Unbearable lag in my custom world - Found Problem

[Alan_Gast]

Hey! I was testing my world, and after a few hours of sim playing, it began to lag so badly it froze, and continues to completely freeze when playing on full speed. I've been downsizing the amount of spawners and effects, but it is making no difference whatsoever.

Would it be the custom ini that is causing it? I don't think this is the case however as the previous version was using the China ini files and played beautifully (although there was no spawners placed or routing.) I don't think it is a routing problem either, because it shouldn't kick in after like, two sim hours. I guess I have a lot of spawners, but I removed over half of them and gameplay was exactly the same.

I'm sure this is a problem unique to my world too, as I opened up Sunset Valley and it plays really well, even on maxed settings.

This is beyond unfortunate as I have to stall my beta release of the world, and since my holidays are over I will not be able to work on the world properly until summer.

I'd be willing to upload my caw files if you guys think it would help. Thanks in advance!

[simsample]

Most common cause of lag is a stuck sims somewhere; easiest way to find them is by using some mods to diagnose. For example, if you use Twallan's Story Progression you can see where all sims are by the map tags. And if you use Overwatch, you can check for stuck sims:
http://sims3newyork.blogspot.co.uk/2011/09/twallan-comes-through-yet-again.html

Here are some things to look for with your routing:
http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?t=439329

And this might help regarding lot routing:
http://modthesims.info/showpost.php?p=3438734&postcount=395

The ini files wouldn't be a cause of lag, unless you have it set to do something silly like change weather every 2 minutes. Someone said they had lag when using a very large sun/ moon radius also.

If you can't find the problem then yes, you can upload the CAW files and I'll take a look to see if I can see anything. :)

[SharaRose]

Routing issues do sound likely, but also keep in mind that the game will also be generating sims and assigning roles when you start an unpopulated world. It's tough to get a feel for how your world is really running during the population and hiring boom, especially if there are lots of bars and registers to staff. I've nearly trashed large worlds only to find the issues were merely birth pangs and not true performance problems.

You can speed this process by generating the full testing population at once with Awesomemod's "spawnmoreoverlords." Give it a few sim days to settle down, with NRAA's Overwatch checking for unroutable sims, and you'll have a better idea what your performance baseline really is.

[Alan_Gast]

Thanks so much guys! I'll have a look this evening, and if it comes to it, I'll upload the files. :)

[Alan_Gast]

Hey! Sorry to double post, but I feel like this is an important follow up!

I booted up CAW today and decided to delete the spawner and effects layers to see if they were causing any problems. Well, sure enough, the lag was still there so obviously it is a routing issue.

I'm happy that I can put in some more effects and things, but I guess I'll have to redo the routing completely as I don't know what's causing the problem specifically seeing as the game will just freeze at 9am sim time. Also, now they won't go over the damn bridges! BTW, is there any quick way to get rid of routing paint quickly in CAW? The world is big, and I'm too lazy to even think about completely removing the paint, then re-applying it again, lol. Also, quick question, do you have to put non routing paint on water?

Also, I can't run awesomemod anymore ( :( ) as I'm not patched (I'm scared that if I do, CAW won't work as there's no way in hell I'm buying SHT, and we all know what happens to CAW when new EP's come out!)

Thanks for the help, guys! I have boring times ahead in my world creation, though! :cry:

[Jasumi]

I have the newest 1.33 Showtime patch and my older worlds still worked in CAW.

Also, now they won't go over the damn bridges!

Did you by chance put any routing paint near the roads? Are they 100% connected properly, too?

BTW, is there any quick way to get rid of routing paint quickly in CAW?

Use a giant brush? lol Only quick way I know of...

[SharaRose]

Hey! Sorry to double post, but I feel like this is an important follow up!

I booted up CAW today and decided to delete the spawner and effects layers to see if they were causing any problems. Well, sure enough, the lag was still there so obviously it is a routing issue.

I'm happy that I can put in some more effects and things, but I guess I'll have to redo the routing completely as I don't know what's causing the problem specifically seeing as the game will just freeze at 9am sim time. Also, now they won't go over the damn bridges! BTW, is there any quick way to get rid of routing paint quickly in CAW? The world is big, and I'm too lazy to even think about completely removing the paint, then re-applying it again, lol. Also, quick question, do you have to put non routing paint on water?

Also, I can't run awesomemod anymore ( :( ) as I'm not patched (I'm scared that if I do, CAW won't work as there's no way in hell I'm buying SHT, and we all know what happens to CAW when new EP's come out!)

Thanks for the help, guys! I have boring times ahead in my world creation, though! :cry:Are your bridges still connected? Importing height maps will disconnect them from the roads.

Before doing anything hasty, might as well upload the CAW files and see if someone can spot something specific that can help, and save you some time. I'm willing to take a look tonight, if you like.

[simsample]

You could possibly remove all of the routing paint by deleting the routing resources and having them regenerate, but of course backup before doing so!
0x05CD4BB3 World Routing
0x05DA8AF6 World boundaries

[Alan_Gast]

Did you by chance put any routing paint near the roads?

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/1nt3rc3pt0r/Meme/ohgodwhy.jpg

I've just realised that I probably covered below the bridges with non routable paint. :faceslap: Well, thanks for that, Jasumi! :D

Oh, and as regards deleting the routing paint, I guess I'll just stop being lazy, hehe. But @simsample, I'll totally try that! Sounds like it has potential! (P.S. I love your avatar! I didn't notice the blinking for a long time. )

@SharaRose Would you? Great, thanks! Here ya go: <files be gone!> (Sorry, the file is large because I put a backup w/o the ini files in the rar.)

[simsample]

I've just realised that I probably covered below the bridges with non routable paint.
Hehe, that used to work a few EPs ago, but lately it doesn't. That could be your problem, especially if the route spline of the bridge dips beneath the terrain.

[SharaRose]

Very cool world! The layout gives the impression that it's absolutely immense, but the space is so well planned out that nothing feels too empty or two crowded. It's gorgeous.

I checked it out and will PM some images to help fix the routing. I changed one section and saved it under another name just to compare processes, but I'm patched so that might not do much good.

Some of the general things to help routing would be:

Make sure every bridge-to-road connection is showing a light blue square.

With "show routing" on, make sure every routing dot connects to the other dots so sims aren't stranded there.

Use unroutable paint under big deco items like piles of rocks so routing issues don't crop up where they can't be seen.

Where there are a bunch of trees or plants grouped, some unroutable paint underneath will keep the routing stable. Where there are lots of trees right near the edge of the routable area, might as well make them part of the unroutable area to save some processing.

Make sure no set of routing dots is ever routed through just one dot. This gives sims an escape route if one path is blocked. Also, if you have twenty sims getting ready to leave for work processing their paths all through the same point, it will slow things down. (The latter point is something Pescado mentioned on MATY awhile back.)

Trying to get all the routing points connected when using the circle brush can be a real pain. If you have "show routing" on, you'll see that the routing leans toward creating a grid when nothing is in the way. If you paint within the squares of that grid as much as possible, the routing paths will tend to be much cleaner, which saves a ton of time. It's probably better to create straight lines wherever possible and give up some of the nuances of the terrain. After all, you'll probably be using "Go Here" in open spaces, not at the very edges of the terrain, so the difference isn't noticeable in play.

Things that might be issues, but I'm not sure [bat signal, simsample!]:

Does there need to be a clear routing path on either side of the road? In a few places, guardrails right up to the road might be blocking routing. I usually try to get smooth lines on both sides of the road, but I'm not sure that's necessary. (I assume a buffer around lots is good too - or can unroutable paint go right up to the lot edge?)

There is an island that is not connected to any other land. Will a teleporter or subway be okay, or will the other sims in the world keep trying to route to or from there and fail, causing lag?

Where there is a single bridge between areas, might queues back up? I don't think it's an issue for vehicles on the road, but am curious.

Can an unconnected road piece, painted unroutable, still cause routing issues?

[simsample]

Does there need to be a clear routing path on either side of the road?
Not necessarily, I've noticed that sims will still walk along the road okay even with the path obstructed, and that they will cross over if the footpath is blocked on one side. As long as the road spline is intact it seems to be okay. I would be wary about blocking the footpath on both sides of the road, though.
(I assume a buffer around lots is good too - or can unroutable paint go right up to the lot edge?
Yes, I always leave room for sims to move right around lots so that they can enter and exit on all sides. There is one lot in China that has routing paint beneath the lot so that sims can only access it from one side, and that seems to cause problems with sims routefailing to reach that lot.

There is an island that is not connected to any other land. Will a teleporter or subway be okay, or will the other sims in the world keep trying to route to or from there and fail, causing lag?
That depends upon what is on that lot. If there are no lots on that island, then non-playable sims will never try to autonomously reach that lot (unless perhaps you have a spawner on there, and use a mod which pushes collecting). However, if you have a lot which is zoned as an accessible lot then non-playables will try to visit that lot autonomously and will routefail. If you place a lot on there make sure it is no visitors allowed or Hidden tomb with no rabbithole buildings, as those lots will not be visited autonomously. If you have a subway or dive well then sims will not use those autonomously unless you mod the XMLs, so sims will ignore those unless you direct them. Of course, it is still possible for NPCs and service sims to spawn on this island, and then to routefail when they try to escape. But from what I've seen this happens very seldom, and when it does you can easily reset the affected sim to send them back off world. In Jericho I've had this happen once in 60 sim weeks of playing, and I have two inaccessible islands with hidden tombs on them. It's just a question of whether the inaccessible island adds more gameplay value to the world than the possibility of stranded sims detracts.

Where there is a single bridge between areas, might queues back up? I don't think it's an issue for vehicles on the road, but am curious.
I've not seen any issues with that, although two possible routes are always better then one. Vehicles don't pile up, the faster ones just go through the slower ones.

Can an unconnected road piece, painted unroutable, still cause routing issues?
In my tests, no- if a road has route paint beneath it then it is unroutable and sims will not attempt to access it. However, lone bridges do seem to be an issue- NPCs can spawn on a disconneted bridge, and get stranded.

[Alan_Gast]

Hey guys! I'm happy to see that the lagging related to routing has been completely solved! A giant thank you to both simsample for all of your suggestions that were pretty much all a contributing factor, to SharaRose for making the big effort of checking it out in CAW (which proved crucial to obliterate lag!) and to Jasumi for letting me know about the bridge routing. How the hell did I miss that!? :faceslap:

But, this question is directed at simsample: While there are no routing related lagging issues, there are some lag issues that are caused by the inis. I'm pretty sure they are causing the minor lag as I set up my TAB camera and left it pointed at the sky on full speed. When the ini changes from partly cloudy - stormy - custom, etc, the game will stutter and freeze for a few minutes. I've had these three settings in one day:

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz216/alanmcdiddy/Screenshot-371.jpg

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz216/alanmcdiddy/Screenshot-390.jpg

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz216/alanmcdiddy/Screenshot-400.jpg

I guess it's controlled by probability weights, but:

->How sensitive are these settings? The custom weather is really overwhelming and bizarre, so I don't think I'd like it with other weather very often! I mean, how often is the water neon purple!

->Which order are the Sanctuary ini files in? Which one corresponds to custom, partly cloudy, etc...

->Can I have one weather setting a day by changing the probability weights to .1?

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz216/alanmcdiddy/Screenshot-405.jpg

Also, the sims would much rather use the subways than the bridges. They can walk on bridges, but if I want to send them into town, they'd use the subways rather than the bridges, even if the bridges are nearer. Is this an issue, or sims just being their key-rayzee selfs?

A really heartfelt thank you to you guys! I don't have to abandon hours of work thanks to you! :giggler:

[simsample]

But, this question is directed at simsample: While there are no routing related lagging issues, there are some lag issues that are caused by the inis. I'm pretty sure they are causing the minor lag as I set up my TAB camera and left it pointed at the sky on full speed. When the ini changes from partly cloudy - stormy - custom, etc, the game will stutter and freeze for a few minutes. Can I make the weather changes less dynamic?
The weather change has that slight lag in the unmodded game too. For the basegame, Sunset Valley has an 8 hour weather randomize interval, and the clear and partly cloudy skies have such a great chance of appearing that you seldom see other weathers (and so seldom have the lag as the game reads the files when the sky changes). Also, unless you reload the game you probably won't see clouds due to a game bug; so players of worlds with non-custom sky will seldom see the cloud layer rendered.

To make your lag less obvious, you could increase the weather randomize interval, and also make one weather type more probable. For the basegame, clear is at 0.2 probability weight and cloudy at 0.35; the others are at zero. If you were to set your preferred weather to 1 and the others to smaller figures, you should see predominantly one type of sky.

I've had these three settings in one day:

I guess it has something to do with probability settings, but how would I change these? The custom weather is really overwhelming and bizarre, so I don't think I'd like it with other weather very often! I mean, how often is the water neon purple, hehe. ;)
If you don't like that colour ramp, why not substitute it for another or else create your own? That looks like one from Bridgeport, so yes, you could make it improbable, but far better to make one you would like to see. :)

Also, the sims would much rather use the subways than the bridges. They can walk on bridges, but if I want to send them into town, they'd use the subways rather than the bridges, even if the bridges are nearer. Is this an issue, or sims just being their key-rayzee selfs?
In the unmodded game, your playable sims will use subways as part of the route if they can, when they don't own a vehicle. If they own a vehicle, they will preferentially use that, so try buying them a car. Otherwise, you would need to mod the XML that governs travel.