Michael Vick

[TWills23]

As pretty much everyone knows, Michael Vick of the Atlanta Falcons was charged with dog fighting and several counts of animal cruelty. Do you think he deserves the most harsh punishments? Should the NFL give him the boot? Last, do you think people like him are giving Pit Bulls a bad name?

Cheers.

[TRIriana]

I haven't hearrd of Michael Vick before - if you have an article to link to, that always helps. :), but regardless of what his job is dog fighting is still a crime, and he should have to deal with the punishment dealt out to him.

People who breed dogs to fight, not always keeping them in the best conditions and oftentimes starving them so they have the "bloodlust" in the ring, definitely give them a bad name. You say pit bull and people immediately think of vicious dohgs that attack people, and this isn't the majority case.

When a pit bull is found to have been used in fights, and there are visible signs on the animals itself, they're put down because they can't have "training" reversed. But pitbulls that have never been in the ring, have never been taught to fight - to the death or otherwise - are gorgeous animals.

[davious]

I think the NFL did the right thing in telling Vick not to come to training camp. He hasn't officially been suspended, but its in the best interests of Michael Vick, the Atlanta Falcons, and the NFL that Vick doesn't attend training camp, and doesn't start the NFL season as the Falcons Quarterback. He needs to concentrate on his defense of the charges against him. If and when (the speed at which the Feds indicted him tells me they think they have a rock solid case against him, and the Feds have an amazing conviction rate when they go after someone, its like 90%) Vick will be banned from the league. Its only a matter of time. What is interesting to me is that the Feds brought charges against Vick in only a month's time, yet, have had over a year and a half to indict Barry Bonds for steroid usage, and haven't. Its all about evidence. They must have some really good evidence against Vick, thats lacking with Bonds.

[Modestgurl88]

I think the NFL did the right thing in telling Vick not to come to training camp. He hasn't officially been suspended, but its in the best interests of Michael Vick, the Atlanta Falcons, and the NFL that Vick doesn't attend training camp, and doesn't start the NFL season as the Falcons Quarterback. He needs to concentrate on his defense of the charges against him. If and when (the speed at which the Feds indicted him tells me they think they have a rock solid case against him, and the Feds have an amazing conviction rate when they go after someone, its like 90%) Vick will be banned from the league. Its only a matter of time. What is interesting to me is that the Feds brought charges against Vick in only a month's time, yet, have had over a year and a half to indict Barry Bonds for steroid usage, and haven't. Its all about evidence. They must have some really good evidence against Vick, thats lacking with Bonds.
They don't have enough evidence with Bonds? How is that even possible :blink: Anyhow, Vick should be suspended.I know some people are thinking it's just dogs but dogfighting is brutal and animal cruelty. I don't understand how anyone could not understand that.This should be a lesson to all proathletes that they aren't above the law..even for animal cruelty

[hszmv]

I don't know anyone in the world who would say "Give Vick a second chance." You can get that with murderers and rapists, but not people who hurt dogs. There really isn't a soul alive who wouldn't say "Let him Fry!!!!!"

I don't know if the pictures have been released, and I don't plan to look. If they are anything like the pictures I saw in another case, then I don't want to see them. This "sport" takes otherwise wonderful animals and hurts them so bad, they look sick and alien. They are some of the most disgusting things you will ever see, and it is terrible that humans are the cause of it.

But, then, I look at the case, and there is no way Vick won't burn. If the courts with the 80% conviction rate doesn't cause it, he will be banned. If he isn't banned, he will loose endorsments. If in some miracle he gets through all of his life like O.J. Simpson, we can all take pleasure knowing that all dogs go to heaven. Justice will be served.

[davious]

They don't have enough evidence with Bonds? How is that even possible :blink: Anyhow, Vick should be suspended.I know some people are thinking it's just dogs but dogfighting is brutal and animal cruelty. I don't understand how anyone could not understand that.This should be a lesson to all proathletes that they aren't above the law..even for animal cruelty

I know it seems incredulous, but no, Bonds has not been indicted...of course, that may have something to do with the fact that he has never actually tested positive for anything, to the best of my knowledge...Barry Bonds is certainly guilty in the court of public opinion, we certainly are pretty sure that its obvious he used steroids, but without any positive tests proving that, public opinion doesn't get you indicted...Its also possible that they will indict him in September, when they reconvene, and are just waiting until then. But, I can't stress enough how I think the speed at which the Feds came down on Vick is indictive of their confidence in their case...they must have the proverbial smoking gun, whether its a paper trail detailing how he paid for it all, being able to place him at one or more of the fights, something that will condemn Vick besides mere accusation.

[ayshala]

Boil him in oil!!!!!!!!! I'm dead seriouse! I am so sick of macho humans subjecting animals to horrid things just for their own amusement! I think it is sick and he should be kicked out.

I really hate that it was Pit Bulls too. My best friend is trying desperately to find a house for her, her son, her fiance, her two cats, and her two pit bulls. BUT, everytime someone hears Pit Bulls, they tell her no. In fact, many of the insurance companies covering the rented houses refuse to let her move into the home because of the dogs. These two dogs are the freakin silliest, goofiest, most loving dogs you've ever met. They look like Disney cartoons and act like love filled puppies. They also have a very strong belief they are lap dogs. Anyway.....it is things like this that give them a bad name.

It is when people TEACH these animals violence and aggression that there are problems. Don't get me wrong, some dogs can be mean, some can be deadly. But more often than not, I see people with Pit Bulls, Rotwielers, Dobermans and such, teaching the animals cruelty......then fly off the handle when one of them bites the postman or whatever. Then that dog gets a bad name for something it isnt really responsible for.

[chynableu]

As pretty much everyone knows, Michael Vick of the Atlanta Falcons was charged with dog fighting and several counts of animal cruelty. Do you think he deserves the most harsh punishments? Should the NFL give him the boot? Last, do you think people like him are giving Pit Bulls a bad name?

Cheers.


If he is found guilty, I think he should receive the punishment that is regularly appointed to those guilty of dog fighting. I don't think the punishment should be any harsher than normal because he's an NFL star. If he is found guilty, I think the NFL should suspend him. However, I think the league is right in suggesting he not attend training camp and start the upcoming season because Vick's troubles are disruptive to the team and if he really wants what's best for them, he'll sit out until he can get his business in order.

I've never had a high opinion of pit bulls because it seems they are a vicious breed of dog that has been responsible for so many human maulings, especially those of children. Just recently I read an article about a pit that sodomized a two-year-old, who required corrective surgery. I'm pretty sure their aggressiveness is instigated by the humans that own them, however I wonder why it's always pits that are banned in certain cities and making the news for being so violent - moreso than other breeds? Not to condone what Vick did. I think dog fighting is pretty barbaric and cruel, though it's existed for centuries both here and overseas.

Truthfully, when all this hoopla over Vick first started, I thought he had got in trouble for something a lot "worse", like murder or child molestation or something like that. I was shocked to see the news was over dog fighting.

[ayshala]

I often wonder how much of this is "reputation" caused. Someone buys a pit bull and makes it mean because pit bulls are "supposed" to be mean. You rarely see that type of person buying a toy poodle to do the same with it. My friend I spoke of actually has three dogs. One of them is a stray chihuahaa (sp?) and weiner dog mix. Everyone except her son hates that dog. I am much more worried about being bitten by that little dog than I am by her pit bulls.

My ex had a bull dog, and cats could chase it around it was such a wuss! In my life, I've repeatedly seen people getting certain breeds of dog and making dogs mean (in general) and teaching them to attack more than I've seen one breed of dog actually naturally acting like that. Again, all dogs could be mean or crazy, but in general, i see nothing as far as aggresiveness in one breed more than another.

[jenny]

I think the NFL did the right thing in telling Vick not to come to training camp. He hasn't officially been suspended, but its in the best interests of Michael Vick, the Atlanta Falcons, and the NFL that Vick doesn't attend training camp, and doesn't start the NFL season as the Falcons Quarterback. He needs to concentrate on his defense of the charges against him. If and when (the speed at which the Feds indicted him tells me they think they have a rock solid case against him, and the Feds have an amazing conviction rate when they go after someone, its like 90%) Vick will be banned from the league. Its only a matter of time. What is interesting to me is that the Feds brought charges against Vick in only a month's time, yet, have had over a year and a half to indict Barry Bonds for steroid usage, and haven't. Its all about evidence. They must have some really good evidence against Vick, thats lacking with Bonds.


I agree, I know nothing about bonds so I have nothing to say but the dog fighting issue is out of control, its inhumane and cruel....I hope it leads to other arrests. From what I understand they have a ton of evidence.

[Catwalk_SC]

I hope with everything that he is locked away for the rest of his life.
It completely pissed me off when I found out he may only get a few years in jail. That's hardly enough. To me, there is no difference between doing what he did to a dog and doing the same to a person. It's even worse, actually, because a dog cannot fight back. If you tie up a person, they could always get a away, there have been stories after stories of people getting away before their attacker could do harm. But do you honestly think a poor dog, who has been abused by this jackass his entire life can get away? Hardly.
I am increasingly angered every time I hear about something like this happening. Why are we spending so much time on stupid things and not spending more time dealing with these crimes? This went on for a while, for my understanding, why in the world was this not noticed?

:rant:

Animal abuse is kind of a hot topic with me.

[TWills23]

The things he did were truly horrible. If some of you didn't know, if a dog "lost" (I say "lost" because the way I look at it, every dog involved will lose in some way), he did such things as electrocute, drown, burn, beat, even pick up a dog and beat it against the ground until it died. I just can't fathom why people do this. I volunteered at an animal shelter a few years ago and I saw the victims of dog fighting all the time. It's one of the saddest sights I've ever witnessed. I saw dogs that were set on fire and survived. Michael Vick should receive full punishment for this. I wish animal cruelty punishments were more harsh, but since they aren't, I just hope he gets the full extent.

[LilacBaby]

He should be put away for the rest of his life. If it was humans instead of dogs, he would have killed enough for the police to shoot him and kill him right there. Just because these are dogs, it shouldn't mean he get less time. They are living things as well who survive on food, water and shelter like we do and the sentence shouldn't be any lighter. And I don't know if anyone has seen pictures or videos on the news but it's horrible. And on another note the NFL should kick him on out. He's now a criminal. It's not like he just mugged someone, no, he killed dogs and lots of them just so he can find some amusement. Go to a strip club instead, because that way you're not killing anything!

Oh and I'm sorry if I may have been too strong on that I'm just very against animal cruelty. I'm sorry if I offended anybody as well, with my last line.

[Modestgurl88]

He should be put away for the rest of his life. If it was humans instead of dogs, he would have killed enough for the police to shoot him and kill him right there. Just because these are dogs, it shouldn't mean he get less time. They are living things as well who survive on food, water and shelter like we do and the sentence shouldn't be any lighter. And I don't know if anyone has seen pictures or videos on the news but it's horrible. And on another note the NFL should kick him on out. He's now a criminal. It's not like he just mugged someone, no, he killed dogs and lots of them just so he can find some amusement. Go to a strip club instead, because that way you're not killing anything!

Oh and I'm sorry if I may have been too strong on that I'm just very against animal cruelty. I'm sorry if I offended anybody as well, with my last line.
You're not coming off too strong.Psychologists have said that people who commit animal cruelity are usually not too far from being violent towards other people.That's partly why the laws against animal cruelty are so tough. In a way they need to be tougher. It seems like there are way too many examples of animal cruelty nowadays.

[ayshala]

Animal cruelty (and being male) are some of the first signs of a serial killer! Heh, I love that being a man is on the list of signs of a serial killer........

[Jasmin_SC]

I had no clue who Micheal Vick was until I searched on the internet, I also searched..

(Warning, please do not search this if you are scremesh and or easily sick, I know I was.)

Micheal Vick dog.

I was horrified, I felt disguisted about what he did to those dogs, as a dog lover myself I feel anger burning up inside of me when I see those faces of innocent dogs. I saw a rather disturbing picture of a pile of dead dogs, and instead of anger I felt relief, those poor dogs are finnaly out of their misery. I cannot believe people bet and watch these fights without guilt. What he does to those dogs are inhumane and he should rot in hell.

-rant over-

[Connectzeedots_SC]

The general thing about pitbulls that many people think are that they are hostile.

Maybe it's because terrible excuses for human beings are making them fight for their own amusement, and therefore being insanely cruel.

Michael Vick...


is an a**hole.


I don't care if he's an athlete. He's also a monster.

[Modestgurl88]

I can't believe that now his case is becoming a race issue...how can anyone say animal cruelty punishment has to do with race? People amaze me sometimes....and not in good ways :(

[ayshala]

I can't believe that now his case is becoming a race issue...how can anyone say animal cruelty punishment has to do with race? People amaze me sometimes....and not in good ways :(
Huh?? Race issue? What did I miss?

[davious]

I haven't heard anything about a race issue, but, if it were to be a race issue, it would be something similar to this:

I am a white person, therefore Michael Vick must obviously be guilty.
I am a black person, so Michael Vick must obviously be not guilty.

[hszmv]

No, it is more of a "This is the white man's fault because it is his law and our customs" race issue. Of course, these are from drug dealers who see owning Pit Bulls as tandem to (I am sorry if this offends anyone, but yeah, it is like this in the real world) a gun. Drug dealers with priors who cannot own guns find an alternative in Pit Bulls bought from people who raise them for the purpose of fighting in the rings. Of course, this isn't exclusive to blacks, as whites also fight dogs. And many blacks are just as outraged as whites. And whites are siding with Vick.

But its a black man, so it must be about race.

[PorkChopzNGravy]

I'm Black and I'm disgusted by his actions like I would be by anyone else who would participate in such a thing, White, Black, Puerto Rican, Candy Apple Red, whatever!

[chynableu]

No, it is more of a "This is the white man's fault because it is his law and our customs" race issue. Of course, these are from drug dealers who see owning Pit Bulls as tandem to (I am sorry if this offends anyone, but yeah, it is like this in the real world) a gun. Drug dealers with priors who cannot own guns find an alternative in Pit Bulls bought from people who raise them for the purpose of fighting in the rings.



LMAO!!!!!!!!!!! So instead of drug dealers using guns in drive-bys, they'll use pit bulls instead?! :laugh: Sorry if that's not what you meant but that image just cracks me up.

[hszmv]

Yeah it's not what I meant. And to be honost, I never thought I would get a reaction to that statement like yours. No, Pitbulls are used as cheap alternatives to guns, and since there are no restrictions on owning a dog as per parolle, are weapons of choice for those who have priors. It's the way it is, but there is no slingshot launching of dogs.

[chynableu]

Well excuse my humor, but I just never pictured drug dealers using pit bulls as weapons. Maybe you could elaborate? I mean, do they use them to torture people who owe them money? People who've betrayed them? I've been exposed to a lot living in the hood I was raised but this is a new concept for me. I see a lot of guys with pits and I know they definitely dog fight, but I never knew they used them as weapons. How are they really alternatives to guns?

[Charmaine06]

I am a big animal lover, especially of dogs, and this may be harsh but I think people who make their dogs fight and torture/kill them should be executed or get life in prison (even though that's not going to happen). I value animal life as much as human life. A life is a life and all should be valued. Michael Vick should lose his career in the NFL and not ever get a chance to get it back. (I'm black and I don't support him at all.) Who would want someone with a reputation like that on the team? People who do things like that, no matter what "race", disgust me. I can't stand murderers and people who torture others, human or animal. I don't think people like him are giving pit bulls a bad name. He's given himself a bad name.

[Wintermute]

The NFL should give him the boot if it wants to save face; if the team keeps him because he's this "star player" who they acquired as the #1 pick in the NFL Draft, shame on them. I'm glad Nike and Reebok are taking steps to end their endorsement of him--no self-respecting company would want to be associated with this sicko, no matter how money-hungry it is.

Why does it always have to be about race if it involves a black player and his mostly white managers (correct me if I'm wrong--I don't know a whit about the NFL)? This is about animal cruelty. No matter who advocates or promotes dogfighting, whatever his/her race, that person is a freaking monster and should be punished to the fullest extent. It never was a race issue...then people make it into one.

I might get flamed for this, but dogfighting should be near or on par with crimes against children/murder. These are innocent animals who are injected with artificial hormones and drugs, provoked into fierce rages; forced to be raped, shackled, kept in despicable conditions; and so violent they can't be put up for adoption once rescued (for those lucky enough to survive). The way they are punished for losing fights is just unspeakably cruel. I can't seem to understand why people minimize the significance of this abhorrent practice because the victims are just dumb, drooling, subservient animals, and not intelligent, reasonable humans (of whom Michael Vick is not one) :(.

On the subject of pit bulls--sure, blame the dogs for being aggression-prone and not the humans who domesticated the wolf and selectively bred the ancestors of the pit bull for their qualities. I've read on many sites that pit bulls are supposed to be protective toward children as well as extremely loyal and obedient dogs. They are part-terrier, and terriers by nature are aggression-prone. Pit bulls are also extremely energetic, and if not channeled into activities like training and exercise, the energy could be used for destruction.

[nixie_SC]

Burn in Hell michael vick. this is the time that I wish Hell is real so michael vick will burn there for eternity.

[mellimello]

I never thought this could even be a race issue until I read an article by this sportswriter. He basically said that at Vick's arraignment, the "lines" were clearly divided into those who have already made up their minds that Vick is guilty and those who believe he should get due process. Basically those who were "pro-due process" were black and those who were "anti-Vick" were white.

As someone already said, this really has nothing to do with race or anything like that, but with the torture of animals. It really bothers me when people turn something like this into a race issue.

[bunnylita]

The media is making it into a race issue. I live in Atlanta and this is on the news everyday. Every time they interview an animal lover, it's a white person. Every time they interview a Michael Vick supporter, it's a black person. Every. Single. Time. I'm sure there are people of both races on both sides, but the news doesn't show them. It's the most aggravating thing. Well, second only that this story is always the first news story of the night, even when decidedly more important events have happened that day.

I think his suspension was a bit much considering that Ray Lewis was charged with murder a few years ago and he wasn't suspended.

[Charmaine06]

The NFL should give him the boot if it wants to save face; if the team keeps him because he's this "star player" who they acquired as the #1 pick in the NFL Draft, shame on them. I'm glad Nike and Reebok are taking steps to end their endorsement of him--no self-respecting company would want to be associated with this sicko, no matter how money-hungry it is.

Why does it always have to be about race if it involves a black player and his mostly white managers (correct me if I'm wrong--I don't know a whit about the NFL)? This is about animal cruelty. No matter who advocates or promotes dogfighting, whatever his/her race, that person is a freaking monster and should be punished to the fullest extent. It never was a race issue...then people make it into one.

I might get flamed for this, but dogfighting should be near or on par with crimes against children/murder. These are innocent animals who are injected with artificial hormones and drugs, provoked into fierce rages; forced to be raped, shackled, kept in despicable conditions; and so violent they can't be put up for adoption once rescued (for those lucky enough to survive). The way they are punished for losing fights is just unspeakably cruel. I can't seem to understand why people minimize the significance of this abhorrent practice because the victims are just dumb, drooling, subservient animals, and not intelligent, reasonable humans (of whom Michael Vick is not one) :(.

On the subject of pit bulls--sure, blame the dogs for being aggression-prone and not the humans who domesticated the wolf and selectively bred the ancestors of the pit bull for their qualities. I've read on many sites that pit bulls are supposed to be protective toward children as well as extremely loyal and obedient dogs. They are part-terrier, and terriers by nature are aggression-prone. Pit bulls are also extremely energetic, and if not channeled into activities like training and exercise, the energy could be used for destruction.
I agree 100% with you. The NFL shouldn't want a torturer/murderer playing for it. Nike and Reebok are doing the right thing also. Animals' lives are VERY valuable and they should be treated with dignity.
I don't consider this a race issue. I would feel the way I do no matter what "race" of the person. Laws should be changed for inhumane acts against animals. A few days in jail or a fine is not good enough. It should be more like years in prison. I would even support the death penalty for certain cases. I wouldn't worry about getting flamed for my opinion, because I have every right to state it. "Owning" animals should be a privilege, not a right, because not everyone is responsible, financially-stable, and nurturing enough to "own" one. Too bad that what he's responsible for doing to those dogs can't be done to him. I'd like to see how much he would like it. :naughty:

[davious]

Ray Lewis is one of the reasons Vick isn't at training camp now. First year commissioner Roger Goodell saw all of the troubles players were getting into the last 10 years or so, and said thats it, as long as I am commissioner, I am gonna clean up the image. Previous commissioner, Paul Tagliabue, despite being overall probably being a really good commissioner, did allow players to get away with behavior that gave the league a bad name. The new commissioner, Goodell, is taking more of a hardline approach. He will suspend players without a conviction, if they have a history of previous encounters with law. Michael Vick has a history of previous encounters with the law. A first time offender would not have necessarily been told to skip camp.

[bunnylita]

I was wondering why he got suspended and Lewis didn't. Good to know. Having said that, his incident at the airport (I think that's the problem with the law you're referring to), however stupid, really can't be compared to this dog fighting thing. He was cleared of all wrongdoing, and it shouldn't be used against him in this case.

[Wintermute]

I read the news lately, and apparently 200 fans went to some rally to support Vick. They are either blindly loyal, sympathetic, or they pity him. Sure, he hasn't been convicted of the crime yet, but the evidence is clearly pointing strongly in the direction of "guilty". These fans certainly don't think so--they believe that Vick should be presumed innocent and given a fair trial. Judging from his position as a highly-paid sports star, he will have a fair trial--fairer than the trials they give normal people! They even held up banners proclaiming their support for Vick as a "human being over dogs" (article (http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/07/30/200-fans-rally-to-support-michael-vick/)), and citing all of the ways in which he benefited the city of Atlanta.

So "no big deal" dog-fighting can be forgiven for the money he brought to the city for playing football? Disgusting.

When it comes to a serious crime like dog-fighting, sorry, but it trumps football and your precious team. Period.

[davious]

Besides having a suspicious hidden compartment in a water bottle, (he claims it was for jewelry, but, c'mon...I don't think anyone really buys that story) Vick also was sued (settled out of court) for not disclosing to a sexual partner that he had herpes, despite having previous knowledge of it (he went to clinics under pseudonym "Ron Mexico", to avoid his herpes being public knowledge). Then, there is his attitude towards the fans, who he gave the bird to after the Falcons lost to the Saints, another smear to the overall reputation of the NFL. Michael Vick has never been a Saint, his previous issues influenced Roger Goodell, I am sure.

[bunnylita]

Miao, shouldn't everyone get a fair trial, whether you like them or not? He does deserve a fair trial. Everyone, no matter how much money they have, deserves one. Sure there's evidence against him. There wouldn't be a trial if there wasn't. Some people think he's innocent. Others that he's guilty. Those people are not stupid because they don't agree with you. The term innocent until proven guilty exists for a reason.

Davious, come on. All that really shouldn't be taken into consideration in this case. He's never gone to jail. I don't remember that giving the bird incident, but in all honesty, I don't think it matters much. Before this incident with the dogs, he had plenty of fans. Maybe he did do what he's accused of, but his previous so-called record isn't much to go on. If it was taken into account into his suspension, that's beyond ridiculous.

[davious]

I am just talking about reasons why NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell took the actions he did...they have nothing to do with the case the Feds have against Vick, but have relevance to Goodell, who is trying to restore the NFL's reputation. Your prior actions have everything to do with how you are perceived. Goodell's job is to run the NFL in the best way he can. If that means suspending someone who is under federal indictment for committing a felony, so be it. Goodell's job is to act in the best interests of the NFL, not the best interests of Michael Vick. And, if you have two athletes who are penalized for a late hit on the QB or something, and if the hit was severe enough, to get fined, if you are the commissioner, do you give the player who has been fined for the same offense 7 times already the same fine you give the player whose first offense it was? NO. Clearly, you penalize the player with the repeated history of late hits more, because he isn't getting the message. The second player, the one who had never been in trouble with the league before, might get the message after the first time, and not do it again...however, if you have a player with a clear history of late hits, the message isn't getting through, and you have to take tougher actions.

Michael Vick got himself into this mess, by purchasing the property the alleged dogfighting occurred on, and by keeping friends that engaged in illegal activities on his property. Thats assuming he is innocent of the other charges...He is still responsible for what happens on his property, and responsible for the actions of his friends while on his property. If there was dogfighting going on there, at the very least, Vick is guilty of being an accomplice to a felony crime.


However, considering the speed at which Vick was indicted, and the conviction rate the Feds have (90% plus), its safe to say the Feds are quite convinced they have more than enough evidence to convict. A court still has to determine that of course, but if the Feds indicted him that quickly, that tells me they have irrefutable evidence that we just don't know about yet. Vick's innocence will be a tough sell. Especially now that one of the co-defendants turned, got a plea bargain, and will testify against Vick. The Government now has a witness that has first hand knowledge of the crimes, has admitted to the crimes, and is willing to testify that Vick not only attended the dogfights, but also was present at the executions...Basically, the Government had enough evidence to indict quickly, and now in addition to that evidence, has a key witness to the alleged events, and how they relate to Vick. The Government has an increasingly rock solid case against him.

Plus, Roger Goodell did Michael Vick a favor by suspending him. Now he can concentrate on building his defense against the Federal indictment. If he had to worry about both his case and the Falcons, he would be ill prepared for both. You simply can't do both effectively. Vick was even suspended WITH pay. He is still getting his millions per year (which will no doubt be helpful to pay attorneys fees), and he doesn't have to split time.

I also wonder what having plenty of fans has to do with anything? OJ Simpson had lots of fans too...yet Nicole and Ron are still dead, aren't they?

[Wintermute]

Miao, shouldn't everyone get a fair trial, whether you like them or not? He does deserve a fair trial. Everyone, no matter how much money they have, deserves one. Sure there's evidence against him. There wouldn't be a trial if there wasn't. Some people think he's innocent. Others that he's guilty. Those people are not stupid because they don't agree with you. The term innocent until proven guilty exists for a reason.Well, yes, of course everyone deserves a fair trial. It's just that since he's a popular sports figure with a significant income in a popular sports league, he is able to afford more influential, powerful lawyers to defend him. I don't know exactly who gets to choose his defense lawyers, but regardless of whether it's the NFL or his own agents, he will have a pretty solid team for his defense. It's not fair to the people with little to no income, because their public defender is chosen for them. Money is a huge factor in everything, and I don't see how it can't influence the quality of a lawyer's representation of his/her client.

[davious]

Well, yes, of course everyone deserves a fair trial. It's just that since he's a popular sports figure with a significant income in a popular sports league, he is able to afford more influential, powerful lawyers to defend him. I don't know exactly who gets to choose his defense lawyers, but regardless of whether it's the NFL or his own agents, he will have a pretty solid team for his defense. It's not fair to the people with little to no income, because their public defender is chosen for them. Money is a huge factor in everything, and I don't see how it can't influence the quality of a lawyer's representation of his/her client.

Vick will be able to afford the best private lawyers, however, the US Government has far more resources than Vick can afford. If the Feds have a rock solid case, and I suspect they do, even the best lawyers will not be able to get Vick out of it.

[shoobles]

When a pit bull is found to have been used in fights, and there are visible signs on the animals itself, they're put down because they can't have "training" reversed.

Dogs that have been fought can be rehabilitated. A significant portion of pit bulls are not aggressive enough to fight on their own, and are forced into it by associating fighting with being fed. Unfortunately, the majority of the time pitties are either too injured or sick due to lack of veterinary care, or they are put to sleep because it is assumed that they will be aggressive toward people. A lot of pit bulls have the type of character, that even after being fought and beaten, that allows them to look at humans, wag their tails and try to lick your hand.

Of course, that is not to say all fighters can be rehabbed, but that they should be evaluated on a case-by-case basis.


My take on Vick? Charge him with everything you can, and impose a lifetime ban on owning or being near animals of any kind.

[bunnylita]

I really don't think suspending Michael Vick did him a favor. The league just caved to outside pressure. There, I said it. I've been skirting around it, and there it is.

And just because he's been charged and they're going to court so quickly doesn't mean he can't get off. I've seen crazier things.

[davious]

Why don't you think they did him a favor? He gets his full pay, doesn't have to worry about getting injured, and can devote his full time to preparing his defense...If he had to go to camp, he would have to split his time between football and his court case. Neither would get the attention each needs to be successful. Football is not a sport where you can half-ass your way through each week...training camp requires your full attention, all of the time. Especially a year like this, where the Falcons have a brand new offense to learn...Furthermore, if you are under a Federal indictment, don't you think that would deserve your full attention too? If Vick only has time to mount half a defense, because training camp is taking up the bulk of his days, he spends the next 6 years in prison, guaranteed. The Government will spending the full day trying to prove him guilty, if he can't spend the same time proving his innocence, he has exactly zero chance at winning. If he misses the season for the Falcons preparing for his case, and is exhonerated, he misses one year of football. If he misses preparing for his defense, he will go to prison, and miss 6 years of his life. Vick the defendant against a Federal indictment is more important than Vick the NFL player. If you don't think giving Vick the time he needs to prepare for his case, while giving him his full pay is a favor, please, I would love to know your reasoning...

[Ledgo]

Dog fighting is very bad. When Vick is a role model for people, and to have that happen, it make you wonder what other people hide. His actions were apalling. However, I have a strong feeling justice will not be served correctly here. Though money can only buy so much, he has alot of the nations hate on him right now. Will he play football again? I doubt. Will he serve time? I doubt any serious time. Money can pretty much buy himself a whole lot less time to deal with. But with Nike recently cutting of an Endorsement deal, he is pretty much losing support. Alot of the nation love pets, and what he did, alot of the nation is agasint him. Even if he goes free, what will he have to go to? Alot of pet lovers pretty much hate him. I personally think he did something horrible. Animals fight naturally, but forcing them to fight for your amusement and greed of money, drugs, and more is damn wrong. If an Animal is provoked into fighting for other amusement, there is seriously something wrong.

Vick seriously screwed up. And it will probrably be a bit until others in the chain get exposed and run down. I am pretty sure he ended his NFL career here I think. It will be a while until the NFL finally restricts him from playing this season, and eventually at all. Best of all, his humiliation will be rubbed in his face by television.

But yea, Suspending him with pay only gives him time to think of an excuse and game plan for his case.

[SenkoTwiik_SC]

Michael Vick isn't any kind of a man. If he was a man, he could go out and fight other humans if he wants to be so big, instead if standing back unharmed and making innocent dogs fight to the death for him. He is a sick piece of crap, and if I was in the NFL, I would not want this sick jerk representing me. He should recieve the full punishment, and nothing less just because he is famous. Dog fighting is not a sport, it is torture and killing of animals. This man is a loser and a pansy@$$ and if he were standing here right now, calling me out, I'd tell him the same.