behind me, or any cultural traditions, foods, clothing etc.; just generic "western" things blandly over-mixed into a melting pot.

Is tradition and historical culture important, or is it enough to have a personal cultural identity?

[Oaktree]

I don't know a lot about my mother's side of the family, though I know my father's side of the family is almost completely Irish. I enjoy learning about Irish history, but it isn't a major part of my life. I am of the opinion that cultural identity has very little meaning when it goes further back than those currently alive. I didn't live through the potato famine, so while it is the reason for much of the Irish immigration to this country, it has only a little impact on me. I don't riverdance, I don't speak Gaelic (although I wouldn't mind being able to; I love languages), I don't get wasted on St. Patrick's Day. To me, my personal cultural identity, as you put it, is more important. The people I hang out with, my academic areas of study, and the hobbies I enjoy are all more important to me than cultural practices that my ancestors came up with. I tend to associate with people of all sorts, so the idea of associating much more strongly with one particular culture is strange to me.

[el_flel]

If your cultural history is important to you, then it's important. Tbh, most people are such a mish-mash of various different cultures that it's sort of hard to pin just one on yourself. I'm of the same opinion as Oaktree: my personal cultural identity is me.

My mum's mum is Irish, mum's dad has got some German in there somewhere because their surname is Schmidt. We know barely anything about my dad's dad because he was adopted at a young age (dad ran off when he was a baby and his mum died when he was 3), and my dad's mum's family has lived in the town I grew up in for a very long time. Quite a lot of variation.

[paksetti]

I agree that personal culture is important, but I also think it's important to know who your ancestors were, and know a bit about your cultural history. That's not to say you shouldn't learn about all cultures- history is important-- tradition shouldn't define a person, but I think it should play some role in their life.

[fakepeeps7]

When I was in high school, I felt "left out" because I was the only white kid in my group of friends. My family's been in Canada for generations, and I didn't even really know about my own heritage... so when I saw all my first- and second-generation Canadian friends' cultural customs that were still so strong, I couldn't help but feel a little envious.

Years later, I've traced my family tree and found that I'm pretty close to 100% English/Scottish/Irish. Eh... it's still boring, and there's not a heck of a lot I can do with that information, but it's still nice to know where I came from.

I don't really put that much stock in my own cultural traditions. I'm just a human being having a human experience on planet Earth. Isn't that enough of an identity? :)

[fragglerocks]

My dad's side of the family, as I've recently found out, was originally French. I've traced us as far back as the Berkeley family, who are very famous and lived in the royal palace from Henry the Second on. Nowadays we aren't so rich and powerful, but its nice to know we were at some point. My mom's side is German and Irish. But I haven't traced her side as far back yet. I know I will someday.

I don't identify it with who I am today exactly, but its interesting to know my history.

[Shoosh Malooka]

I think culture and heritage is useful for many self-serving purposes, for good or bad, depending on your attitude. If I came from a line of aristocrats I wouldn't hesitate to toot my own horn and use it to edify myself. Someone whose ancestor ran a cotton plantation with slaves, and who is now going through some bizarre ideological journey of redemption, might claim this wrong of yesterday gives them a mission to make amends today. Another one may find information that he is descended from William the Conqueror and use it as ammunition in his hatred of English people. Maybe your forefathers had a secret pizza recipe that was stolen by Domino's Pizza, or met Charlie Chaplain, or came into the possession of an antique clock, or won the 1890 Boston pie-eating contest. Anything you find specific or unique, big or small, may be useful.

My great grandfather had to put up with some invasive Japanese soldiers during WW2, as they had occupied the island. I can imagine a few uses for this information. I can twist it into a weapon or transmute it to gold.

[Vanito]

My parents hippy influences do have passed on: long live peace and personal freedom. Old traditions are a waste on me, but thats also rather "hippy".

[SuicidiaParasidia]

if i have a culture, its gone ignored for... well. my entire life. so i'll just stick with the idea that i dont have one. i dont really see the use, anyway, though that POV comes from ignorance, admittedly.

heritage is also a mystery. my family's idea of closeness ends at uncles and aunts. my own idea of closeness ( or, wanting to be closer to others ) ends at my brothers, mother, and two uncles.

[longears15]

Thanks to people who've recorded over the last five or six generations, I can trace my family back for hundreds of years on both sides, and having that knowledge of where I came from is very important to me. Admittedly in my family's case it's fairly easy - my father's parents' families lived mainly in small villages and came to Australia in the mid 1800s, and my maternal grandmother's family lived in the same area for about 500 years and only started venturing out after the Second World War. Some has been recorded formally in history - for example my great (x7) grandmother was Flora MacDonald, who saved the life of Bonnie Prince Charlie. My great-uncle was 'Chicken' Smallhorn, one of the best footy players of his day - and there are a lot of wee stories and anecdotes that have been passed down - Uncle Chick was in a POW camp, umpired a footy game then collapsed an hour later with appendicitis and was operated on by Weary Dunlop. My grandpa met Winston Churchill a few times during the war. He and his sister kept a beautiful scrapbook of newspaper articles from that period about the airforce squadron my grandpa was part of. I sometimes wish that I was a bit older and could have written them down before my grandmothers' generation had died because I think that many will now be forgotten.

So to get back to the question at hand - I think that family culture and history is only as important as you want it to be. If it's enough for you to be happy with your own identity, then so be it - some people simply don't want to be defined by their heritage, for whatever reason. And if you're like me and want to know everything you can about your roots then yes, it is important.

[LoonehWannabe]

I am 1/4 Italian, and am part Dutch and part something else. I do not know exactly how much Dutch is in me because my mother was a result of teen pregnancy and was adopted, so I don't know the her birth father.

[Mistermook]

What is important to you is important to you. If you make something, or allow something, to have value in your life then that's all you need to worry about. It certainly isn't important what other people value on a personal level, unless you're trying to support or contradict it. I'm not even sure if there's a polite reason to contradict someone's perception of their culture and heritage either.

[Nekowolf]

Well, most of what I know of is on my mother's side, but what I know of is: English, German, Danish (I'm actually related to Hans Christian Andersen), Norwegian (Norwegian viking ancestors), Native American (from around the Quebec area), French (only by one person though; he was apparently a captain), Irish, and Scottish.

Furthermore, my family has been in North America for a very very long time. Since before the Revolutionary War. In fact, there is a slim chance that we may be related to one of the original settlers on the Mayflower (there is a person in the line who seems to be disputing that, though, so it is by no means a certainty).

[Rectos Dominos]

I am also a European mutt but I am second-generation Canadian on my Mom's side third on my Dad's. Irish, English, Dutch, Ukrainian, and Romanian my great-grandfather was born in Ukraine (it was Soviet Union at the time during Stalin) has the last 2 mentioned heritages.

Those are my heritages but culturally I am Canadian I was born and raised in Canada and so were my parents, when I got asked my nationally while traveling in Europe I said Canadian since that is what I am that doesn't mean I have forgotten my ancestral roots.

A lot of people don't the difference between heritage/race and culture. Your heritage is what your ancestors or possibly where your originally from. Your culture is who you are inside. Example an East Indian born in Canada or immigrated at an early age's views, values, and interests will be more like a Canadian's than someone who was born and raised in India.

[missroxor]

I remember watching films when I was younger and there'd be a girl (or boy) who lived in a really small town where everyone knew each other and she couldn't wait to break free from it all and I remember feeling jealous. I had that life (well, it was a city, not a small town) prior to my generation my family can be traced back as far as 250 years (that's as far as I've got) as all living within the same 2 square miles. Then in my early teens my mum decided she was a gypsy at heart and I've lived in 17 different places ever since. :rolleyes: It's been so long now that I feel totally disconnected from that 2 square miles of land that generations of my anscestors called home, I know I'll never go back there to live.

When I became pregnant it suddenly became even more important....I guess if you miss what you can't have you miss it even more when you know your kids have less chance of getting it. I mean, I'm Scottish, my husband's half Irish, half Welsh Jew, my son was born in America but given our jobs he will probably be brought up in England for most of his life.....the poor kid's gonna be hella confused :lol: I actually binned the modern names I always thought I'd like to call my kids and gave him a traditional name from my roots and a traditional name from my husband roots so at least in name, there'd be a connection to his roots.

As he's growing up I'll tell him about his roots but I can only hope that he turns out to be the sort of person who cares more about the present and future than the past.


EDIT: That said, I do find it odd when Americans (and it seems to be an American thing, though I don't know any Canadians, maybe they do it too) proclaim themselves British because 300 years ago somebody in their blood line lived there. eg I met a girl here in NV who upon finding out I was Scottish excitedly squeeled that she was too and it was nice to meet a fellow countryman. I was a little taken aback, I mean the thick American accent certainly didn't help her case but I asked anyway, "oh, how nice, which part are you from?". Her actual answer was (I'm not joking), "Um....oh, wait, oh I know this one....North I think" :wtf:

[fakepeeps7]

That said, I do find it odd when Americans (and it seems to be an American thing, though I don't know any Canadians, maybe they do it too) proclaim themselves British because 300 years ago somebody in their blood line lived there. eg I met a girl here in NV who upon finding out I was Scottish excitedly squeeled that she was too and it was nice to meet a fellow countryman. I was a little taken aback, I mean the thick American accent certainly didn't help her case but I asked anyway, "oh, how nice, which part are you from?". Her actual answer was (I'm not joking), "Um....oh, wait, oh I know this one....North I think" :wtf:

Personally, I've never come across anyone who said such a thing. Not all Americans are British, and if they claim they are, they're either ignorant or lying. You'd probably be more likely to find a Canadian making such claims (given that we were under British rule for a long time), but again, I haven't really seen it.

Many of my great-grandparents came from Scotland and England (or were descended from people who came from Scotland or England), and I knew a couple of them, so it was easier to feel a bit of a connection with the home country. But the "which part are you from?" question isn't any easier to answer, even if you do know your roots. In my case, the answer is, "From all over!" (Literally... from Caithness to Kent. I'm a purebred British mutt. :lol:)

[RoseCity]

EDIT: That said, I do find it odd when Americans (and it seems to be an American thing, though I don't know any Canadians, maybe they do it too) proclaim themselves British because 300 years ago somebody in their blood line lived there. eg I met a girl here in NV who upon finding out I was Scottish excitedly squeeled that she was too and it was nice to meet a fellow countryman. I was a little taken aback, I mean the thick American accent certainly didn't help her case but I asked anyway, "oh, how nice, which part are you from?". Her actual answer was (I'm not joking), "Um....oh, wait, oh I know this one....North I think" :wtf:

Americans, everyone's favorite idiots!... :rofl:
But, seriously I think a lot of Americans don't see their own culture, or don't recognize it as a real culture.
I remember one of my stepdaughters had a school project to write about her family's ethnic traditions on Thanksgiving and the teacher gave her a bad grade because she (the teacher) said 'eating turkey and gathering with family' are just what 'everybody' does, in other words, not-cultural.

[dancehallsim]

I find that it's a very American thing to be so concerned with your heritage. Even if you're not necessarily one to follow the traditions of your heritage, you probably know most of the places your family is from.

I am Polish, Russian, French, Canadian, English, Scottish and Native American.
My maternal great grandparents came here from Poland and Russia. (We think Moscow... my great grandfather claims he was born in NY, but we have his naturalization papers. Liar)
My great grandpa came from PEI, Canada (and France, before that. Normandy/Bretagne area, I believe.).
My paternal grandmother's family came from England on the Mayflower (Stephen Hopkins, if we want to be specific) and are also Scottish and Native American (Passamaquasset tribe, northern Maine and Canada).

I know all of that.. but when it comes to my family's culture, I'm very American. We celebrate Christmas and Easter and the big American holidays. We love baseball and apple pie. But at the same time, my mother's family is Jewish, so we celebrate those big holidays and we eat all the delicious (.. somewhat delicious) Jewish foods. So I do have a strong culture in my Jewish heritage (Jews are a religion first, but there is definitely a strong culture within that).

It's important if it's important to you. Some people (99% of my friends) are very much "YEAH! IRELAND! WE'RE IRISH! WOO!" and some people probably don't give a good Goddamn. I think my family's history is really cool and love to learn about it.. but I identify with the mish mash American culture most of all.

If people ask my heritage, I say I'm a mutt. If they want to know more, they get the list. If they really want my history, then they can ask my dad.

Edit: Actually, that being said. Now that I'm in England, when people ask where I'm from, I immediately tell them I'm American and from Boston, MA. I told the lady who waxed my eyebrows that and she asked if I was Irish. I am not Irish, just to be clear, even though most people from Boston are. Haha.

[missroxor]

Americans, everyone's favorite idiots!... :rofl:
Brave of you to say so on a mixed forum. I would have to disagree now that I have an American son :lol:

But, seriously I think a lot of Americans don't see their own culture, or don't recognize it as a real culture.
I agree with this though, It's definitely the impression they give off to outsiders. A lot of Americans seem to cling to the identity of their anscestors and claim it as their own even when most of them have probably never been to their "homeland". I can totally understand someone feeling a connection to a place if it's where their grandparents or great grandparents came from but after that does it not start to fade in significance? If one great grandparent was Irish you could still call yourself 1/8 Irish but when you start going into the 1/16s and more it gets a bit rediculous IMO. It's still a part of your heritage, sure, but you can't really get away with calling yourself Irish anymore. :blink:

America is so diverse with many cultures all rolled into one. The anscestors that so many like to associate themselves with are what made America what it is today so if anything, I think they should embrace their new identity...yet so many of them would rather align themselves with a tiny little rock full of drunks and wife-beaters ( :jest: ) than own their own country's history and culture. I don't really get it.

[whiterider]

I can totally understand someone feeling a connection to a place if it's where their grandparents or great grandparents came from but after that does it not start to fade in significance?I'd agree with this. I know that on my Dad's side my family is thoroughly English, and there are Scots way back on my Mum's side, and I also have some Canadian relatives (though no actual ancestors - great aunts and second cousins and so on), but at the end of the day I can only really trace my cultural influences back two generations.

My grandparents grew up during the war, and this had an influence on them - particularly my maternal grandmother who was 18ish at the time, and in fact met my grandfather as a WREN. Via my grandmother and my mother I've picked up a lot of typical blitz-time Londoner attitudes - neurotic frugality and stiff upper lippedness and so on - but apart from that, whatever cultural identity I have has been shaped by what went on in the world around me as I was growing up. I'm sure that, had I not grown up in England, my cultural identity would be wildly different even if my ancestry was exactly the same.

Ancestry is an interesting topic, and it's certainly fascinating to learn one's heritage, but I'm not convinced that it necessarily counts for much in the real world.

[wickedblue]

Americans, everyone's favorite idiots!... :rofl:
But, seriously I think a lot of Americans don't see their own culture, or don't recognize it as a real culture.

America is a really big place and there's definitely some idiots in there but to say all Americans are idiots because of an anecdote is completely off base.

Can we discuss culture and heritage without resorting to cruel stereotypes?

I think whether or not it matters is completely up to the individual. For me, not being really close to my family, it's never much mattered to me at all. Though, there's certainly a curiosity. I know I have German and Irish heritage but that's as far as it goes for me.

[Purity4]

Well, I'm 50% Mexican and 50% Swiss, so can I still say I'm half Mexican and half Swiss if someone asks or should I say I'm American, even though I abhor nearly all traditionally American anythings?

Both my maternal grandparents were born in the US, but their parents were all four born in Switzerland, so memory of that place was recorded by my Grandmother in extensive family 'tree' binders she has compiled over the years.

[RoseCity]

America is a really big place and there's definitely some idiots in there but to say all Americans are idiots because of an anecdote is completely off base.

Can we discuss culture and heritage without resorting to cruel stereotypes?

I think whether or not it matters is completely up to the individual. For me, not being really close to my family, it's never much mattered to me at all. Though, there's certainly a curiosity. I know I have German and Irish heritage but that's as far as it goes for me.

I'm also an American and I was actually being sarcastic/joking. I'm sincerely sorry though if you took offense. One of my skills is being obnoxious.

I noticed when my kids were growing up, there was a lot of focus in the schools on ethnic heritage and the whole thing of 'nobody is from here, everybody is from somewhere else'. Also a lot of interest in the immigrant experience, Ellis Island, etc. I wonder if that will change now that there's so much anti-immigrant sentiment.

[missroxor]

...'nobody is from here, everybody is from somewhere else'.
Hmm...I guess I never thought of it like that. I mean I knew that but I didn't know that Americans thought of themselves that way to the extent that they drum it in at school. That said, a long time ago the Scottish gene pool was diluted by Norse men but I don't consider myself to be a Viking :lol:

[RoseCity]

Hmm...I guess I never thought of it like that. I mean I knew that but I didn't know that Americans thought of themselves that way to the extent that they drum it in at school. That said, a long time ago the Scottish gene pool was diluted by Norse men but I don't consider myself to be a Viking :lol:

Yeah, I'm wondering if that girl who thought she was from Scotland that you mentioned (besides being an idiot) didn't receive such indoctrination.

Edit: It should've been 'nobody is from here, except Native Americans...."
(Sorry Native Americans.)

[Purity4]

It should've been 'nobody is from here, except Native Americans...."
(Sorry Native Americans.)

That's what I always say.

[geallach]

America is so diverse with many cultures all rolled into one. The anscestors that so many like to associate themselves with are what made America what it is today so if anything, I think they should embrace their new identity...yet so many of them would rather align themselves with a tiny little rock full of drunks and wife-beaters ( :jest: ) than own their own country's history and culture. I don't really get it.

While we are on the subject of stereotypes, we Irish are plagued with the stereotypes of being drunks and wife-beaters, and it is no more amusing for us to be on the receiving end of it than it would be for any country with a negative stereotype.

I am Irish, as I said; I was born here, and as far back as I can trace, my ancestors were Irish. Heritage is very important to me, but I agree that its worth is usually a matter for the individual, which in some respects I find quite saddening, because today's society seems to be becoming much more bland as individual cultures give way to 'Western' culture. The lack of concern for heritage generally here is aiding the declination of our national language, Gaeilge (Gaelic is Scottish), because so many people are not bothered if it dies out. In this scenario, the fact that many individuals do not personally care about their heritage means that Irish will eventually become a dead tongue.

We get countless tourists here every year claiming to be 'Irish' because they believe they have an Irish surname (could actually be British, Welsh, Scottish or German, or just have an "O" in front), or have a fraction of Irish blood, or because they believe their ancestors must have come from Ireland, along with those who do have Irish ancestry. It is wonderful to see genuine interest in Irish culture; it is something I would heartily encourage and would gladly assist anyone who wanted to know more about it, but some tourists come here with a very vague idea of Irish culture and almost as little respect. Some talk about the "potatoe" famine as though there is something amusing about it. My father was once asked by an American family if the whole island had electricity yet...It would make you cry with frustration. I myself have been contradicted by tourists on a number of occassions because they think they know more about my country than I do. I even encountered one person (not in Ireland) who denied that there was any Irish language and they "should know, being Irish." o_0 Then there is the accursed alcohol and our eternal association with it, but we realise that tourists who come here and happily throw that one in your face do not really understand Irish culture. Irish culture and heritage is very rich, and deserves more respect than it gets.

[fakepeeps7]

It should've been 'nobody is from here, except Native Americans...."
(Sorry Native Americans.)

And, technically, they're not "from here", either.

Pretty much everybody on the planet is an immigrant of some sort. It's just a question of when your family arrived: 10 years ago or 10,000 years ago!

[Volvenom]

'nobody is from here, everybody is from somewhere else'.

that's actually kind of funny for me. I'm a Norwegian Viking. I can trace my familiy back to the 800 in this country (if we skip a few rules of evidence, lol)

But Norwegans came to this country after the ice age some 10k years ago. So we haven't been living here that long either, so we also come from somewhere else :p

[Astraea Nevermore]

I always found my culture and heritage to be interesting when it comes to history and pure knowledge, but I don't like to let my life being completely influenced by it.
I'm basically 90% italian, and I might have somewhat asian/indian/eastern influences somewhere in my family tree, but I don't know for sure, as it's something that goes really back in time. However, I generally like to take a look back at my culture mainly because I like to study, maybe discove funny or mysterious stories about my ancestors, when I get the occasion to know some.

But, even if I basically know what my heritage is supposed to be, I still feel I don't really "fit in": there are many things that are part of italian traditions that don't really go with my personality, and I happen to be influenced by many different cultures that have nothing to do with my origins. So, I agree with the others saying that culture, heritage and tradition are important if you feel them to be important. To me, it's more of a matter of study than a real influence ;)