*UPDATED* Tiffany Hwang (SNSD/Girls'Generation) - Feedback Please

[chezzyg13592]

Hey guys, took a stab at properly creating a celebrity Sim. After getting Showtime, I decided I wanted some real life musicians in my game, so my first project is Girls' Generation member Tiffany :)

I tried to get everything as close to my base pictures as possible, but I'd love some feedback!
Also, if anyone is willing to make some hair I would love the style from the second pic of her with brown hair :D

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff37.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff38.png

[levini]

She looks good so far, but can you please remove all the Make-up, Change the hair to one that shows the face and Put her in a Basic outfit with nothing that would block her face. It is only so that we can see the sim and how she looks without all the content slapped on her along with offer better opinions to help get you close to making the sim look as close to the Celebrity as possible. As for opinions, Tiffany's chin is a bit wide-ish giving her a really round Face shape in some of the refrence pics, your sim on the other hand, needs a bit more width to the Chin. There is a chin width slider somewhere if you are ok with using CC. Also, Tiffany's hair color is a more lighter shade of brown in three of the pics, you have a really Dark brown going on, you may want to make it a bit more on the light side by adjusting the color Darkness slider.

BTW. I like Girls Generation. I like the dancing, it looks cool and complicated (Especially with a bunch of other Girls dancing right beside, which looks like a cause for catastrophe )

[chezzyg13592]

She looks good so far, but can you please remove all the Make-up, Change the hair to one that shows the face and Put her in a Basic outfit with nothing that would block her face. It is only so that we can see the sim and how she looks without all the content slapped on her along with offer better opinions to help get you close to making the sim look as close to the Celebrity as possible. As for opinions, Tiffany's chin is a bit wide-ish giving her a really round Face shape in some of the refrence pics, your sim on the other hand, needs a bit more width to the Chin. There is a chin width slider somewhere if you are ok with using CC. Also, Tiffany's hair color is a more lighter shade of brown in three of the pics, you have a really Dark brown going on, you may want to make it a bit more on the light side by adjusting the color Darkness slider.

BTW. I like Girls Generation. I like the dancing, it looks cool and complicated (Especially with a bunch of other Girls dancing right beside, which looks like a cause for catastrophe )

Thanks for the tips, I chose that color based on her more recent hair color where she was a very dark brown. The pictures are light brown because they were the only neutral poses I could find of her. I'm very happy to use CC, but was avoiding it initially because I didn't want to be the uploader that crams 90 packages into one Sim haha. But I see your point about the chin.

I'll update the Sim and get some new pics in an hour or two.

Yeah, when you get a bunch of perfectly choreographed girl dancing together, its hard to not find it cool :p

[chezzyg13592]

Here are the new pictures with the changes you suggested, I also took some in game to show you what she will actually look like when you play.

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff4.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff5.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff6.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff7.png

[Telishathompson]

Let's see:

- The eyes could be smaller by a smidge
- Move the eyes up a bit too. She kinda has a long face
- Turn the nose up by some. I would also suggest having AWT's nostril sliders as it looks like you need to decrease the width of the nose septum
- Also increase the nose definition so it looks a bit more defined and less pudgy
- The chin could be smaller or use a chin width slider to make it less wide
- The jawline needs to be more wider. She has a oval-ish face. Your sim is lacking that and is looking more heart-shaped
- Also, a lighter skintone would work better. Since she's asian, I would try out one of Ephemera's skins or any other asian-based skintones.

That's all the improvements I see you need to do. Also, do you have custom sliders in your game? They can help a ton when creating a celebrity.

[chezzyg13592]

Let's see:

- The eyes could be smaller by a smidge
- Move the eyes up a bit too. She kinda has a long face
- Turn the nose up by some. I would also suggest having AWT's nostril sliders as it looks like you need to decrease the width of the nose septum
- Also increase the nose definition so it looks a bit more defined and less pudgy
- The chin could be smaller or use a chin width slider to make it less wide
- The jawline needs to be more wider. She has a oval-ish face. Your sim is lacking that and is looking more heart-shaped
- Also, a lighter skintone would work better. Since she's asian, I would try out one of Ephemera's skins or any other asian-based skintones.

That's all the improvements I see you need to do. Also, do you have custom sliders in your game? They can help a ton when creating a celebrity.

Ok I took your advice and made the changes you had suggested. I have edited her again since taking these shots, but all i did was raise the face to make the features line up appropriately.

Let me know what you think :)

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff8.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff9.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff10.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff11.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff12.png

[levini]

Im noticing that the bottom lip needs to be a bit wider , if you note some of the refrence shots, she has a wide bottom lip and a good sized pout.

[SimmyRN]

If you could bring your reference picture(s) down with each revision, it would help a lot. It's much easier to compare that way.

[Telishathompson]

She's looking allot better with the new changes. The first thing I see you need to change is making the jawline more wide. More oval, less heart-shaped.

[chezzyg13592]

She's looking allot better with the new changes. The first thing I see you need to change is making the jawline more wide. More oval, less heart-shaped.

I tried to make the jawline wider, but all it was make her face too square. If you have any suggestions to avoid this I am all ears :)

I made a rough comparison pic
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Comparison.jpg
I will raise the eyes a smidge, same with the eyebrows, rotate the nose tip up a little, and make the lips fuller.

Here are some more screens:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff13.png

Thanks for the advice so far guys!

[Telishathompson]

Do you have AWT's Jawline sliders? Those help a tone with getting the jawline down.

[SimmyRN]

Based on the split face comparison, maybe make the nose tip bigger and the nostrils wider plus the other changes you mentioned. The jaw definitely needs to be lower and wider. Good work!

[chezzyg13592]

Ok here are my revisions for the day:

Got the jawline sliders after Telishathompson's advice, and they seem to have worked really well for her jaw shape.
Updated the eye height and eyebrow height.

Here is the new comparison pic:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Comparison-1.jpg

I know the nose still looks off, but I found out that she is looking up slightly in this pic which makes the tip higher than it would look in CAS. I have compared it to other photos of her head not angled up, but did not use them here as she either has her mouth open, or is looking sideways slightly. Also, that is the reason why her mouth looks lower than the reference as well.

[Gincgo]

You should post the pictures of your sim and the comparison pictures in two parts. You can also post a side-by-side one but you should also add some "normal" pics. It is quite hard for me to follow your steps. It would be great if you would do next time!:) I think some ingame-shots would be also really nice!

Well, you could make her eyes a bit bigger, they look smaller as on the real picture. You should also pay attention to the shape of the jaw. Your sim´s face looks quite round and Tiffany has a more angular shape. I really like your lips! Good job so far! :)

[chezzyg13592]

You should post the pictures of your sim and the comparison pictures in two parts. You can also post a side-by-side one but you should also add some "normal" pics. It is quite hard for me to follow your steps. It would be great if you would do next time!:) I think some ingame-shots would be also really nice!

Well, you could make her eyes a bit bigger, they look smaller as on the real picture. You should also pay attention to the shape of the jaw. Your sim´s face looks quite round and Tiffany has a more angular shape. I really like your lips! Good job so far! :)

Here are some more shots with comparisons

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff15.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff14.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff16.png

[Telishathompson]

Something about the eyes are off. They maybe either too big, need to be lower by soon, or the shape is off. Also, Tiffany's iris are smaller than what your sims version. I recommend AWT's eye sliders to fix that.

You're doing great. I can see the resemblance.

[SimmyRN]

I think that the eyes are tilted up too much at the outer corners. Chin is a bit long and pronounced. Do you have a profile comparison? Good job!

[chezzyg13592]

Ok I changed the default eyes, updated the eyebrows, made the eyes a tad smaller, and narrowed the chin slightly.

I also tried a more Tiffany-like hairstyle to see what it looks like.

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff17.png

This is the best profile pic I could find anywhere haha
http://cdn2.mixrmedia.com/wp-uploads/ningin/blog/2011/10/tiffany-snsd.png
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff18.png

[Telishathompson]

Ok, now the iris is too small. The chin is off. Make is a bit smaller and then mess around with the slider to get the dip in between the bottom lip and chin.

The eyes are still off. Turn up the inner corner. Move the lower eyelid apex to left by a little. Move the eyelid slider to left a bit.

Rotate the eyebrows down too.

[chezzyg13592]

Ok hopefully the changes helped, let me know :)

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff19.png


http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff20.png
http://cdn2.mixrmedia.com/wp-uploads/ningin/blog/2011/10/tiffany-snsd.png

[ameenah.n.y]

- Turn down the eyelash slider. For right now, they're simply hiding the shape of her upper lid, especially since you're modelling smaller eyes. I would turn down the eyelash slider as low as it will go before the eyelashes appear to "cut" through the face skin - when you get distortion. Asian women rarely have eyelashes that look like that, even with make-up. I think if you slightly increase the eyelash length AFTER you're happy with her eye-shape, and use a lashed eyeliner to give the appearance of lashes, you'll have a better result.

Right now, her face looks very tensed and surprised.
- Decrease Eyebrow Curve
- Those brows are simply too long for this sim and not really the right shape; I would use different ones. Even the base game ones you were using were a bit more suitable.
- Her lips look almost pinched. Increase Lower Lip Width.
- She has small but full lips. Decrease mouth width
- Slightly increase Mouth Curve (curve the lips a bit more down)
- Also, bring out her Mouth Depth a little. They look like they're pushed too far into her face right now.
- You can probably push her Eye Depth out a bit more

Her chin is still misshapen, but it definitely looks better. I would further decrease chin scale, and then play around with height and width to get a closer look.

Her cheeks look too full.

[chezzyg13592]

- Turn down the eyelash slider. For right now, they're simply hiding the shape of her upper lid, especially since you're modelling smaller eyes. I would turn down the eyelash slider as low as it will go before the eyelashes appear to "cut" through the face skin - when you get distortion. Asian women rarely have eyelashes that look like that, even with make-up. I think if you slightly increase the eyelash length AFTER you're happy with her eye-shape, and use a lashed eyeliner to give the appearance of lashes, you'll have a better result.

Right now, her face looks very tensed and surprised.
- Decrease Eyebrow Curve
- Those brows are simply too long for this sim and not really the right shape; I would use different ones. Even the base game ones you were using were a bit more suitable.
- Her lips look almost pinched. Increase Lower Lip Width.
- She has small but full lips. Decrease mouth width
- Slightly increase Mouth Curve (curve the lips a bit more down)
- Also, bring out her Mouth Depth a little. They look like they're pushed too far into her face right now.
- You can probably push her Eye Depth out a bit more

Her chin is still misshapen, but it definitely looks better. I would further decrease chin scale, and then play around with height and width to get a closer look.

Her cheeks look too full.

Thanks for the tips :)
- I went back to the base game brows, but they're still too thick for my taste, her eyebrows are a little thinner. But until I can find a suitable replacement, I agree that they are the best.
- Lower lip width is maxed already, its the skin which the texture seems to cut off at the edge. I have put a pic of her with lipstick to show the actual width.
- I narrowed the mouth as well
- I curved the mouth down more as well (maxed out)
- Decreased mouth depth
- Decreased eye depth
- Decreased chin scale, increased width, and decreased height.

Third pic has nude lipstick
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff21.png

Rotated for better comparison
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff22.png

[ameenah.n.y]

I think she's looking a lot better.

BTW, which skin are you currently using?

If you haven't already, I would try these, to see if they look any better:

M. Calero's Mandarin: http://littlecatsims.tumblr.com/post/12424152156/hopefully-this-is-okay-but-since-this-person-has
LFB's Asian Skins: http://www.ladyfrontbum.com/?category_name=genetics

You'll get better in-game screens if you set up some nice lighting. It looks like you're taking the screenshots indoors, which is good, but there does not seem to be any direct light source on the sim. First of all, make sure you are in a room with no windows. A large, square room with plain walls and floors is ideal. You can keep the flat gray you are using, a white, or any neutral color.

I personally think the easiest way to shoot a well-lit face shot is with floor lamps. Place one floor lamp directly in front of your sim's face a few floor tiles away (maybe three or four). Two other floor lamps angled inwards place to the side of this lamp will give you nice light on the face. Place a ceiling light a few tiles ahead of the sim to shine some extra light on the face and top of the head. Place ceiling lights to light the area behind the sim. The buy debug lights work well for this, and you can also use any of the other ceiling lights from the base game. There are a lot of tutorials about different ways to light a screenshot and they are all helpful.

This tutorial is really helpful for taking screenshots:
http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?p=3435974#post3435974

[chezzyg13592]

I think she's looking a lot better.

BTW, which skin are you currently using?

If you haven't already, I would try these, to see if they look any better:

M. Calero's Mandarin: http://littlecatsims.tumblr.com/post/12424152156/hopefully-this-is-okay-but-since-this-person-has
LFB's Asian Skins: http://www.ladyfrontbum.com/?category_name=genetics

You'll get better in-game screens if you set up some nice lighting. It looks like you're taking the screenshots indoors, which is good, but there does not seem to be any direct light source on the sim. First of all, make sure you are in a room with no windows. A large, square room with plain walls and floors is ideal. You can keep the flat gray you are using, a white, or any neutral color.

I personally think the easiest way to shoot a well-lit face shot is with floor lamps. Place one floor lamp directly in front of your sim's face a few floor tiles away (maybe three or four). Two other floor lamps angled inwards place to the side of this lamp will give you nice light on the face. Place a ceiling light a few tiles ahead of the sim to shine some extra light on the face and top of the head. Place ceiling lights to light the area behind the sim. The buy debug lights work well for this, and you can also use any of the other ceiling lights from the base game. There are a lot of tutorials about different ways to light a screenshot and they are all helpful.

This tutorial is really helpful for taking screenshots:
http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?p=3435974#post3435974

The skin that I'm using right now is: http://mysims3blog.blogspot.com.au/2011/10/ephemera-skin-v-22-default-and-non.html

[chezzyg13592]

Ok, so I fixed my lighting for the in game photos, but now I've hit a mental block. Im not entirely sure she needs anything else, but at the same time, she might be missing something. Hopefully the new photos will help :)
So far your help has been invaluable so thanks to everyone who has posted, hopefully you notice more things that I overlooked

In CAS:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff23.png


In-Game with LOTS of lights and white walls haha:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff24.png

[Wan-Wan]

You've improved from the start, but I don't think I would be able to recognize her as Tiffany. I think you should use a different reference picture, since the one above isn't very clear and is showing her from a queer angle, I could barely recognize her in that picture. You should be using something like the picture attached.
I also think you should use eyebags, Tiffany is known for her eyebags. Maybe these: http://mysims3blog.blogspot.com/2010/10/eyebag-v3-by-tifa.html

Make sure to decrease the opacity of the eyebags since her eyebags aren't very heavy.

I also request you to make her skin lighter with a yellow undertone rather than pink, and maybe add some pink blush when your done making the sim.

EDIT: Sorry if the picture is too small, here's a link:
http://www.wonderfulgeneration.net/2011/02/gorgeous-tiffany-for-dior.html

:D

[chezzyg13592]

Ok, I took a break for a day and came back to look again. I made a couple of changes, and have gotten new pics.

Side by side (I made a quick change from this pic to the next, I made the gap between her nose and mouth slightly larger):
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff25.png

Composites (I tried to use newer images of her as she changed her hairstyle and color):
Sorry if this one looks kind of weird
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff26.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff28.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff27.png

I know that I need to make her mouth a little lower.

[chezzyg13592]

Sorry for the double post, but I also wanted to attach her sim plus the custom sliders and content, so that if anyone knew exactly where to change her they would be able to. This would be greatly appreciated if you have any experience making sims as I'm not always sure that I'm making the right change :)

Tiffany Hwang (Sim) Download (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1551227/TIFFANY%20HWANG.ZIP)

[SimmyRN]

The biggest changes that I see are that the eyes need to be larger/wider side to side and come down on the face. Also, I think the nose tip/bulb needs to be wider and, maybe, a little bigger. Jaw also needs to come down and be wider. Tip lip a little thicker top to bottom - shape looks good - and bottom lip thinner top to bottom. Try bringing the nasal bridge down and/or indenting it more. Good start!

[chezzyg13592]

Ok here are some updated shots :)
I finally found a hair that matches one of hers!!
Also, opinions on the eyebrows, I need ones that match hers, but can only find really thin, or way too thick ones...

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff31.png
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff30.png http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff29.png

[ameenah.n.y]

She's come a long way since the first post. :)

It might be a combination of the eyebrows chosen and the position of the sliders used on the brows, but right now the sim looks frightened/surprised. They are too down-turned and don't really match the look. I would rotate the brows in the other direction and bring down the brow curve. I think you need to try a different pair of eyebrows - sometimes finding the right pair can be the hardest part. I confess to having probably too many CC brows in my game - and sometimes I go through every single one I have installed trying to find the right pair for a certain sim. Subaxi/Watermelon (now part of S-Club) made a lot of great eyebrows that have been very versatile in my game. While the links were taken down from her blog, most of them are still on XMSims. I would check out that website and look through their make-up section if you don't have the brows already in your game. On the last page, these ones are also great: http://www.xmsims.com/sims3/ehtm/SVmakeup/SVmakeup009.html

[jessabella1999]

it looks awsome :D

[chezzyg13592]

Ok here is the latest update

Some little changes to her facial structure and new eyebrows

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff34.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff32.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff33.png

Le me know what you think :)

[daphnegirl123]

I'd say bring her whole face down some, as half her eyes are hidden by the bangs! Looking good though, just peeked into this thread. This is just my opinion, but I don't think you need to include the CAS pictures since the sims changes in-game. Especially the eyes, because there's a shine ingame but not in CAS.

Her eye corners could go up a little, and maybe rotating her eyes some. I think the nostrils needs to be bigger/wider and more defined.

[chezzyg13592]

New changes, I have also edited the first post so that people dont have to scroll to the end of the second page etc.

I have taken daphnegirl123's advice and only used in-game pics, no more CAS

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff35.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff36.png

[Jasumi]

Is it just me -- or is she starting to look like Amber (f(x))?

[MzzUnvrz]

I think some eye maekup and bette contacts would do her a world of justice. Right now, her eyes are looking kind of lifeless. Also, I'm not sure about those eyebags- are they part of the skin?

[levini]

Something about her lips are not right, they need to be a bit more , I dunno, Plump or thicker

[SimmyRN]

I think the eyes need to be a very little closer together. Also, you might want to raise the jaw to increase the angle from the jaw to chin. The sim's cheeks / areas beside the mouth are looking a little plump now - but that may be the jaw giving that effect. You might want to try adjusting the jowls / cheeks. Can you turn the nose tip up just a bit? The shape looks pretty close but it looks a bit flat. I agree that both lips need to be thicker top to bottom. The lip shape is spot on. Good work!

[chezzyg13592]

Ok here are the new pics, I made the changes suggested above, added new contacts, reduced the opacity on the eyebags etc.

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff37.png

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t473/chezzyg/Tiff38.png

[hyunseo]

Someone Teach Me How To Use This Skin Please
I Need To Use Tiffany Skin

[Aree]

I think this looks great! The only thing I would like to see is what she looks like with even less heavy eyebags. They stand out a lot on your sim, while Tiffany doesn't seem to have them. Otherwise, I think she looks just about perfect! :)

[chezzyg13592]

I think this looks great! The only thing I would like to see is what she looks like with even less heavy eyebags. They stand out a lot on your sim, while Tiffany doesn't seem to have them. Otherwise, I think she looks just about perfect! :)

Haha, thanks for the feedback! Due to uni/work/other commitments, I haven't touched this project since April, but I agree with you about the eyebags. Someone suggested them earlier, but I was never really happy with them, because they always look far too intense during play regardless of the opacity.

After my midnight Christmas shifts at work are over this week, I will probably start work again. I would like her to be finished!