Tip Jars

[Psy10]

I refuse to tip at places like Starbucks, pizza places, etc... if I'm doing a take away order. There is no reason why I need to tip someone making 9.50 an hour. I only tip service people such as waiters, taxi drivers, and the like. We don't go to McDonald's and tip so why should we do it at Starbucks? I'm not upset with the tip jar but I am upset about what happened yesterday on my way to Uni. So I asked for my order, gave a five, and would you believe that the barista took it upon herself to dump MY change in the tip jar. She handed me the bills and wished me a good day. I just stood there and waited. She then asked me if something was wrong and I said, "Yes. You need to give me my change back!" She said that she did that regularly and no one had a problem with it. I told her to get the manager and I had him fish my change out. You don't ever take it upon yourself to decide what you're going to do with someone else's money. My first and last time going to that SB.

Do you believe in tip jars?

[Chelleypie]

I'm like you - I tip people who make less than minimum and live on tips, such as wait staff. But what that barista did was just plain rude. You don't just assume your customers want their change in the jar. I work at a restaurant that's not fast food, but not sit and wait food either. We keep a little tub out for pennies. Some people throw all their change in there, others borrow and return the change later, and some ignore it. But I'd never take it upon myself (I work the register) to put my customers' change in there! If they wanna put it in there, they'll put it in there. And to top it all off, the girl should never have just said 'I do this all the time and no one cares'. It doesn't matter what you do all the time, it matters what THAT customer wants. The one standing before you, having just paid your salary by frequenting your establishment!

-breathes- Sorry. But no. No tip jars. I also don't believe that wait staff should have to share their tips with busers and hostesses. Wait staff live on tips. In Louisiana, they make $2.15 hourly. I was a waitress for a while, and I made less on my paycheck than I did in tips.

[Tsi]

I think that people do hard work and even if they are paid $ 9.50 an hour for a lot of them working at these places it doesn't recompense. I agree that dumping your change into the jar is definately not, and never, okay. But I would leave tips with my leftover change unless they had slow or really bad service because I know it's the right thing to do to help people out. So I think tip jars are needed. I always think about the people who have a family and work at starbucks to support them. When you have a few kids and a household depending on you, 9.50 doesn't always cut it. (That doesn't mean I don't tip people at minimum wage- I know they need it more) So that's why I lean twords giving tips to the people who are older and nice usually because I know a lot of time their supporting themselves or others. But this is just my reasoning, I tottaly understand why you guys think they are wrong. I think they should be there just incase someone wants to contribute to help someone even if they make more than minimum wage. Besdes it's not like I dump everything in there, just some change or some dollars.

[Psy10]

So do you tip the cashiers at Wal-Mart or Home Depot? They get a lot of crap as well. Where do we draw the line? I will continue to not tip at SB because I feel it is unnecessary. You are enabling this type of behaviour. We live in the type of society where it's okay to underpay workers and have them rely on the consumers. I've never had a problem tipping 20 or even 25% to waiters especially since I always get great service anyway. Why does a barista who takes less then a minute to get me a frap. think she deserves a dollar tip? What have you done to go above regular customer service?

It really does boggle my mind.

[HystericalParoxysm]

For professions that rely on tip-based wages, like wait staff, I -always- tip. Yes, they do have a minimum wage and if they don't make enough tips, their employer is supposed to have a low level minimum that they get, but it's not enough to pay the bills.

I don't mind other service-related jobs that may not be wage-based (I don't know if baristas normally are or not) accepting voluntary tips, and if it's something like a barista or sandwich counter, I don't mind there being a tip jar. I don't want to get dirty looks if I want to keep my change, and that barista that dumped your change without asking was WAY overstepping, but if I normally have a little bit of change left it's easier for me to dump it in the jar than carry around a bunch of change, and that 25 cents that doesn't mean much to me will add up over the course of a day to someone who is working in that kind of wage bracket.

Now, in other service jobs where it's not something you think would come up and it's not tip-based, I don't think it's a bad idea to tip if someone goes out of their way to really help you. I used to work a job where, among my other duties, I would teach classes and occasionally be called upon to escort specific high-dollar customers through the store to help them shop (someone who wants to drop several hundred on beading supplies for their kids but doesn't know what to buy) and in those circumstances - after teaching a good class or helping someone for several hours purchase a huge pile of merchandise - I would gladly accept their tips. I'd gone out of my way to provide excellent and personal service, and if someone's dropping $600 on beads, if they want to kick $40 to me for being so nice and helpful, I ain't gonna argue. Should they feel obligated? Absolutely not - I would have helped anyway, just as happily, but someone with that kind of money to throw around paying for a nice dinner for me? I have no problem with that... nor would I have a problem with giving someone an extra few bucks if they helped me especially well, assuming I was giving it freely, not just filling an open and waiting palm.

[HCAC]

Okay, I may be clueless but I rarely see tip jars. I'm in NY, so maybe the management is afraid someone will steal it or just scoff (we scoff a lot here). :)

As far as tipping when I go to a meal, I do kind of resent it, being a frugal nonworking stay at home mom. Again, I feel it's the evil owner not paying the person a living wage which should not be compensated by the 'guest.' However, I always do tip, unless I have a horrible waitress.

[ayshala]

For professions that rely on tip-based wages, like wait staff, I -always- tip. Yes, they do have a minimum wage and if they don't make enough tips, their employer is supposed to have a low level minimum that they get, but it's not enough to pay the bills.

I don't mind other service-related jobs that may not be wage-based (I don't know if baristas normally are or not) accepting voluntary tips, and if it's something like a barista or sandwich counter, I don't mind there being a tip jar.

I worked for five years as a Barista. I have no idea what SB pays in other areas, but around here, it isn't much. When I worked at a coffee/sandwich house I made a tiny bit above minimun wage. Nowhere near 9.50$!!!!!!! So we had the tip jar at the counter. This allowed people we waited on to give us a "mini tip". I would take the order, make the coffee and sandwich, and serve it. Not enough for someone to leave a 15% tip on the table really, but enough for someone to leave a 50 cent tip in our jar. That way it isn't an "insulting" tip, but a mini tip that doesnt get judged.

As far as the Barista putting your change in the tip jar, NEVER! Hell, in my second Barista job I would have been outright FIRED for doing something like that. I mean, right away. You woulda called my boss, had em fish out the change, and watched me get my walking papers.

I never expected anyone to tip. But it was nice when they did. We worked our butts off there. And when a runner came in for a buisiness meeting and ordered ten mochas, it was nice that they tipped, because thats a big order during a busy lunch.

[Haylifer]

Restaurants I always tip the right amount (supposed to be something like 15% of the total bill). In shops I'll say "Keep the change" for amounts up to £1 depending how much I've spent in the shop. I always tip if there's a tip jar, even in the cafe at work.. mostly because I feel obliged to, rather than want to. A bit like homeless people, I swear I have some form of OCD around them. I have to give them money, it's ridiculous but I feel like I have to or I'm mean. I wouldn't be happy if someone took a tip off me without my permission, that's stealing and therefore means they're doing a bad job. But if they're doing an alright job, I'm happy to tip them.

[ChihoSan]

I'm a barista at Starbucks and I was always under the impression that baristas get paid $8-10 an hour as well. Well we don't. We get paid more than waitresses but I only get $7.00 an hour and as I'm working part time that means my paychecks are about $250. It's really not a lot of money and with tips factored in I get an extra $40-50 in cash a week and that really really helps. I don't know why Walmart and things would expect you to tip, all they do is ring items, I've worked there too but I know at Starbucks we get really really stressed out from constantly having large lines, people who order Triple Venti 1/2 pump sugarfree Vanilla 3 pump mocha breve with whip mochas and then breathe over our necks (or crowd the bar), ignore the 14 customers (which means at least 14 drinks) ahead of them and then get huffy because we can't do the drink in 10 seconds. No I don't think you owe me $2 per order because I'm stressed but if your total is 4.73 and you want to give the extra 27 cents it really really adds up for us and makes the job seem more worth it. Besides a lot of the times people come in and we're very nice and we've made friends with some of these people.

[ayshala]

Why does a barista who takes less then a minute to get me a frap. think she deserves a dollar tip? What have you done to go above regular customer service?

It really does boggle my mind.


Woh I missed this part! Any Barista who takes less than a minute to make you a frap is kicking butt and really fast! Assuming she is making it, and not just getting it from a frig. Then she is really slow to take a minute to grab something from a fridge. Otherwise brewing coffee, milk, and mixing and serving in a minute? Thats a skilled person!

[Shenanigans_SC]

I personally don't do starbucks. Nothing against the chain, but I'm a stay at home mom of four children, we can't afford five dollar coffees.

But this has my mind sort of boggled. Way back when I was a teen, my first job was at a fast food place. Many times after taking the order and ringing the person up as a cashier, I'd have to drop the food in the fryer, make a milk shake, bag the food, get the drinks. I don't understand how running around to four different stations to get an order of fast food is much different than running around to different stations making a coffee drink. Yet you don't see those people expecting tips, and they sure don't get paid any more than someone at Starbucks. Boy, could I tell stories about the garbage I put up with at the drive through window. Why is it that a Barista expects those tips, yet your fast food worker does not?

[Psy10]

To ChihoSan:

How come you deleted your third post? I was trying to respond to it. Anyway, if she had done half of what you just wrote not only would she deserve the tip, I would come back to that SB every time. However, if I walk in, order, get my order, and none of what you wrote occurred. This barista did not go above the norm so neither will I.

I don't understand how running around to four different stations to get an order of fast food is much different than running around to different stations making a coffee drink. Yet you don't see those people expecting tips, and they sure don't get paid any more than someone at Starbucks. Boy, could I tell stories about the garbage I put up with at the drive through window. Why is it that a Barista expects those tips, yet your fast food worker does not?
Exactly!

I mean I can go into BK order a W.J with extra pickles (9 to be exact), onions thinly sliced, one tomato slice, extra lettuce, and light mayo and yet I still wouldn't be obligated to tip.

[ayshala]

Hmm, I wonder about this Fast Food/ Barista tip thing.

I think since Coffee Shops began as "local gathering places" and community hubs, they have a different place than a fast food restaurant. How many Burger Kings do you know that bring in local artists on weekends, or display local artwork, or know 90% of the customers by name?

Fast food is an industrialized serving group. Get it fast, get it cheap, get in, get out. Everything is standardized. You "make" the milkshake, sure. But most fast food places I've seen are just a bunch of buttons. You get the cup, push the button, put it under the mixer, push the button, and serve.

At my coffee shop (not a chain), it took a LONG time and alot of skill before someone was allowed to make coffee. Nothing standardized. I have to do it all myself and the quality will depend on my skill, not on the machine. How I tilt my hand and how cold I have the milk will effect the foam. How well I dampen and grind each serving will effect the coffee. It all depends on my skill as a barista. Then I would get chewed out if a dare forget a regular customers favorite order. They expect to come in and pay, without even ordering, and I have to remember if this person wanted a double capp with nutmeg to go, or a single americano with whipcream to stay

I know some SB that try to foster this "old, community" feeling.....but I cant speak for all. I can only speak for local coffee shops.

[kinneer_SC]

I have had a similar experience in a restaurant once. I went to pay my bill and the waitress took my money and that was it. I was made to look an idiot standing there waiting for my change and it took her a few seconds to realise I was expecting my change my back.

I don't mind tipping but it is at my discretion to leave or not. I also find it very rude when they ask me when paying what I would like to leave as a tip.

The etiquette should be the customer pays and the entire change is returned to the customer. The customer then decide how much to leave, unless they ask for a specific amount to be added as tip.

[ayshala]

I have had a similar experience in a restaurant once. I went to pay my bill and the waitress took my money and that was it. I was made to look an idiot standing there waiting for my change and it took her a few seconds to realise I was expecting my change my back.



I can't believe all this. I don't care if you are a waitress at a fancy restaurant and everyone is expected to leave a tip........you still give them all the change and wait for them to decide the tip! Unless it's one of those places that adds an automatic 15% grat. charge, obviousely. Like I said, I don't think tip jars are wrong......but in any situation, it is the customer who decides!! I don't care if it is a single penny! I'll take it then give it back if I want to, but the penny is mine.
I'd almost be tempted, if I were one of you, to go back to that place and server and order huge amounts then not tip at all. I don't think thats right, but they almost deserve it for being so presumptiouse! I LOVED getting tips, it helped out with gas money. But if someone didnt tip they got the same service as anyone else. I admit, the buisiness men who give two dollars for every coffee get a little better "familliar" service. Just because it is easier to remember their preferences when they are throwing money at you. But I would never do that on purpose! And I understood that someone like a nursing student couldn't tip like that even if they wanted to!

[Haylifer]

Nobody tips their doctor for saving their life. But then again, doctors earn a lot anyway.. but still.. Nobody tips the paramedic! They don't earn that much!

If someone takes money that is rightfully yours without permission, then it's theft and they are actually breaking the law ;P

[shaedigga]

While I don't have a problem with Tip Jars what that girl did was completely out of line and should reflect solely on her.

I tip at starbucks because my barista asks me how my mother is doing. They don't do that at burger king. My drink has like 78 steps from my milk choice to my temperature my drink is custom made. At burger king they pour folgers in a cup with 2 creamers and some sugar packets. I've never gotten stuck at BK because the cashier was having a very interesting conversation with me, however that always happens to me at starbucks for some reason.

[Slytherin-Girl]

I'm a sever myself, and I'm rather appaled that someone would just take anyone's money and not give it back.

When I go to get the bill, I always say "I'll be right back with your change". Then if the customer says "No it's ok, I don't need any" I'll smile and say thank you, have a nice day etc. If they don't I'll give them their change and wait for them to decide to tip me or not. It's their choice, not mine. I'd never dream of taking someone's money like that, even if it is customary to leave a tip.

[HCAC]

I made $6.50 an hour as a preschool teacher and no one ever care if I had gas money, clothes money, or drinking money. :) Certain jobs just don't pay well.

Point being, it's not the customer's responsibility to meet the shortcomings of your paycheck.

However, I do agree that if you hang out somewhere, be it a coffee house, diner or whatever you probably will tip decently so they remember you or just don't foul your drink or food next time they see you!

[Chelleypie]

Technically, where I work is considered 'fast food' by most standards. Although we make it fresh to order (short of chicken, which we fry in mass and leave under a warming light.), it's cheap and fast. Catfish takes the longest at 7-8 minutes an order. I know at least 80% of my customers by first name. These people know I have a two year old, am in school, and even know my school schedule - Tues/Thurs, starting at 8 AM, because I'm not working when I'm in school. Yet I do not anticipate a tip. Why should a barista at Starbucks? Because they go 'above and beyond'? So do I. Yet I do not anticipate a tip. Sometimes I get them. But I don't expect them.

By the way, I make $6 an hour.

[kinneer_SC]

However, I do agree that if you hang out somewhere, be it a coffee house, diner or whatever you probably will tip decently so they remember you or just don't foul your drink or food next time they see you!

Now you make it sound like protection money. :)

[soapstar]

i think the tipping culture is out of control. i don't mind it at restaurants, but i hate that it's being expected everywhere from airports, to hotels, to coffee shops.

when i lived in montreal it was the worst. almost everyone i encountered expected twice the tax, which is something outrageous like 10%+.

although i shouldn't complain. i've heard in certain 3rd world countries the percentage is a lot higher, mandatory, and called a bribe.

[beeps]

Well I hate coffee, so I dont have much of a problem with not tipping baristas simply because I never find myself at a Starbucks or Caribou Coffee. BUT Im agreeing with the general consensus that dropping your change into the tip jar without asking is out of line and extremely rude.

My older sister worked as a server for many years, so Im obligated to tip at least 20% every time I eat out (otherwise she would kick my ass). I dont mind tipping servers, mainly because I remember how happy my sister would be when she came home with a wad of tips after her 10 hour shift. Serving is a tough job - one I would never want - so I feel happy when I get to make someone's day by slipping them an unexpected $12 tip on a $30 dinner bill.

As far as the whole debate about tip jars... I dont care if theyre there, just know that if you take my change without asking you might lose a finger.

[babicatz05]

I tip baristas in the drive thru coffee stands because I know it gets really hectic working in there all by yourself serving two carpools at once. I helped my cousin out sometimes at work and split the measly tips. I could never do it by myself unless I was payed well or tipped well. I AM NOT DISSING ALL CATHOLICS. But the catholic people on Sundays all stopped there and hardly tipped for the 5 bev's each carfull ordered. But the Starbucks people have about 2-5 people at each stand so I hardly think they need tips. Just the stand where there's only one girl doing everything at once

[Synthesis]

I'm suddenly glad I don't go to Starbucks.

When I do order coffee, it's usually at Dunkin' Donuts, along with their signature product. I will periodically tip $1 (though not on every time), for an order of a dozen or half-dozen donuts.

Part of the reason I only do it on occasion is because it takes about two minutes, at most, for my order to be made. They use the open-jar method there, and I'm not against it.

I do tip at restaurants, though I have a clever trick for keeping my tips at a minimum--namely, I order very cheap food when I eat out. Tipping $1 is being pretty generous when your order only came to about $6.50.

I can certainly appreciate that a lot of professions rely on tips to survive--it's rather sad, but it is a reality, and I can't be certain which restaurants actually pay their workers a decent salary and which don't. So, I always tip at restaurants, almost always regardless of service. So long as my food didn't come with a roach crawling about in it, and it was the right general order, I'll tolerate it. I don't go to a restaurant to be personable with strangers--I go for food.

Personally, my last consumer-industry job did not allow for tipping--would have been nice, considering it was minimum wage at the time.

[shaedigga]

I made $6.50 an hour as a preschool teacher and no one ever care if I had gas money, clothes money, or drinking money. :) Certain jobs just don't pay well.

Point being, it's not the customer's responsibility to meet the shortcomings of your paycheck.

However, I do agree that if you hang out somewhere, be it a coffee house, diner or whatever you probably will tip decently so they remember you or just don't foul your drink or food next time they see you!


You can't even compare the two. Working in a preschool you are guaranteed to make minimum wage. Servers are not.Unless you are a server their isn't another job in this country that can legally pay you $2.16 an hour. Comparing your $6.50 an hour job to serving is asinine when you're making almost triple what they make.

[crocobaura]

Meh, we don't have tip jars, we have charity boxes, from McDonalds to pizza places and supermarkets. But the person behind the register always gives you the money and it's up to you if you take the change or put it in the box. Anyway, I agree with you that what that woman did was rude and inconsiderate. For rich businesspeople, some change may not mean much, but for students living on limited funds that's a whole different story. And it wasn't her money to decide how to use it.

[Stormy_SC]

I don't like tipping, but I do it anyway because I know first-hand how it feels to be working at those fast-food places and restaurants. Although I don't tip if I know that their minimum wage is a bit higher than others or if that particular person is just being a jerk.

In southern California, if a fast-food place gives their employees a high minimum wage such as $9-$10/per hour, then they won't ask for a tip. But I have noticed that all Starbucks have those tip jars. I've never been to one where the cashier has took it upon herself to dump my change into the jar. I think that's totally wrong and I would've complained to the manager as well.

[romyhorse]

I'm glad you complained to the manager, they will think twice about doing it again (I hope!).

Thankfully tipping isn't such a big deal here in the UK, but I think in the US it's gone too far. A friend was on holiday in America with a group of friends. They had a meal at a restaurant and he paid by credit card. He didn't add a tip as he was going to leave a cash tip at the table. Next thing he knew the chef came out of the kitchen and started threatening him! I think that is just totally ridiculous, even if he hadn't wanted to leave a tip that was his perogative and being threatened by the chef isn't going to do the restaurant any favours.

[Rabid]

I hate coins. I don't know why and I don't really have a good reason, but I just do. So sometimes when I buy something and get coins back as part of my change, I'll dump it in the donation jar, whether it be a jar with a philanthropy purpose or one for tipping the cashiers, simply because I don't want to have to deal with them. Other than that, I typically don't donate to those little jars unless it's for a good cause. Most of the places where I see tip jars aren't usually places where it's common to tip- Starbucks, retail stores, etc. I only bother tipping where it's common to tip and if the service has been good, like at restaurants, salons, hotels, etc.

[Stormy_SC]

I'm glad you complained to the manager, they will think twice about doing it again (I hope!).

Thankfully tipping isn't such a big deal here in the UK, but I think in the US it's gone too far. A friend was on holiday in America with a group of friends. They had a meal at a restaurant and he paid by credit card. He didn't add a tip as he was going to leave a cash tip at the table. Next thing he knew the chef came out of the kitchen and started threatening him! I think that is just totally ridiculous, even if he hadn't wanted to leave a tip that was his perogative and being threatened by the chef isn't going to do the restaurant any favours.

What state was this? :blink: The only place I've ever heard of someone doing that (and it was a waitress) was in Los Angeles, California at Roscoe's Chicken and Waffles. I hate that place with a passion! The waiters and waitresses there are mean and the restaurant is in a rundown area where there's gangs and stuff. I live in a really nice area like 2 hours away from Los Angeles so it's an adjustment whenever I have to go to that city, which is hardly ever. I've heard of a lot of restaurants and fast-food places there do yell at the customers if they don't leave tips. I think that's so wrong.

[SimsArtThat_SC]

I don't care whether it's a top-rated restaurant, a tip-jar at Starbucks, or a delivery person....good service always gets a tip, great service gets a great tip! Crappy service gets...nothing. And any attitude or an expectation of a tip regardless of the quality of service gets.....nada lol.

I've been in situations where the server has questioned a low tip. It's hard to actually say "you didn't deserve a 15-20% tip" but when it's the truth you gotta say it. And sometimes, I've just miscalculated lol (must have been the um, ginger ale *cough*) and I've appreciated being able to correct it.

But taking my hard earned change and dumping it in a tip jar? No way. The silliness of it is that I'd probably have left a dollar or two as opposed to 43 cents if the service was great lol.

[HCAC]

I've been in situations where the server has questioned a low tip.

Well, that takes a lot of nerve. A tip is a kindly gesture--most people DO tip. But to question an amount of a tip?

And as far as being a preschool teacher compared to a waitress--the point is, both are low paying jobs. No one is twisting a person's arm to be in the food serving profession, no one is hiding their hourly wage. Why cry about something you KNOW about? It's not fair to make the guest cough up a percentage because you chose a job paying $2.00 (or whatever) an hour.

Some people can make a very tidy living waiting tables. I admire them (just dealing with the public is a headache). However, to EXPECT a certain amount of money (tip wise) is not right.

[soapstar]

What state was this? :blink: The only place I've ever heard of someone doing that (and it was a waitress) was in Los Angeles, California at Roscoe's Chicken and Waffles. I hate that place with a passion! The waiters and waitresses there are mean and the restaurant is in a rundown area where there's gangs and stuff.

hah, i love that place. they are mean, but it's adorable imo

[SimsArtThat_SC]

Well, that takes a lot of nerve. A tip is a kindly gesture--most people DO tip. But to question an amount of a tip?


It happens often, in Manhattan at least. People DO depend on tips to make a living (I did during college), and I'm afraid it's more than a kindly gesture. It's practically a law here, especially at the best restaurants with the best service, but those can hardly be compared to some loose change in a tip-jar at Starbucks.

I see you are in NY too *waves* lol. I'm talking about the typical Bolo/Tao experience. Excellent servers in top restaurants usually deserve at LEAST 15%, for loads of reasons.

If you've had a great meal, and the service was terrific, and you just screwed up the tip on your credit card slip or something, don't you just feel badly about it afterwards? I've actually gone back to correct a tip, but then again, I've been in their shoes.

But what about service charges automatically included in room service at most hotels? I resent a $20 pot of cold coffee delivered too late much more than I resented a few excellent servers wanting to know if they had done something wrong. It was "I'm sorry, but was there something wrong?" as opposed to "Yo, cheap dude, I demand a better tip and you'd better pay up"

[Modestgurl88]

I don't mind tip jars. Some peole think it's easy jobs these people have when it isn't. If I had to deal with some of the things people do or act towards these workers,I would lose my mind.It's a stressful job.

[Chelleypie]

Well, that takes a lot of nerve. A tip is a kindly gesture--most people DO tip. But to question an amount of a tip?

And as far as being a preschool teacher compared to a waitress--the point is, both are low paying jobs. No one is twisting a person's arm to be in the food serving profession, no one is hiding their hourly wage. Why cry about something you KNOW about? It's not fair to make the guest cough up a percentage because you chose a job paying $2.00 (or whatever) an hour.

Some people can make a very tidy living waiting tables. I admire them (just dealing with the public is a headache). However, to EXPECT a certain amount of money (tip wise) is not right.

You've never lived on tips, have you?! As I said - I walked out of my waitressing jobs after 9 and 10 hour shifts on my feet with at least three or four times my check in my tips alone. Wait staff do NOT get paid enough to put up with some of the things they put up with. And sometimes it's a matter of 'This is all I can get right now and it's what's the most flexible'. That's why I waited tables. It was all that I could find right then and it was flexible. It wasn't a matter of 'I wanna work for $2.00 an hour!', it was a matter of 'I have to have money, so I'll work for $2.00 an hour plus tips.'.

Basically, what I'm saying is that you should tip. Always. From a former waitress to patrons, here's how we tended to see it:
We'd wait on a table, and we'd always look at our tip. If it was fairly decent for bill amount and for services rendered, we were cool. If it was little to nothing (like $1 for a $30 order) we knew we did poorly.

To summarize: always leave a tip, but vary your amount based on how the service was. Better service = better tip. And I promise, waitresses will remember you and will talk about you and how you tip. If you tip consistently well, you will be remembered and waited on accordingly.

[TWills23]

I refuse to tip at places like Starbucks, pizza places, etc... if I'm doing a take away order. There is no reason why I need to tip someone making 9.50 an hour. I only tip service people such as waiters, taxi drivers, and the like. We don't go to McDonald's and tip so why should we do it at Starbucks? I'm not upset with the tip jar but I am upset about what happened yesterday on my way to Uni. So I asked for my order, gave a five, and would you believe that the barista took it upon herself to dump MY change in the tip jar. She handed me the bills and wished me a good day. I just stood there and waited. She then asked me if something was wrong and I said, "Yes. You need to give me my change back!" She said that she did that regularly and no one had a problem with it. I told her to get the manager and I had him fish my change out. You don't ever take it upon yourself to decide what you're going to do with someone else's money. My first and last time going to that SB.

Do you believe in tip jars?


While the person that waited on you shouldn't have assumed they could dump your change in the tip jar, most of those people do not make close to $9.50 an hour. I work at a pizza place. I cook, do dishes, take orders, ect. I never see any tips, and I only make minimum wage. If you think about it, the people making the food put more into it then the waiter or waitress. Plus, the cooks where I work are sometimes treated horribly by the wait staff even though we bust our asses to make their food on time so they will get good tips. Even when I help buss tables they don't tip me. So I have no problem with tip jars, I usually let them have my change, because the people who make the food usually get no credit or recognition.

[Chelleypie]

Wow, I'm sorry that your wait staff treats you like crap. But I disagree that the wait staff should share their tips with the bus boys or cooks, as I've already stated. You're making minimum - the wait staff is not.

[ChihoSan]

To ChihoSan:

How come you deleted your third post? I was trying to respond to it. Anyway, if she had done half of what you just wrote not only would she deserve the tip, I would come back to that SB every time. However, if I walk in, order, get my order, and none of what you wrote occurred. This barista did not go above the norm so neither will I.

Sorry, I had recieved a warning about posting so many replies in a short time. I suppose it is true though that not all baristas take the time to do their job right. Most of the non-grocery owned Starbucks I've seen are pretty good though. I've had some awful ones though and those are the ones that are in Barnes and Noble and Ukrop's and Farm Fresh and those aren't owned by Starbucks and their people are not trained by Starbucks. But I really like my job and I try to make that show when I'm at work. It boggles my mind how rude people are. I suppose you're right in that aspect, if you get below average service then by no means do they deserve a tip.
And I think maybe fast food does deserve tips as well. If not tips than at least above minimum wage.

[Psy10]

I know someone (I won't call him a friend) and he works at Starbucks and makes $9.50 an hour so that's how I got that amount.

This post is mainly useless but it's to those who were wondering.

[hszmv]

$9.50 an hour and the nerve to assume you will tip them? Stiff'em.

I work as the Head Lifeguard at a pool (where I need to be able to deal with drowning people, improper chemicle balances that are illegal, a slew of children disobeying the diving board rules and pissed parents when said child is given a time out) and I get $8.00. And in my line of work, "tipping" is tandem to "bribing." Seriously, I had to deal with telling an employee to return a twenty to a guest who wanted him to save the "good seats".

My rule is round up to the nearest dollar and add another dollar for tips. But that is only for deliveries and wait staff. My change is presious (as a mid day soda will save me from falling asleep on a slow day) so you must go above and beyond to earn my change (most of the time, it is if I come back with a bum order, Dealing with the public is never fun, and take care of it the first tim.). Stiffing me will get you stiffed. And I applaud you for going to a manager.

[shaedigga]

hszmv - So if you go to a restaurant, based on your post, and your bill is $29.75, you will leave 1.75 as a tip? That is disgusting.

As far as "No one chose to be in the food service industry" What world are you living in? People need jobs. When you're working for $2 an hour and busting your ass to please customers and they leave you less than 10%, even though you were a great server, just because they think you made a bad decision in picking that job....that is complete garbage. You cannot compare a minimum wage job to making $2 an hour. You couldn't pay me enough to put up with what servers put up with, and people that don't respect that, in my opinion, are the lowest of the low. Honestly, If I met someone and we went out to dinner and they left a bad tip that would have to be the end of that relationship. They serve people, they are not your servants. If you can't afford to leave a tip then you need to stay home and eat.

[TRIriana]

As someone else said above, in the UK tipping isn't a big deal. It certainly isn't expected, so there's no fuss when it isn't given. Maybe they're paid more in the UK, I don't know.

The chef rushing out in anger in one of the above posts is just ridiculous though, and displays like that are only going to ensure that person doesn't return. I also think people who don't live in the US, and don't know what a good tip is but give one anyway - then the waiter/waitress/etc, shouldn't get cranky when they're given a tip they think is low. I certainly wouldn't know how much to tip in another country. And in asking, you're trusting someone you've never met before to not give a crazy ass sum they wouldn't usually expect.

There's been a few people saying that waiters/etc expect tips, and get cranky when they don't get anything. I think that if a waiter/etc expects a tip - they should also expect the person they're serving to not be able to afford to tip, if they don't. (Assuming they're not wearing clothes that shows they quite plainly earn a lot of money). If I get a coffee in some place where it's expensive, it's because I've treated myself. I couldn't afford to start tipping people who give me a couple minutes service (and without the polite/jolly chatter/smile, as well. Maybe there's a lack of jolly where I am).

[TWills23]

Wow, I'm sorry that your wait staff treats you like crap. But I disagree that the wait staff should share their tips with the bus boys or cooks, as I've already stated. You're making minimum - the wait staff is not.


It is crappy that wait staff are paid so little, I believe they should make minimum wage. For instance, delivery drivers make at least minimum wage, and they also receive tips and a certain amount for mileage. I'm not saying they should have to share their tips, but it's a nice gesture to "tip out" someone who helps you clear a table, for instance. If a waiter or waitress is really busy, has a dishwasher come and bus some tables, it's a nice gesture to give them a few dollars for helping is what I'm saying.

[HystericalParoxysm]

Y'know, the more I think about it, the weirder it strikes me as a custom. So many elements of what people tend to tip on, especially for servers, are things the server has nothing to do with - overall enjoyment of the meal, speed in getting it out, whether it was hot enough, etc., which has always struck me as odd when I'm out with people who comment on such things and then stiff the server on a good tip.

I looked up some history on it and it appears it's a really really old custom stretching back pretty much forever, so not likely to change, but why not? Why should people who already make very little in service jobs have to rely on the customer feeling nice enough that day to give them enough to live on? I'm not talking about the over-and-above stuff, where there's no tip jar and you have just been served incredibly well and want to say thank you (in those cases I often ask to see the manager and rave to them about their employee - they get enough complaints whether they have merit or not, but I guarantee you a manager will remember a customer going out of their way to say "This person is GREAT!" to them)... Prices would likely be higher if places had to pay their employees more, but wouldn't it more or less average out, and be better for someone who is living on a low wage to know how much they're making?

This is not to say that good performance shouldn't be rewarded - there's some great things businesses can do with profit sharing as performance incentives... Bonuses based on a certain percentage of profits if the business takes in a certain amount over what they did for the same period last year, divided by all employees and their hours worked... small bonuses based on specific upsells for high-profit products... I've worked under such schemes and I busted my ass a lot harder for something that I knew I was gonna get if I tried, rather than something I only might get if I put forth the same amount of effort.

[Rainncandy]

hszmv - So if you go to a restaurant, based on your post, and your bill is $29.75, you will leave 1.75 as a tip? That is disgusting.

As far as "No one chose to be in the food service industry" What world are you living in? People need jobs. When you're working for $2 an hour and busting your ass to please customers and they leave you less than 10%, even though you were a great server, just because they think you made a bad decision in picking that job....that is complete garbage. You cannot compare a minimum wage job to making $2 an hour. You couldn't pay me enough to put up with what servers put up with, and people that don't respect that, in my opinion, are the lowest of the low. Honestly, If I met someone and we went out to dinner and they left a bad tip that would have to be the end of that relationship. They serve people, they are not your servants. If you can't afford to leave a tip then you need to stay home and eat.

That last statement of yours is what I totally disagree with. You CAN NOT tell ANYONE to stay home and eat if they can't afford to leave a tip. No one is going to a restaurant TO leave a tip. You go to have a nice dinner. You are only obligated to pay for your meal - NOT to leave a tip. If one can only afford to pay for their meal, then that is fine because paying for your meal is what you have to do. Leaving a tip is optional, not mandatory. It is MY choice if I want to leave a tip or not. If I can't afford to leave a tip, then I won't. I'm obligated only to pay for my meal, and nothing else. I will go to any restaurant I choose, whether I choose to leave a tip or not, and whether I can afford to leave a tip or not. I am obligated ONLY to pay for my meal and nothing else. It is not your place to tell people to stay home if they can't afford to tip. People can do as they please whether you like it or not.

[nixie_SC]

We don't have tip jar here, but we do have i think 10% service charge and tax, so if you are already charging me for service please don't expect me to tip your waiter. However most of the places I go to eat don't need you to tip. its called Hawker stall!

note on the cashier, if they take my change and assume I want to give them the money, that behavior alone would have discourage me to tip them. I would immediately ask to see the manager. even if its 1 sens :P

Shaedigga, your statement "Iif you can't afford to leave a tip then you need to stay home and eat" is kind of harsh, what if I save money just for one outing to a nice dinner with my husband and don't have extra for tips? Do you mean poor people can't have fun?

that aside.

This tipping thing reminds me of the reservoir dogs tip dialogue. I really like to know if what they says is true

"Mr Brown: These people are taxed on the tips they make. When you stiff 'em, you cost them money."

"Mr Blonde: Waitressing is the number one occupation for female non-college graduates in this country. It's the one jab basically any woman can get, and make a living on. The reason is because of tips."

off course the movie was in 1992, so might not apply now, but is it true back than?

[HCAC]

So basically unless I can allot $5-10 EXTRA to eat out a my local diner, I should stay home? I can't agree with this. I understand waitstaff need to earn a living (my sister used to be a waitress and so was my ex-sister in law), but to say 'if you can't tip, stay home?' is not fair.

Some of us who never see a tip also live on small earnings. If my husband, son, and myself go to the diner/bistro once in awhile that is a big treat for us.

How about the waitress who provides minimal service to OUR table (it's happened more than once) because we are only a party of three ordering simple (all we can afford) meals? Meanwhile she's falling all over the party of 6 'hoping' to get that decent tip?

Because I have family in food service, I understand sometimes things are NOT the waitresses fault. If the kitchen doesn't like you, they will not help you out and mess things up for you.

I'm in sympathy for the waitress but the bottom line is, go to your boss for more money, don't EVER come to me and ask 'why did you tip so badly?' Maybe I don't have the money to give what 'you think you should get.' If anyone EVER asked me that I would never go back to that place and I WOULD report them to the management.

I simply don't get the attitude of 'entitlement' here.

I guess I am annoyed most about 'expecting a certain percentage' as a tip. Otherwise, yes, people should leave 'something.'

[Black_Barook!]

Here in Kuwait, were people have gone to every restaurant, cafe or fast-food joint at least once, I can honestly say that I've never seen a tip-jar. The servers can be nice, and make our orders the way we like and not tip. It's there job.

A few days ago my friend and I ate at a restaurant called "Noddle..something" The duck was bad and the noddles as well. But the manger and the server people were kind.

The bill was 9.200 K.D. I paid 10K.D. We waited for the change but it never came. So we just left.

Pure laziness more then anything else.

[romyhorse]

What state was this? :blink: The only place I've ever heard of someone doing that (and it was a waitress) was in Los Angeles, California at Roscoe's Chicken and Waffles. I hate that place with a passion! The waiters and waitresses there are mean and the restaurant is in a rundown area where there's gangs and stuff. I live in a really nice area like 2 hours away from Los Angeles so it's an adjustment whenever I have to go to that city, which is hardly ever. I've heard of a lot of restaurants and fast-food places there do yell at the customers if they don't leave tips. I think that's so wrong.

It was in Las Vegas, and we're not talking about a group of teenagers in a cheap diner, they were well-off adults (in their 50's) in an expensive restaurant!

[ChihoSan]

$9.50 an hour and the nerve to assume you will tip them? Stiff'em.
Again again again, not every barista makes that much money. I make $7.00 an hour and in a city that's considered pretty wealthy because it's tourist area. The city that has two theme parks, colonial areas and 90% of it's population is either retired people, rich people (the kind where the husbands work at some suit and tie job and the wife stays home all day but goes and spends hundreds of dollars at Target several times a week) and law students. Supposedly since the cost of living is much higher in this city than the ones around it ($1400 rent for the same size apartment as my $530 one) we're supposed to get paid more.
Have you tried living off a seven dollars? Either wait we don't "have the nerve" to assume you will tip. Or at least I dont. It's not as though I bring the tip jar myself from home and sit it out there.
For me this whole thread isn't about whether or not someone want to leave me some change it's about people looking at me while I am at work and realizing that hey! I'm an actual person with my own real life. I dont just stand here at Starbucks and then just disappear into thin air when it closes only to reappear at opening. More than a tip I'd love to see some acknowledgement that they understand that I'm doing my best with the job I have. I suppose not everyone works like that but you shouldn't assume that everyone there doesn't care.

[NayanRose]

First I have to say if anyone assumed I was leaving my money and took the liberty upon themselves to make that decision would hear from me. I would get the manager out too, being SAHM money is tight and places like Starbucks or Caribou Coffee are treats for us... (for the non coffee drinkers, like me, they have this really tasty carmel apple blast with no coffee in, it tastes like an apple pie and the kids get a hot chocolate :)) I don't ever tip in there, they are doing their job.

For the people saying the barista is more personable are you saying that the people in fast food places don't go above and beyond to be pleasant? I've gone into fast food places where the person at the counter was very pleasant and we did have a conversation... heck, I worked at a fast food place and we were under no circumstance suppose to accept tips, we were doing our job. How about that person at Wal-Mart out working the floor helping the customers, if they're doing their job right they're showing by actually bringing the customer where the product is. They're most likely chatting with the customer, you know what... they're doing their job and never expect a tip.

I also worked as a waitress at a nice dinner club... I hated the job but the tips were very nice so I stayed there for a while. I was paid minimum wage + we pooled the tips and split it at the end of the shift. Yet still now, if the service was bad and I'm talking the service, you have to actually come to the table and ask how the food is, is there anything else you can get me, and see if I need a refill on my drink no matter refills are free or not, if the service is bad you only get one dollar/person at the table. If it's really bad I don't leave anything... you know the service, your waitress takes your order and then goes on break, someone else brings your food and you don't hear back from anyone and have to ask for the bill so you can leave.

In most places you get paid at least the federal minimum wage... there is the exception where wait staff is paid about $2.15 but the employees have to make at least $30 in tips/month.

Here's a link to the Department of Labor - Employment Guide (http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/minwage.htm)

Here's the bit on tip wages for those who don't want to glance through the page.

Basic Provisions/Requirements

The Act requires employers of covered employees who are not otherwise exempt to pay these employees a minimum wage of not less than $5.85 per hour effective July 24, 2007; $6.55 per hour effective July 24, 2008; and $7.25 per hour effective July 24, 2009. Youths under 20 years of age may be paid a minimum wage of not less than $4.25 an hour during the first 90 consecutive calendar days of employment with an employer. Employers may not displace any employee to hire someone at the youth minimum wage.

Employers may pay employees on a piece‑rate basis, as long as they receive at least the equivalent of the required minimum hourly wage rate. Employers of tipped employees (i.e., those who customarily and regularly receive more than $30 a month in tips) may consider such tips as part of their wages, but employers must pay a direct wage of at least $2.13 per hour if they claim a tip credit. They must also meet certain other conditions.

[shaedigga]

So let me get this straight your server has done all she could to make your meal enjoyable, was attentive but not irritating everything was perfect. You would feel ok not leaving a tip and walking out? Not only is a tip actual financial reimbursement for a job well done it's a measure of whther or not you do your job well. If I was doing an excellent job at work I would get a raise. Servers get tips. So you can't afford to leave a tip and you dont' tell her thats why you don't leave a tip so now she's busted her ass for nothing AND she thinks she may have done something to offend you. It's insulting. I am not saying bad servers get tips. Servers don't get paychecks. They get paid, but by the time taxes are taken their checks are gone. Have you ever worked your ass off for two weeks and received a check for 18 cents?! So if I'm not making a pay check and we assume that people are operating on your 'if I can't afford it I'm not tipping" theory. This server has just volunteered her time to bring you your food, your drink, make sure your meal is going well etc. because you're obviously not going to pay her (tip) for doing it and she doesn't get money from her employer. I am not your mother, I am not your maid. You don't want to pay me for waiting on you then you can go in the back and get it yourself. That said, people handle bad service their own way. I'm only talking about great great service. Not tipping a good server for any reason short of being robbed while at the resturant is tacky and tasteless.
As far as staying home if you can't afford a tip, that's common sense. If I go into a place with $10 and what I want is 8.95, it's time to pick something else. I would be absolutely mortified to not leave a tip in a sit-down establishment. I've seen excellent servers in tears because someone didn't leave them a tip. I politely asked the manager what the total was of the table that didn't tip and when I left my tip, I left theirs too. And maybe that week I couldn't get something for myself or I stayed home in stead of going out that night, but maybe that girl paid her rent, maybe she got some formula for her baby, maybe she was able to make a car payment or maybe she was able to go out with her friends either way that girl deserved that money.


You keep saying that you've worked low paying jobs but your low paying jobs are still triple what a server makes!! You can't compare server wages to minimum wage.

[Stormy_SC]

It was in Las Vegas, and we're not talking about a group of teenagers in a cheap diner, they were well-off adults (in their 50's) in an expensive restaurant!

That's rediculous! Why would they even need a tip if they're working in a fine restaurant like that? Some people are so stupid and greedy!

[Modestgurl88]

First I have to say if anyone assumed I was leaving my money and took the liberty upon themselves to make that decision would hear from me. I would get the manager out too, being SAHM money is tight and places like Starbucks or Caribou Coffee are treats for us... (for the non coffee drinkers, like me, they have this really tasty carmel apple blast with no coffee in, it tastes like an apple pie and the kids get a hot chocolate :)) I don't ever tip in there, they are doing their job.

For the people saying the barista is more personable are you saying that the people in fast food places don't go above and beyond to be pleasant? I've gone into fast food places where the person at the counter was very pleasant and we did have a conversation... heck, I worked at a fast food place and we were under no circumstance suppose to accept tips, we were doing our job. How about that person at Wal-Mart out working the floor helping the customers, if they're doing their job right they're showing by actually bringing the customer where the product is. They're most likely chatting with the customer, you know what... they're doing their job and never expect a tip.

I also worked as a waitress at a nice dinner club... I hated the job but the tips were very nice so I stayed there for a while. I was paid minimum wage + we pooled the tips and split it at the end of the shift. Yet still now, if the service was bad and I'm talking the service, you have to actually come to the table and ask how the food is, is there anything else you can get me, and see if I need a refill on my drink no matter refills are free or not, if the service is bad you only get one dollar/person at the table. If it's really bad I don't leave anything... you know the service, your waitress takes your order and then goes on break, someone else brings your food and you don't hear back from anyone and have to ask for the bill so you can leave.

In most places you get paid at least the federal minimum wage... there is the exception where wait staff is paid about $2.15 but the employees have to make at least $30 in tips/month.

Here's a link to the Department of Labor - Employment Guide (http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/minwage.htm)

Here's the bit on tip wages for those who don't want to glance through the page.
Just because someone is making minimum wage doesn't mean they are living a good life. I couldn't imagine trying to raise a family on that wage.The cost of living isn't cheap. I was a carhop at sonic...yes I got minimum wage but I also got tips and I did make a good amount of money. But I was a teenager living with my parents.I worked with single mothers and trust me, they needed every dollar they could get.

[SwiftSign_SC]

In the UK we tend not to leave tips... except maybe in top-notch restaurants, or is that just me o.O

However on holiday 10% is the usual amount (50 euro meal, 5 euro tip :P) for my family to pay, which as far as I know most restaurants I have tipped split it up and share it with all the staff (which is a good bit extra on their pay check I imagine).

[BTW what is the minimum wage in the US? (well average) as over here anything under £4 something is illegal for over 18s o.O sorry just some of the phrasing I might have misunderstood :P LOL]

[pieridae]

I tip whenever service has warrented it, period. If my server at Starbucks, or wherever has done a great job or makes a kick @$$ latte, i tip, happily and freely. If someone, waitress, barista, etc, automatically TAKES a tip, that is stealing. It doesn't belong to them until the customer gives it. Kudos to you Psy10 for getting the manager and informing him of the situation.

Honestly, I think the minimum wage vs waitress wage is irrelevant. Obviously, you should tip your waitress accordingly -- they make like $3 an hour. But just because someone makes min. wage doesn't mean you shouldn't tip. What about bartenders? The make decent money and still expect a tip. As well they should for good service given. Of course there are many places where employees are not allowed to take tips - WalMart being an example. But it is naive to think doctors and lawyers don't get "tips," they are just not in monetary form. They get given tickets to shows, gift certifs, and the like all the time - and I guarantee those are worth more than the 50 cent tip I give at Starbucks!

pieridae


oops, double posted:



[BTW what is the minimum wage in the US? (well average) as over here anything under £4 something is illegal for over 18s o.O sorry just some of the phrasing I might have misunderstood :P LOL]

There are two minimum wages, maybe three: The standard min. wage is $5.50 an hour, the waitress min. wage is I think $2.33, and there might even be another one for agricultural workers.

[shaedigga]

That's rediculous! Why would they even need a tip if they're working in a fine restaurant like that? Some people are so stupid and greedy!


Because they only make $2 an hour.....

[Psy10]

Serious? Seriously? Seriously? I'm having a Grey's Anatomy moment.

...so now she's busted her ass for nothing AND she thinks she may have done something to offend you. It's insulting.

Um...because that's her job? :blink:

This server has just volunteered her time to bring you your food, your drink, make sure your meal is going well etc. because you're obviously not going to pay her (tip) for doing it and she doesn't get money from her employer.
I don't quite understand what you're saying. She's not volunteering. This is her job! Duh.

I am not your mother, I am not your maid. You don't want to pay me for waiting on you then you can go in the back and get it yourself.
Um...again why are you a waiter or waitress if you feel it's not your job to get the meal for the patron? Also, this is usually in the beginning of the meal. You have NO idea if this person is going to tip you or not so I hope the attitude that you're giving off on the Net is not the same one you have at work.

Not tipping a good server for any reason short of being robbed while at the resturant is tacky and tasteless.
This I agree with. I have yet to get bad service so I've always left a nice tip.

I've seen excellent servers in tears because someone didn't leave them a tip.
Seriously? Seriously? They either need to get a new job or tougher skin. I'm just sayin'.

but maybe that girl paid her rent, maybe she got some formula for her baby, maybe she was able to make a car payment or maybe she was able to go out with her friends either way that girl deserved that money.
Even as a tipper I don't agree with this. Your rent, your husband, your baby, etc... is none of my concern. I don't care if your a struggling college student. I am not responsible for paying your bills. Also, how in the world do you know if she deserved it or not?

[SimsArtThat_SC]

:2cents:

Waitress/Waiter jobs are advertised as base pay + tips. The tips matter way more than the base pay. :)

[shaedigga]

I don't quite understand what you're saying. She's not volunteering. This is her job! Duh.

I don't know how else to explain this. Servers makes, on average, $2-3 an hour. When they get their pay checks they are usually for less than $5 due to taxes and what not. I've seen friends come home with checks for 2 cents. So if a good server works for one hour and happens to come across 5 tables worth of people who believe tipping is ridiculous, she just did her job and did it well... for free. A check for 2 weeks that is $5, divided by 80 hours (say she works a 40 hour week) means she just worked for 6 cents an hour. Please tell me where else they work for 6 cents an hour.

Seriously? Seriously? They either need to get a new job or tougher skin. I'm just sayin'.

Uhhh, if my boss called me into her office tomorrow and said "You know what, we know you worked real hard this week but we're not gonna pay you. We don't feel we have to." I'd cry too and it would be illegal.

Even as a tipper I don't agree with this. Your rent, your husband, your baby, etc... is none of my concern. I don't care if your a struggling college student. I am not responsible for paying your bills. Also, how in the world do you know if she deserved it or not?

Katrina victims, Darfur, slavery..not my concern. Now I know it's an extreme of what you said but if people always looked at other's problems as "not my concern" the world would be a hell of a lot worse than it is already. I know she deserved it because we were sitting right next to the ones that left no tip, and I have a terrible terrible habit of eavesdropping in restaurants (it will get you in HUGE trouble I don't recommend it. One day you're eavesdropping, next day you're getting sued.) and heard them actually comment on what a lovely server she was and then stopped the manager as he was walking by to tell him what a great job she had done. Maybe this was some kind of joke on their part, I don't know. She was also our server and she did great.

as far as my attitude I believe I've been respectful and have not said anything to offend anyone and my thoughts on servers doesn't effect my job because I am not now, nor have I ever been, a server. Most of my friends are though and that's how I know how much they make and how much no tip actually hurts their feelings slightly more than their wallets

Also if employers eliminated the tipping custom by paying servers minimum wage or better guess who's gonna pay for that? You. Because now they have to make enough money to cover the business as well as employee wages, so all prices go up.

[Psy10]

Katrina victims, Darfur, slavery..not my concern. Now I know it's an extreme of what you said but if people always looked at other's problems as "not my concern" the world would be a hell of a lot worse than it is already.

Very extreme. I won't even comment further. :wtf:

Also if employers eliminated the tipping custom by paying servers minimum wage or better guess who's gonna pay for that? You. Because now they have to make enough money to cover the business as well as employee wages, so all prices go up.
That would actually be fine by me. We would win more then we lose. :beer:

[ayshala]

Woh..........I think there is a mistaken crossing here. I feel there is a BIG difference between "tip jars" and tipping a waitress. Someone with a Tip jar is probably making around min. wage. Tips are nice, but not needed. BUT, in the U.S. ..............waiting tables does not pay min wage! It is a job that is expected to earn money based on tips. In theory, the better the server, the better the tips. We all know wait staff is paid way below min wage. We all know they make their money on tips. So if you don't like that system, why are you going out and getting waited on??? Why aren't you going to some other "pick up" restaurant and getting the food yourself so you don't have to tip? Why would you penalize the wait staff for the job system?

[Psy10]

^Are you talking to me? If so, I know that. I actually don't have a problem with tipping waiters and waitresses or my hairstylist for that matter. It's shaedigga's attitude and sense of entitlement that is off putting. Regardless, if you're getting paid min. wage or not, the customer does not owe you a tip. A tip is for good, great, exceptional service.

[romyhorse]

I was wondering is restaurants in the US add a service charge? In the UK some restaurants add 12.5% to your bill as a service charge (ie a tip). However this doesn't always go straight to the serving staff. You don't have to pay it. If the service wasn't good you can not pay it, or you could choose to give it to the waitress instead. It is usually written in small print and most people probably don't realise they are paying it and end up giving a tip as well.

[Psy10]

In the US gratuity is added if there are more then 7 people at the table. When I lived in the UK (London to be exact), some restaurants added 10% and others left it up to you.

[SilentPsycho]

I liove in the UK, and both me anbd my family tend to leave a £1 tip if it's good, more if it's excellant, and zero if the service was bad. It is up to me if I want to pay, and if I need the cash for something myself, I am likely to not pay it.

An example is this happened when I was younger. I was on a school trip, and the teachers gave each group of 5 people £40, £8 each. I went with some of my friends, and as I had no money left, and I needed to eat the next day on the journey home, I only spent £2 of that on some garlic bread and cheese, plus I drank water. I also owed about £4 in total to other people, so I calculated that I would have £2 left to buy a sandwich and maybe a drink the next day. What my friends did instead was to leave the rest of the money, despite the fact that I told them I needed it, and told me to stop being selfish.

The end result? I was in tears the journey back to the hotel, and I didn't eat anything the next day until I got home that evening.

Also, above all, it's in their job description to be nice to customers. I've recently finished a month of work placement in Essex Libraries with no pay for one of my modules, and it is required for any staff member to go above and beyond for no additional pay.

I had to put up with standing up constantly from 9am to 5pm.
I had to deal with explaining the check-out system politely and ignore the complaints about how 'technology never works' from the OAPs.
I had to put up with users yelling at me saying that it's disgraceful that she would have to pay a £5 fine because she didn't read the receipt that told her in big letters when her books were due back.
I had to put up with people laughing at me because I am doing a job that they don't think needs anything other than basic literacy skills.
I had to help with enquires of all varieties, from information about probate law to what concerts are happening in the local area.
I helped out and read to the disabled, the young, and the old.
I had to have a good knowledge of computers, and got blamed by the customer if anything went wrong with the Internet.
I was continuously pulled from my specified job to help both patrons and other staff.
I had to pay all travelling expenses myself.

These are just a few of the things I experienced.

Do I think I should have got tips from that? No. It's my job to do these things.

[hszmv]

hszmv - So if you go to a restaurant, based on your post, and your bill is $29.75, you will leave 1.75 as a tip? That is disgusting.

As far as "No one chose to be in the food service industry" What world are you living in? People need jobs. When you're working for $2 an hour and busting your ass to please customers and they leave you less than 10%, even though you were a great server, just because they think you made a bad decision in picking that job....that is complete garbage. You cannot compare a minimum wage job to making $2 an hour. You couldn't pay me enough to put up with what servers put up with, and people that don't respect that, in my opinion, are the lowest of the low. Honestly, If I met someone and we went out to dinner and they left a bad tip that would have to be the end of that relationship. They serve people, they are not your servants. If you can't afford to leave a tip then you need to stay home and eat.

If I was at a place that charged $29.75 for an item, I wouldn't order it. Frankyly, there are only two times when I would tip: A) When the pizza delivery guy brings me my pizza (or whatever food I order) which amounts to about $12.46 or B) When I am out with my girlfriend, who refuses that I pay for her unless it is her Birthday. There my order amounts to $6 to $8. But I always slip the wait staff another bill while my gf isn't looking because I don't like to leave anything under a dollar for them.

But for an order of $29.75, I would leave a bit more. But I don't think I have ever been in that situation (nor would I want to be), so the point is mute.

If I leave a tip and how much is entirely my choice. If the service was excellent, the tip is excellent. If the service is poor, the tip is poor. And if the service lectures me about how much I give them, they learn the hard way that you don't bite the hand that feeds you.

[ayshala]

^Are you talking to me? If so, I know that. I actually don't have a problem with tipping waiters and waitresses or my hairstylist for that matter. It's shaedigga's attitude and sense of entitlement that is off putting. Regardless, if you're getting paid min. wage or not, the customer does not owe you a tip. A tip is for good, great, exceptional service.

No i didn't mean you. Though looking back on my post I can see that it sounds that way, sorry. I'm talking in general. However customers DO owe a tip. You can be legally banned from a place (in the U.S.) for not tipping. THis isn't a one time thing of course, but say you've been in the place ten times and never tipped. They can legally ban you from coming back. In some places, like restaurants I've been to in NY, tipping is not an option. 15% will be added to the bill, and if you really liked the service, another tip might be left at the table. If someone wants to start a bill in the U.S. to see that wait staff are paid at least min wage, then tipping them wouldn't be such a big deal. But as it is, in the US, people KNOW that whatever the meal, they are expected to tip around 15% to the wait staff. It isn't a new vampire company concept.






I had to put up with standing up constantly from 9am to 5pm.
I had to deal with explaining the check-out system politely and ignore the complaints about how 'technology never works' from the OAPs.
I had to put up with users yelling at me saying that it's disgraceful that she would have to pay a £5 fine because she didn't read the receipt that told her in big letters when her books were due back.
I had to put up with people laughing at me because I am doing a job that they don't think needs anything other than basic literacy skills.
I had to help with enquires of all varieties, from information about probate law to what concerts are happening in the local area.
I helped out and read to the disabled, the young, and the old.
I had to have a good knowledge of computers, and got blamed by the customer if anything went wrong with the Internet.
I was continuously pulled from my specified job to help both patrons and other staff.
I had to pay all travelling expenses myself.

These are just a few of the things I experienced.

Do I think I should have got tips from that? No. It's my job to do these things.

And for this you are paid 2.50$ U.S. dollars an hour? I'm doubting it. Wait staff does NOT even get MIN wage!!! Why are people comparing this to other jobs? Anyone who is not a wait staff that is being paid 2.50$ U.S. dollars an hour, please speak up! Hmm, I suspect I will only hear silence.

[hszmv]

She said in her post she wasn't paid at all.

[SimsArtThat_SC]

Some Wiki stuff: (this applies to the USA)

- In countries where tipping is the rule (for example the United States) complicated social rules and etiquette have developed over the exact percentage to tip, and what should and should not be included in this calculation. In other cultures where tipping exists it is more flexible and no specific assumptions of the tip amount exist.

Conclusion: tipping is the norm in the US, not the exception, the only confusion should be how much to tip, not whether or not it's just "optional"

- Some establishments pool tips and divide them to include employees who lack customer contact. At some restaurants, agreements among the staff require the servers to tip out members of the support staff (kitchen, bartender, and busser) at the end of their shift; this means that servers pay a certain fixed percentage of their sales (most often a portion less than 15 percent of total sales) to the other staff. Thus when a patron leaves a small tip, it results in the server having to receive less from the tipping pool than other staff.

Conclusion: when you don't tip for good/great service, you're affecting many more people than just your server

- Tipping in the United States is widely practiced and is culturally considered by some as a social obligation under a variety of circumstances. Many find the system antiquated, adding an unnecessary complication for the customer. Employees in occupations where tipping is common sometimes receive very low salaries and receive the bulk of their compensation in tips. United States wage laws stipulate lower minimums for occupations where tipping is expected.

Conclusion: A person chooses a waitstaff job because the salary is base pay PLUS TIPS. No sane person would work merely for the base pay below minumum wage most traditional restaurants offer. Until the traditional way of compensating a waitstaff is changed, this is how it is. The only occupations that legally allow less than minimum wage are those occupations for which tipping is expected. And believe me...if a waiter puts a big ZERO on their tax return for "tips and gratuities" the IRS would raise some major eyebrows, because it is the norm. Do you really think someone who only earns $2.50 an hour is going to care if your food is correct/hot/cold/prompt or infested with something?

- Tipping is always up to the discretion of the person receiving the service. When tipping is expected, giving a very small tip, such as a penny, is used as a deliberate snub, to indicate service was mediocre or inferior

Conclusion: The ONLY time not to tip is when the service is truly terrible (in which case the manager should also be informed)

- Tipping is considered by some to be a social obligation in restaurants having traditional table service. The customary tip for a restaurant meal in the United States traditionally ranged from 10 to 15 percent of the total bill (before tax), with 15 to 20 % now the norm

Conclusion: In my experience, this is absolutely true, and I do this everywhere in the US, not just in NY. (I actually tend to overtip...most people I know who have been waiters or bartenders do because they know the staff probably got screwed by someone else)

- According to Fodor's: At restaurants, a 15% tip is typical for waiters; up to 20% may be expected by some waiters at more expensive establishments. Good service is expected, and it is sometimes acceptable for a tip lower than 10% or even nothing for ordinary or unsatisfactory service.

Conclusion: Again, a tip means something, whether you give it or not. Good to great service should always be rewarded with some kind of tip.

- Tipping at fast food restaurants and coffee places such as Starbucks (where there is no traditional table service), is not necessary, despite the growing number of tip jars (a.k.a. "guilt jars") appearing at them

Conclusion: LOL...Starbucks is a marketing phenomenon...guilt-jars indeed lol. Workers at these places choose these jobs for an explicitly-stated salary at or above the legal minimum wage, and do NOT expect tips to calculate their expected income.

OT:

Therefore, don't bother with tip jars unless you want to BUT tipping the waitstaff for traditional table service is overwhelmingly the norm here in the US. The only time to NOT leave a tip is when: the service is really terrible (but you should tell the manager as well), or you TRULY cannot afford to (in which case praising the waitstaff to the management for good service is even more important).

Yes, tipping is up the the customer's discretion, but that does not mean it is "optional" for traditional table service. It means the tip should be proportionate to the service.

EDIT: (I was a waiter for 3 years :eviltongu , and despite it being unnecessary, I'd still leave a buck or two for good service at Starbucks)

[shaedigga]

simsartthat - Great post. Loved the summaries.

I think people are taking my "you must tip" stance incorrectly. I said it in an earlier post but I thought I'd reiterate. My position on this issue is solely based on good to exceptional service. I don't believe that bad service should be compensated. If you were bad at your job, you'd get fired and wouldn't get a paycheck, so bad servers shouldn't get paid either. How people deal with poor service is varied and I've been lucky enough to not have ever really experienced truly poor service. I have always been told that instead of not leaving a tip for poor service you should leave something like $1. No tip can be brushed off as either forgotten or you're just not a tipper. $1 means (at least how I've been told), "I acknowledge your service, however, it was terrible."

[Rainncandy]

There is no way that I'm leaving a tip for bad service. I'm not obligated to tip (but I do, in most cases), but bad service will not receive a tip from me.

So let me get this straight your server has done all she could to make your meal enjoyable, was attentive but not irritating everything was perfect. You would feel ok not leaving a tip and walking out?

I may not feel right walking out w/o tipping, but if I can't afford a tip, then I won't. I'm only obligated to pay for my meal and nothing more. And if I choose to go to a restaurant and can only afford to pay for my meal, then I will do just that. It's my decision if I want to go to a restaurant or not, whether I can afford to tip or not.

I actually don't have a problem with tipping waiters and waitresses or my hairstylist for that matter. It's shaedigga's attitude and sense of entitlement that is off putting. Regardless, if you're getting paid min. wage or not, the customer does not owe you a tip. A tip is for good, great, exceptional service.

Well said, Psy! My feelings exactly.

[SimsArtThat_SC]

There is no way that I'm leaving a tip for bad service. I'm not obligated to tip (but I do, in most cases), but bad service will not receive a tip from me.

That's exactly right :)

[Chelleypie]

I'm telling you, if you wanna send a message, leave a crappy tip. No tip just means you forgot. I always left a slip of paper in my tablet when I handed back change or credit card slips, as a way for my tables to tell me how I did. Every time I got a bad 'review', I also got a crappy tip. Two or three times I got a glowing review, but no tip.

[ateKna]

I always leave a tip for someone providing me a service which is an investment of their time, and additionally is specific to the service they grant me.
At Starbucks, for example, all the baristas can equally make the same tasting $5 coffee. I've been to a lot of Subways, and whatever I ask for there tastes the same as well since I always get it done the same way. These people do get paid at least minimum wage. Waiters, hairstylists, spa attendents, and so on do not. I always tip my taxi, anyone who carries luggage for me, or anyone who serves me a drink, since you are taking space at their bar, or riding in their car, and so they are choosing to serve you as opposed to a starbucks employee who MUST serve you. A taxi driver doesnt have to pick you up, a bartender can ignore you, and a stylist doesn't have to take you. A waiter will answer your specific questions and serve you for a period of time, and so it is best to leave them a 20% tip. In NY, an 18% tip is automatically taken from you anyway, so I always leave that plus an additional tip which is really expected of you.
No one expects anything at starbucks, and the tip jars are just ways to get rid of extra coins. That is probably how they started anyway, if you think about it. Don't most people use debit cards to pay anyway? If I carry cash on me, I keep it in case I need a cab. Coins just weigh you down though so tip jars I've never seen as tip jars, but coin emptying jars.

[Spiffyriffic]

This is not directed towards anyone here in particular, I just saw the subjects and felt the need to vent from years of holding in. :)

I have worked in the service industry my whole life, I know what it is like working your butt off at a restaurant and then getting rewarded by a customer who tips 25 cents on a 15 dollar bill, no matter how nice and helpful I am.

So, I'm not sure what it is like in different states or parts of the world, but I live here in Arizona, and a server gets paid a whopping 2.13 and hours, far below minimum wage, the rest of their wages have to be made up with by tips. I am no longer working now, but when I do go out to eat, I always tip a 5 dollar bill, whenever I spend over 15 dollars. Yes, a 33% tip. The only time I leave less is when I spend under 15 or if the service is horrendous. Then I usually leave 3 dollars.

The service industry is full of hardworking people most of the time, and they have to deal with most of the stuff you wouldn't do yourself. What irks me the most is the complete disregard people show people in the service industry. A lot of customers are rude, impatient, and cheap. They complain constantly about too little whip cream, or "Where is my straw?" or even go as far as saying "I could do your job with my eyes closed." No, you can't. I can barely do it.

People may think that service people are a bunch of uneducated lazy people who don't bother to find a real job. That may be true in a few rare cases, but most are people trying to support a family, or trying to get their education. They haven't had the same opportunities as the person with a house and car and a 50k a year job. Give them a freaking break. Without them, you wouldn't have your doubleshot lowfat mochachino with extra whipped cream at 7:26 every morning.

As for tipping baristas, if you are paying with cash, why not drop the jingly change in the jar? It's like sending them a message "Thank you for doing the grunt work that I don't really feel like doing. Thanks for dealing with all the rude customers and still giving me a smile."

Every little bit helps. You can help make a difference one quarter at a time. :)

[Spiffyriffic]

Oh yeah, also, if you can't afford to tip... you can't afford to eat at a restaurant. Enough said.

[Synthesis]

Being a Taiwanese national, I'm initially from a culture in which the only tips go to airport luggage personnel (porters). Waiters, waitresses, etc., are not tipped. In my experience, wages are hardly stellar, especially given the costs of living, but they are strictly enforced. There is one minimum wage, and violation of it is a felony.

However, it seems that a lot of this problems stem from a weaker minimum wage tradition in the United States--the fact that servers are "exempt" for labor laws is something of a surprise to me, despite having lived in the United States for several years. This whole tipping fiasco seems to be derived from the government's reluctance to "interfere" in the practices of employers in the very large food-service industry (laissez-faire), and a lack of a culture of labor rights among the employees.

If there is a strong tipping culture, as there is in the US, I suppose it's all right, but I still think it's not a preferable alternative. Overall, food is very inexpensive in the United States--one of a few nations in which obesity is common amongst the millions underneath the poverty line. If it meant a 15 or even 20% increase in the price of eating out, and would secure "more acceptable" wages among service personnel, I would personally support it.

Of course, the question of what is "acceptable" is problematic in it's own right. So we'll probably be relying on this complex tipping culture for some time.

[Night Revenant]

They (being marketing people, higher ups, etc) figure that if you are stupid enough to pay $4 for a cup of coffee, you are stupid enough to tip them at the same time. I'm actually surprised that people still go to Starschmucks but that's not the point of this thread.

I don't mind tip jars though I much prefer the donation boxes for charities that places like Tim Horton's have in front of their tills. I will not withhold a tip for shoddy (or snobby) service even, but it will be smaller than what I would give a friendly and efficient service worker. The least I've gone with a tip has been $2 and that's because the service was horrible...very slow, orders were messed up, etc but I was still appreciative of the service I had in the first place.

[HCAC]

. Overall, food is very inexpensive in the United States--one of a few nations in which obesity is common amongst the millions underneath the poverty line. If it meant a 15 or even 20% increase in the price of eating out, and would secure "more acceptable" wages among service personnel, I would personally support it.


Even though this is not the focus of the debate, let me point out that food is NOT very inexpensive in the USA. If one wants to eat well, meaning fruits, vegetables, lean meats, healthy things, it costs a lot! You have to be wealthy to actually get those 8 servings of fruit and vegetables per day when a pint of blueberries is $3.00 (how far does a pint go for a family?). Lettuce is $2 a head (again, the average family has 3 kids I think? That serves for one meal..).

"Poorer' people eat fast food (where you don't tip or get waited on) because THAT IS CHEAPER than a healthier, sit down meal. However, I agree with your premise that if we can raise the prices of sitdown meals a little and it goes into the pocket of the serve, that would be a good idea.

[Synthesis]

Even though this is not the focus of the debate, let me point out that food is NOT very inexpensive in the USA. If one wants to eat well, meaning fruits, vegetables, lean meats, healthy things, it costs a lot! You have to be wealthy to actually get those 8 servings of fruit and vegetables per day when a pint of blueberries is $3.00 (how far does a pint go for a family?). Lettuce is $2 a head (again, the average family has 3 kids I think? That serves for one meal..).


What is expensive is inevitably relative. That same head of lettuce would probably cost around 100NT in Taiwan--slightly more than three dollars. In the United States, you can get a pound of chuckeye (I believed that's what it's called) for $7. In Taiwan, this would likely cost 500NT, if not more. Even fish, which is generally regarded as "inexpensive" in Taiwan, it is still most expensive then on the US East Coast.

Yes, I realize eating well costs more than eating poorly, but that doesn't change the fact that eating well in the United States is less expensive then in most countries.

Food IS inexpensive in the United States--with the exception of a handful of imported products, primary staples like beef, fish, chicken, rice, and most forms of vegetables are less expensive in the United States then in other countries. While the definition of "eating poorly" varies enormously from nation to nation, adjusting for inflation, fast food is cheaper in the United States then in almost any other country. Eating well in the United States is still cheaper than in most other first world nations.

[jamesejames]

Eating well in the United States is still cheaper than in most other first world nations.

Most things in the US are cheaper than elsewhere too. Anyways...
I'm glad there isnt this hullabaloo about tips here in the UK as there is across the pond in the US. Tips aren't expected, not even for waiters normally, and waiters seem to be payed better here too, after reading what the seem to be payed in America, I know someone who works as a waiter at a McDonalds, and he gets payed £9.50 an hour, more than my dad, who is a bus driver, and puts up with lots more strife, longer hours, harder work, AND no chance of a tip at all, but i don't think tips should be expected, there was a huge parlimentary debate about them a few years back, with some saying that the people who recieved the tip would then sometimes spend it on cocaine or something(which was never proven), and so they wanted to ban tipping all together, which happened completely in one place in Wales, and some people are moaning that tips aren't high enough, try working as a waiter in a small restaurant here in the UK, which gives no tips, and pathetic pay, there was also a debate on that, about some student had only 3 1/2 hours sleep a day because they had to work so much, and then the debate of tipping got dragged in, all the usual "American students are richer than British students purely because of tips" and all that normal blah, but i wanted to make a valid point, which i cant remember what it is now. Oh yes. Those here who are saying that you should tip at a restaurant,or not go at all , dont go to work at one in Milton Keynes.

Thats all for now.

And if anyone actually read all that, points to you. How spiffing.

[shirokuma]

I feel that taking someone's change just because no one's complained before is wrong, just like I think wait staff jumping down your throat because you didn't give them a tip is just as wrong. As others have said, its your job. If you don't like not getting tips you can walk out the door and never come back. Plain and simple. Regardless of what social norms say, I'm not giving you anything above and beyond my bill unless I feel compelled to. Other people in other professions work just as hard for their paycheck as wait staff, and you don't see them getting their panties in a bunch because they don't get a little extra on the side.

The idea that people who can't afford to tip should stay home is ludicrous. I guess that also means if you can't afford to tip that store employee that went out of their way to help you find all of your items you should stay home too right? While your at it maybe you should tip the guy at McDonalds too.

[Spiffyriffic]

I feel that taking someone's change just because no one's complained before is wrong, just like I think wait staff jumping down your throat because you didn't give them a tip is just as wrong. As others have said, its your job. If you don't like not getting tips you can walk out the door and never come back. Plain and simple. Regardless of what social norms say, I'm not giving you anything above and beyond my bill unless I feel compelled to. Other people in other professions work just as hard for their paycheck as wait staff, and you don't see them getting their panties in a bunch because they don't get a little extra on the side.

The idea that people who can't afford to tip should stay home is ludicrous. I guess that also means if you can't afford to tip that store employee that went out of their way to help you find all of your items you should stay home too right? While your at it maybe you should tip the guy at McDonalds too.

Yes, but the person at the store and at McDonalds gets AT LEAST minimum wage. Your server in America get BELOW minimum wage, with their bosses expecting them to get tips to cover the rest of their paychecks. Tips ARE their paychecks. As a server, I get you everything you need to have a nice sit down meal without you having to cook it, or clean up after yourself. You don't have to do the dishes, or worry about the fact that you spilled hash browns all over the floor. As a server, I am doing all these things for you, and if you don't leave a tip, than that is just plain 'ludicrous.' Because you are paying for your meal, yes, but the tip is paying for the convenience of being lazy and not having to clean up after yourself, of get up to get your drink or ketchup or whatever.

In my opinion, not tipping someone for doing you a good service when you know they aren't getting jack, it just unethical, and beyond rude.

[SilentPsycho]

A lot of people here from America don't tend to realise that they are pretty much the only ones that don't have a universal minimun wage. Over here in Great Britain, where there is a universal minimun wage for all jobs, tipping is generally an optional choice used really only for good or higher service. Don't have a go at us who do this, saying we're selfish or ludicrous just because it's what it is in our culture.

Interesting fact - in Japan, tipping is considered rude.

If you're so high and mighty about tipping and the server's wages, why don't you put pressure on your government to change it?

[lockshockbarrel]

As a server, I get you everything you need to have a nice sit down meal without you having to cook it, or clean up after yourself. You don't have to do the dishes, or worry about the fact that you spilled hash browns all over the floor. As a server, I am doing all these things for you, and if you don't leave a tip, than that is just plain 'ludicrous.' Because you are paying for your meal, yes, but the tip is paying for the convenience of being lazy and not having to clean up after yourself, of get up to get your drink or ketchup or whatever.

In my opinion, not tipping someone for doing you a good service when you know they aren't getting jack, it just unethical, and beyond rude.

Uh... Isn't having a chef cook your food for you, having servers clean up after you and bring you drinks and condiments the main reasons people go to restaurants and pay them? I agree with you that the fact that servers get less than minimum wage is messed up, but the fact that the server is doing what I expect them to doesn't deserve something extra. I already paid for a meal and for waiters to clean up after me and bring me drinks. I'm not going to give them a reward, because I already have when I paid my bill. (I actually do tip because of the wages situation, but, I'm not going to pay more than 15% unless I have a waiter/waitress who goes above and beyond what I expect them to, and earns the extra money I give them)

[shirokuma]

Yes, but the person at the store and at McDonalds gets AT LEAST minimum wage. Your server in America get BELOW minimum wage, with their bosses expecting them to get tips to cover the rest of their paychecks. Tips ARE their paychecks. As a server, I get you everything you need to have a nice sit down meal without you having to cook it, or clean up after yourself. You don't have to do the dishes, or worry about the fact that you spilled hash browns all over the floor. As a server, I am doing all these things for you, and if you don't leave a tip, than that is just plain 'ludicrous.' Because you are paying for your meal, yes, but the tip is paying for the convenience of being lazy and not having to clean up after yourself, of get up to get your drink or ketchup or whatever.

In my opinion, not tipping someone for doing you a good service when you know they aren't getting jack, it just unethical, and beyond rude.

The fact that servers don't get jack should be taken up with the employers, and not shoved onto the consumers. Servers by law have to get minimum wage unless they make over thirty dollars in tips. At that point its up to the employer whether or not to reduce your hourly pay. As a customer that's not my problem. Take it up with your boss.

Sure you get my food, and clean the dishes or whatever, but that's in your job description. A tip is usually given to someone who's gone above and beyond the call of duty. Cleaning the dishes I used doesn't fit that description.

I went to a restaurant around my college because I needed to break a twenty to use as bus fare. My friend and I ordered our meal and were ready to leave. The server, who by the way did an excellent job, got down right angry when I asked for change. He became angry, flippant, and really rude. I had planned on leaving him a tip, but after his little tantrum I left half a penny. (Don't know how it got chopped in half) I never went back and told several people not to.

SilentPsycho you took it right out of my mouth. lol I was going to talk about how rude it is to tip in Japan lol

[Chelleypie]

The fact that servers don't get jack should be taken up with the employers, and not shoved onto the consumers. Servers by law have to get minimum wage unless they make over thirty dollars in tips. At that point its up to the employer whether or not to reduce your hourly pay. As a customer that's not my problem. Take it up with your boss.

Sure you get my food, and clean the dishes or whatever, but that's in your job description. A tip is usually given to someone who's gone above and beyond the call of duty. Cleaning the dishes I used doesn't fit that description.

I went to a restaurant around my college because I needed to break a twenty to use as bus fare. My friend and I ordered our meal and were ready to leave. The server, who by the way did an excellent job, got down right angry when I asked for change. He became angry, flippant, and really rude. I had planned on leaving him a tip, but after his little tantrum I left half a penny. (Don't know how it got chopped in half) I never went back and told several people not to.

SilentPsycho you took it right out of my mouth. lol I was going to talk about how rude it is to tip in Japan lol

I have real issues with this post. Probably because I've waited tables for 10 hours a day and come home to an infant, but I have issues with it.

The fact that servers don't get jack should be taken up with the employers, and not shoved onto the consumers. Servers by law have to get minimum wage unless they make over thirty dollars in tips.
The man I waited tables for didn't give a crud about his wait staff. He had high turn over because he was - that close to abusing us on a daily basis.

What law? Point it out, please. Here in Louisiana, wait staff minimum (which is what is paid out) is $2.16 an hour. They cannot tell what you make in tips - only your credit card paid tips are logged for the IRS to a letter. Everything else you can make up and they won't know any different. So do tell, how do they know how much you make in tips? Not to mention that tips can vary widely from shift to shift. As an example, I worked mostly dinner shifts when I waited tables. I got good tips on my dinner shifts. My lunch shifts not so much, because we had fewer people. If I had a bad day and was tired from being up all night with a teething infant, I got fewer tips. Most of the time, my tips were more than my check.

At that point its up to the employer whether or not to reduce your hourly pay. As a customer that's not my problem. Take it up with your boss.
Most restaurant owners don't give a crap. Wait staff is cheap to employ. And if you complain, you're told 'That's how it is, deal with it or find other work'. And for a single mother with few marketable skills other than her people skills, waiting tables is almost the only thing available. Remember that at least one of your waitresses is probably a mom looking to put food in mouths and clothes on backs.

Sure you get my food, and clean the dishes or whatever, but that's in your job description. A tip is usually given to someone who's gone above and beyond the call of duty. Cleaning the dishes I used doesn't fit that description.
Define 'above and beyond'. Some things are out of our control. We wait on you hand and foot, take responsibility for others' screw ups, make sure your drink stays full and that your meal is exactly how you want it. We also put up with the bad attitudes and tantrums when it isn't right. Not to mention drunken idiocy, which you get a lot of when you have a stocked bar on premises. Do tell - why don't we deserve a tip?

I went to a restaurant around my college because I needed to break a twenty to use as bus fare. My friend and I ordered our meal and were ready to leave. The server, who by the way did an excellent job, got down right angry when I asked for change. He became angry, flippant, and really rude. I had planned on leaving him a tip, but after his little tantrum I left half a penny. (Don't know how it got chopped in half) I never went back and told several people not to.
That was the SERVER'S problem. I never assumed my customers would leave a tip. I just did my best work and usually the tips came because I did my best work. The server needed the attitude adjustment. I'll go along with that.

SilentPsycho you took it right out of my mouth. lol I was going to talk about how rude it is to tip in Japan lol
Whoop de doo da day. It's rude to tip in Japan. Irrelevant.

Our 'government' doesn't give two barks and a woof about minimum wage for wait staff. As long as they get waited on, they're happy.

Here's a nifty little tidbit I found.
The hospitality businesses – hotels, restaurants, bars and casinos – hire more minimum wage workers than any other industry segment. Under most state laws, hospitality workers who make tips – such as bartenders and wait staff – make a substantially lower minimum wage than all other hourly workers. The new federal law sets the minimum wage for so-called tip workers at $2.13 an hour.

Seven states – Alaska, California, Minnesota, Montana, Nevada, Oregon and Washington – require employers to pay tip workers the same minimum wage as other workers.
Source: stateline.org (http://www.stateline.org/live/details/story?contentId=218020)

Let's go over that again. The federal government has just raised tip worker minimum wage to $2.13 an hour. Only 7 out of 50 states require that tip workers receive an equal minimum wage. Where's that law about making minimum until you hit $30 in tips? I sure as heck don't see it anywhere.

[shirokuma]

The man I waited tables for didn't give a crud about his wait staff. He had high turn over because he was - that close to abusing us on a daily basis.

There's nothing, that I, as a customer, can do about that. Again, not my problem.

Here are two conflicting, but good quotes that state that the issue of salary and bottom line take home pay belong to the employer and not the customer. I think one of them was used here already:

Employers of tipped employees (i.e., those who customarily and regularly receive more than $30 a month in tips) may consider such tips as part of their wages, but employers must pay a direct wage of at least $2.13 per hour if they claim a tip credit. They must also meet certain other conditions.
Source (http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/minwage.htm)

The federal law requires employers to pay workers who receive tips no less than $2.13 an hour, assuming tips add enough to at least equal the federal $5.15 minimum wage. (If the worker’s tips are insufficient to get to $5.15, the employer must pay the difference.) States may raise their total minimum wage above the federal $5.15; they are also free to require employers to pay more than $2.13 to tipped workers, or to eliminate the “tip credit” to employers altogether by requiring them to pay the same minimum wage other workers receive.
Source (http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/minwage.htm)

We wait on you hand and foot, take responsibility for others' screw ups, make sure your drink stays full and that your meal is exactly how you want it. We also put up with the bad attitudes and tantrums when it isn't right. Not to mention drunken idiocy, which you get a lot of when you have a stocked bar on premises. Do tell - why don't we deserve a tip?

When you walk in that door you know what you're signing up for. If you don't and you don't do research before applying to a job, then it's your own fault. Don't forget, servers can be just as nasty. Before anyone says that they've been dealing with nasty customers all day, suppose I had a horrible day at work and had a bad argument with my wife. Anytime you deal with a job that deals with the public in the way that food service does you're going to get some unsavory characters and people who are having problems just like you are. Doesn't mean I should pay for it.

Define 'above and beyond'. Some things are out of our control.

Before it closed, I went to a Thai restaurant regularly for lunch when I was out with a friend. The first time I went was the first time I'd ever had an authentic Thai meal. When I told the waiter, he recommended dishes to me, told me what he thought of them and even had the chef prepare it with a slight variation so I could taste the full flavor of one of the ingredients. He spent a total of 20 minutes coming back and forth to help me. The meal was great, he told jokes, and even chatted casually for a while. When his boss came to complain, we told his boss about the job he was doing. His boss was very proud. My total tip was about half the regular bill. I liked it that much. (This was during the lunch hour, which was always busy.)

And for a single mother with few marketable skills other than her people skills, waiting tables is almost the only thing available. Remember that at least one of your waitresses is probably a mom looking to put food in mouths and clothes on backs.

Again, if you do your research you'll realize that this is not a job to have if you're raising a child. The income is too unstable. I can understand if you need a little extra money on the side to supplement your income, but not as the sole source. There are other jobs you could apply for such as a cashier at a local store.

That was the SERVER'S problem. I never assumed my customers would leave a tip.

Sure YOU didn't, but that server did, and like it or not, that reflects poorly on the restaurant. The server's problems end up becoming the restaurant's.

Whoop de doo da day. It's rude to tip in Japan. Irrelevant.

Other people have discussed tipping customs in other countries in this thread as well. Does that make those areas of their posts irrelevant too?

[georgiababe]

I don't usually tip in places like that (Starbucks, pizza places etc.) either. If the person who happens to be taking my order is exceptionally good, then I'll usually throw in my change or something, but generally not. I mean - if I am picking up the pizza, then why should I tip you? Because you make my food? I don't tip at fast food restaurants, so I don't tip pizza places unless they deliver it for me. Restaurants, on the other hand, I do tip, because all I have to do is sit there and pick what I want, then they bring it to me, cooked and delicious, while I don't have to lift a finger.

I won't tip rude people though. One time I was at a restaurant and I ordered a raspberry milkshake, but the waitress brought me strawberry, which I cannot have because I am allergic. When I pointed out her mistake, she apologized profusely and brought me another right away. At another instance in the same restaurant (with a waiter) I noticed that my milkshake was quite runny (unlike the other times that I've had them - this one was basically raspberry milk) and asked the waiter about it. He told me "Oh, that's how we make them here", gave me this look like "Don't direct your petty complaints at me, you stupid woman" and walked away. Then, at the end of the meal, he had the audicity to take my bill from me and fill in the tip amount himself, claiming to be "helping" me since "lots of customers don't know how to tip properly". Needless to say, he did not get what he asked for.

[SilentPsycho]

Whoop de doo da day. It's rude to tip in Japan. Irrelevant.

Not really. Do you think everyone in this debate all live in America? Does the rest of the world not exist? What I meant was that people in here seem to be having a go at those who don't automatically tip for everything, even if the service was so-so but don't seem to realise that they might have other reasons than the fact that they are 'cheap' and 'selfish'.

[daltonism]

I wouldn't tip in costa or star bucks because you're paying (in England) £2.50 for a regular coffee! I mean, I know it's good coffee but coffee from this baguette bar I go to by my lunch from some days sells coffee for £1.50 and it's just as good. If the expect me to tip at Costa or SB I just say no. Because the tipping service there is, "Let's put a jar on the counter and earn another £10 a week." So no.

However, if I go to a good restaurant with good service and good food then I'll tip. Sure. But I wouldn't tip a McD worker because they shove food on a tray and hand it to you. A waiter must carry the food to you, some restaurants even demand that they talk to you. So I find what happened to you in SB outrageous.

[Calalily]

Also if employers eliminated the tipping custom by paying servers minimum wage or better guess who's gonna pay for that? You. Because now they have to make enough money to cover the business as well as employee wages, so all prices go up.

They already pay for it anyway - through tips. If staff get a 30% tip, which is what I understood to be the acceptable thing, then what's the difference between it being in the hand, or filtered through the business books? If wages and prices are raised by 30%, then tipping could be eliminated, and servers not have to worry about how good a job they're doing.

It seems insane that those who are making money for the business (in that good service draws back customers) get the least amount of money and good service is supposed to be a fringe benefit that you pay for.

When we went to the US, we tipped - pretty much everybody because we didn't know how it all works. As an Australian who never tipped anyone in their life, it was very very difficult. I had the maths worked out, but working money into the whole exchange was so uncomfortable.

We have some American franchises that have tip jars out front here, and some people offload their change there, but most people don't bother - they're paid minimum wage (which is liveable here - $27,000 or so) and so it's not of concern. I have never tipped another Australian in my life - I've said keep the change for particularly nice taxi drivers who help with groceries, and given money to buskers (street performers etc.) but never tipped.

Interesting about the Japanese view of tipping - didn't know that :beer:

[shirokuma]

Yeah, if you tip in Japan, you're implying that your waiter or waitress has to be paid extra to do a good job. It's a huge insult.

[Synthesis]

If you're so high and mighty about tipping and the server's wages, why don't you put pressure on your government to change it?

Easy. The American political climate tends to ignore, and does not look favorably upon 1) The Poor, 2) The Young, and 3) Traditional Labor Causes. This includes servers, who are frequently poor, young, and would be ideal candidates to labor movements if they existed (I live in the Georgia--in parts of which organized labor is about as alien as little green men). In many areas, organized labor (the sort of thing that would petition and strike for higher serving wages) is tantamount to communist conspiracy against the government, the business community, and America as a whole.

Ignoring that we don't have a particularly receptive government for a democracy, and the love of the status quo, you need only look at the sort of upheaval that follows every attempt to raise the minimum wage in the United States. There's a reason several states have their own local minimum wages.

[shirokuma]

I think that's a little harsh. Sure, petitioning for a strike isn't looked upon favorably, but it doesn't make you appear to be a communist either.

However, the fact that the government ignores the issue doesn't mean people have to roll over and take it. If enough people who were passionate enough about servers and their wages got together and started a movement, I believe something could be done. Problem is, most people don't care enough to do it because they don't plan on making a career out of waiting tables.

[ChihoSan]

We have some American franchises that have tip jars out front here, and some people offload their change there, but most people don't bother - they're paid minimum wage (which is liveable here - $27,000 or so) and so it's not of concern.

I wish our minimum wage was that high. I make a little more than minimum wage and even so if I worked full time, I'd still only make $13,440... since my rent is $6360 a year, and I spend roughly $1000 a year on diapers and formula, not including electricty, cable, groceries, gas and other misc. bills there is no way I make even near enough to cover that.

BTW, as a reminder I work about 20 hours a week at Starbucks so my husband can work his full time job and we can avoid daycare.

[ateKna]

For everyone that thinks the customer does not owe a tip, I disagree completely. No matter what country I am in, I ALWAYS tip. It is an expectation of someone in the service industry that they are getting a tip from the customer. It is a mechanism of society that we respond to a wait staff by rewarding them with a customary 18% tip.

The same can be said for other things. Most of us put on a pair of pants, shorts, skirt, whatever (something to cover ourselves) before going outside. If it wasn't a set rule, then a lot less people might not put on anything They might just be happy with underpants or something.

Even though THAT is an extreme example, the same conditioning can be applied to tips. Should we really be so cheap that we go out to have a meal, in all probability with another person or persons, and then embaress ourselves by not leaving a tip? How cheap is that. If you go to a restuarant where you can't afford a tip or do not believe in tips, then you really have no business going to that establishment in the first place.

As for tip jars, they are just designed to coax consumers into depositing their extra change and as I said before, have no bearing on the service provided. They are certainly a completely different invention than the concept of tipping a person that provided you a service, because tipping jars occur at places where people are doing a routine job and not customizing your service.

[SilentPsycho]

No matter what country I am in, I ALWAYS tip. It is an expectation of someone in the service industry that they are getting a tip from the customer. It is a mechanism of society that we respond to a wait staff by rewarding them with a customary 18% tip.

In America, then this may be the case. I've been all over the place, but I've never seen anyone in any country demand something like 18% or 14.78878463% of the bill. The fact that people actually calculate their bills astound me. If I do tip, it's usually a pound or two.

And as for the bit about the fact that it's an expectation, again that only seems to be in America. As has been said, tipping in Japan is considered a strong insult. How many other cultures are similar to that?

Here's some more examples:

Asia

Tipping is frowned upon in Asia and shows anger at the low prices, although there are regional variations.

China

In China, traditionally there is no tipping. However, hotels that routinely serve foreign tourists may allow tipping. An example would be tour guides and associated drivers.

India
In India there has traditionally been little or no tipping. However, many upscale restaurants have helped establish a new trend of tipping in India. The act is known as chai-pani (for tea or water) or baksheesh (a term used to describe both charity and bribery). Occasionally autorickshaw drivers ask for a tip, but this is uncommon.

Malaysia
Tipping is not customarily done in Malaysia.

South Korea
Tipping is not the custom in South Korea and it is almost never expected. Many hotels and a few tourist restaurants add 10% service charge on their checks. However, it is deemed customary (although not mandatory) to tip porters and maids in international hotels, and it is always considered a generous gesture to ask taxi drivers to keep the change.

Taiwan
In Taiwan tipping is rare except when a customer uses a porter at an airport, which is usually 50 new Taiwan dollars per luggage, or wants to show appreciation for exceptional service. Many restaurants and hotels already add 10% service charges. Taxi drivers may not wilfully refuse to make change or ask for tips.

Austrailia has already been mentioned.

New Zealand
Tipping is not part of New Zealand culture and is often treated with suspicion or actively frowned upon, as many people view it as a largely American custom that over-compensates certain workers while others are left out; additionally there is a feeling that tipping is paying twice for one service. Despite this, some forms of tipping are common, such as rounding up a taxi fare. It is almost as likely, however, that the taxi driver will round the fare down to the nearest dollar. Some cafés keep a jar on the counter marked "tips for staff" in which customers can leave small change. Occasionally tips are given in a restaurant for exceptional service; particularly in the larger cities like Wellington or Auckland. Others may feel that the people who do this are being ostentatious and showing off their wealth. New Zealanders traveling overseas often find the custom difficult and confusing.

France
In France, service charge is always included, and so tipping, or le pourboire (lit. "for a drink"), is not expected.

Spain
Tipping is not customary in Spain and it is almost never done among natives. In fact, the Mexican Spanish term propina actually connotes bribery, not respect, as in European Spanish. While in bars and small restaurants, Spaniards only leave as a tip the small change they receive in a plate after paying the bill. In more sophisticated restaurants it is customary to leave between 5% and 10%. No tips are expected outside the restaurant business.

[ateKna]

Yes but I will point out that as a foriegner in some of the Asian countries such as China, tipping is acceptable. Such as in hotels, or lavatories. Tipping in some countries can be looked upon as bribery, but it really depends on where you go and what type of establishment you are in.
Generally any upscale restuarant I have ever been to has been in favor of tipping, although my travels have been confined to Europe, Canada, the US and a few places in South America. In France, just like in NY, there is a service charge but at finer establishments, and also big nightclubs, there are still tips given out. In my experience, because I work in the fashion industry, I have learned by example of the people around me that tips are given in Italy, France, Germany, and especially here in the US. So I guess because I am American(actually I am Austrian/American) tipping would not be considered an insult to most people, and my background would make behavior appropriate. However, you bring up a very good point, SilentPsycho, and you have certainly done your research.

[shirokuma]

For everyone that thinks the customer does not owe a tip, I disagree completely. No matter what country I am in, I ALWAYS tip. It is an expectation of someone in the service industry that they are getting a tip from the customer. It is a mechanism of society that we respond to a wait staff by rewarding them with a customary 18% tip.

The same can be said for other things. Most of us put on a pair of pants, shorts, skirt, whatever (something to cover ourselves) before going outside. If it wasn't a set rule, then a lot less people might not put on anything They might just be happy with underpants or something.

Even though THAT is an extreme example, the same conditioning can be applied to tips. Should we really be so cheap that we go out to have a meal, in all probability with another person or persons, and then embaress ourselves by not leaving a tip? How cheap is that. If you go to a restuarant where you can't afford a tip or do not believe in tips, then you really have no business going to that establishment in the first place.

As for tip jars, they are just designed to coax consumers into depositing their extra change and as I said before, have no bearing on the service provided. They are certainly a completely different invention than the concept of tipping a person that provided you a service, because tipping jars occur at places where people are doing a routine job and not customizing your service.

Comparing tipping to wearing clothes holds no weight with me extreme or not. It's completely irrevalent. Sure it's socially acceptable to tip, but that has nothing to do with wearing clothes. We wear clothes to protect us from the elements throughout the year. While wait staff can do without tips, we cannot do without clothes. If we don't wear clothes we can get sick and die. Show me a waiter or waitress that died because they didn't receive a tip, They probably had other issues.

Feeling embarrassed because you didn't leave a tip is relative. I don't tip all the time, but some of my friends do. They tease me about it, and one had a cow because I didn't. I still didn't feel embarrassed. In fact, I found it amusing.

Again, the idea that I shouldn't go because I can't or won't tip is hideous. To me, it shows just how out of control the tipping culture has become. I wouldn't be at all sad if it was done away with,

[ateKna]

shirokuma, I was trying to illustrate that because it is a a standard to tip, particularly in the US, just like it is a standard to put on one's clothing. Not just because of embarassment, but because in both regards it meets moral expectations. Think of how you would feel if you saw someone without pants. Now think of how you would feel if you were a server and you had done your job properly, and no one left you a minimum tip. In both cases, you would feel upset, one at seeing someone without pants, and one because no one left you a tip.
I guess I was hoping to use a universal illustration that everyone would understand but I used poor judgement in picking that example, because it is so unrelated in comparison to the current deliberation.
I see your point of view that you do not feel embarassed about leaving a tip. But also because you do not believe something is right, it is ok to make a statement. Think however, how someone might misinterpret what you do. By you leaving no tip, a person who works with the expectation of recieving that tip will suffer at your expense. I will deviate from my example about clothing from now on, but I just want to clarify that last post as something that reflects on society on a reactive level. In other words, although they are not in the same schema, on a reactionary level I think that there was some bearing to what I said.
Ultimately I agree that not everyone should subscribe to an idea that tipping is the best invention since the space shuttle. I actually think employeers should be the ones to pay waiters a commision, but tipping has a long history and has evolved to what it is today, forcing the common man to reach into his pocket for 20% or around that. Many of the people I am around would certainly have things to say about me if I didn;t tip, and you can't expect some of these resturants to pay waiters a fair wage, and so inevitably part of going out to eat involves paying that part of the bill. Just like inevitably being a gentlemen involves opening doors for the ladies.

[Psy10]

For everyone that thinks the customer does not owe a tip, I disagree completely. No matter what country I am in, I ALWAYS tip. It is an expectation of someone in the service industry that they are getting a tip from the customer. It is a mechanism of society that we respond to a wait staff by rewarding them with a customary 18% tip.

This makes absolutely no sense. A tip by definition is:

A small sum of money given to someone for performing exceptional service; a gratuity.

The customer is not required to tip the waitstaff or anyone else that is performing a service. It has to be earned. You don't tip sucky waiters because you think it's a cardinal rule. YOU can always tip all you want but the rest of us will remain sensible and tip when the service has exceeded our expectations.

I wonder when and if you get really bad service will you leave a tip? I mean what type of message will that send? The consumer is under no obligation to tip if the service provider cannot take the time to be helpful and courteous.

Also, the clothes analogy is a faulty one at best. :anime:

[rome_raven]

The whole concept of Tipping is that it's supposed to be an option on the part of the cutomer. If they want to tip, they can leave whatever they feel is a proper amount. I don't believe it's something that should be expected. I hate it when restaurants automatically add it to my bill. Everytime I see that, I no longer feel that gratuitous (sp?)

Today, a customer at my store surprised me by giving me a tip of $5 for helping her find clothes. I didn't need the money and I don't even know what my store's policy is on tipping (because in some places, they say that it's absolutely not allowed). I felt kind of weird about it because techinically, even though I had stayed over my shift by 1/2 an hour, the company would be paying me for that anyways. I donated the money to my friend who is doing a Breast Cancer Walk instead. Made me feel good and the customer felt good too.

[Calalily]

For everyone that thinks the customer does not owe a tip, I disagree completely. No matter what country I am in, I ALWAYS tip. It is an expectation of someone in the service industry that they are getting a tip from the customer. It is a mechanism of society that we respond to a wait staff by rewarding them with a customary 18% tip.

No - it really isn't an Australian thing. For a start, employees are asked to leave their money in their locker etc., and as a worker, it's perilous to be caught with money while working a register. That's why the American franchises put jars out the front. I used to work in customer service, and being caught with money is real trouble. You either get accused of stealing, rigging the till, or overcharging the customer.

It is a mechanism of your society perhaps, but our country is not a clone of America, and this would be received very dimly here.

I wish our minimum wage was that high.

It's not brilliant, but it's alright. I've lived on it. It's also augmented with government payments to parents to take care of their children (about $100 per kid per fortnight).

[ateKna]

Interesting, calalily. I had no idea it was percieved so differently there in Australia. I have never had the opportunity to visit there, unfortunately. I would think that just like when one goes to any other country that isn't there own, they usually find out about these things beforehand. In my experience, I haven't ran into tips being decline or looked down upon, so I should probably at least clarify that I was speaking from a North American perspective so as not to generalize places such as the UK, Australia, the Pacific Islands, or other places I am being told that tipping isn't customary.
My orginal belief is still intact, however, that in places where the primary income of service people are tips, and tipping is considered 'classy' and expected, I feel that if someone has done their job, then they are obligated to the tip. (Again, in applicable places.)

[Annique]

Tipping isn't very big over here (stingy Dutchmen :p) but when I have some change I tip about 15-20%. It's not much, and it puts a smile on people's faces :p

[Mark2512]

I was kinda shocked when I went to America and everyone kind of demanded tips. I had to keep a pocket of change just to tip people for basically doing their job, often not even particually well. For example I was quite happily carrying my luggage in the airport with no problems when a handler came up and asked to help. I said i was alright but he insisted so i just assumed he was being helpful, we get about 20 metres up the concorse put my luggage down. I say 'Cheers' pick it back up again and begin to walk off, however i could hear him following me i turned around and realise hes got his hand laid out. He then has the cheek to say, 'I think you have something for me'... It took me a minute to cotton on to what he wanted. Id finished off all my american cash and only had sterling left so i opened my wallet flicked through some notes and told him i only had english money. He said, 'Oh i dont mind', i assumed he meant he didnt mind not having a tip but then saw his hand still open. I ended up having to give him a 5 pound note (which is about 10 dollars!) just to leave me alone.

I understand that this guy lives off tips but it seemed to me afterwards Id been a victim of the most polite mugging ever. The idea that someone would go out their way to apparantly help you out and then demand money is a bit adhorent to me. I think it would be much easier to people visiting america if the porters had a sign round their neck simply saying "$5 dollars to carry your luggage." I think they still think they are entitled a tip even if their service is below par. In Britain you are expected to earn a tip. For example in my ex-job i used to regually carry stuff out to peoples cars - that was my job which i got £3.60 an hour to do and i would look upon tips as a pleasent surprise not something Im owed.

[babicatz05]

I would have been so ticked. Probably so mad that I would have told him I had no cash on me. I also believe tipping should be an option instead of a requirement.