The reference for that server fire was (correct me if I'm wrong) a piece of trivia that occurred during the installation process of TS2. Does anyone else remember that? You could play that built-in mini-game while TS2 was being installed on your computer and that little factoid about the fire was featured.

Woah wait a minute now. Since when are the Dragon Age and Mass Effect series failures or even as you put it "less successful?" They are financially successful enough that both series are continuing. Hell, according to EA Dragon Age:Inquisition had the biggest and most successful launch in Bioware's history. It also won a handful of game of the year awards. Mass Effect was successful enough that they're well into development of Mass Effect 4. Just because you personally don't like them doesn't mean that they weren't successful or that a hell of a lot of other people didn't enjoy them. This is clear from the fact that more are coming, since EA is a corporation concerned with the bottom line and not a charity to create games for angry nerds. They aren't even close to closing up shop, and why should they?

Also, LOL at the idea that those games didn't listen to what the majority of their fans wanted. That's how Tali and Garrus became romances in Mass Effect 2. That's why Alistair, Varric, Cullen and Morrigan all ended up in DA:I. That's also why DA:I has such huge ass areas, because players didn't like how small the areas in the previous games were.



The whole idea that consumers only buy these games because they're hoodwinked by their evil corporate overlords is deeply condescending. It's also not true, because if it were SWTOR wouldn't have become the disaster that led to the free to play model and the last Sim City game wouldn't have been yanked from the shelves.

Which game in the series a particular player finds "best" is a subjective opinion based on personal taste and preferences, nothing more. You think both Dragon Age and Mass Effect went downhill after their first installments. I personally think Mass Effect 2 is the best game Bioware has ever made and enjoyed the hell out of DA:I. You hate those games. Some of us thought they were fantastic. Same song, different verse with Sims 4.

Anyway, in the end, as fun as it is to debate, our personal opinions don't really matter. All that matters is if a series is financially successful enough that they keep creating content for it and the only way to find out if that's the case for the Sims 4 is to wait and see what happens over the next few years.

I certainly do. Many of the features (including fire-breathing) are not present in the game, and I think they were presented as being present, so that's false advertising to me. I could maybe excuse the rest as "thematically true", but not the fire-breathing.

TS2 is still my favorite Sims, though.

As far as that first trailer, I think it can be excused. It was more of a concept trailer, if anything. At lease we got ceiling fans.

Condescending maybe, but it is completely true. Marketing isn't about being honest about your product it is about selling it. That's a direct quote from my husband's MBA professor. The majority of companies use false advertising to get people to buy their shit. I mean we see that with food we eat. Things marketed as healthy even though they aren't in the slightest and it is completely legal. You can believe that corporations are honest if you want, but I'm not naive enough for that. EA knows how to sell because they've been doing it for years.

Here we go with the poor logic again I can't resist. "They are financially successful enough that both series are continuing." This doesn't mean that this is their best work. People will buy a game just because they already started a series. Case in point how many people hate watch tv shows? A lot. All that it means that they made enough money to continue. Otherwise simcity 5 would be deemed as a success because it made money, but I doubt anyone would make that argument (aside from HOW). You have to compare their new work to their old work. Are the numbers telling people that it is successful? Did it make more than previous games? What about the fan's reactions? How about those who are buying DLC? Is the game play better or worse than in previous games? How's the story? If you do that and you come to the conclusion that DAI is better than DA1 I would be horribly surprised. I have actually gotten more game play from the abomination that is DA2 than DAI. Y'all make this harder than it needs to be. If you truly believe that EA is doing the best work then go on with your bad self. I simply have higher expectations from them. That's probably the biggest issue with the gaming community we keep lower our expectations to meet these companies instead of asking for quality games. But that's another rant for another day.

What? I never made that argument so stop saying that I did. I never said that Simcity 5 was successful, I never even mentioned Simcity. You did. (Claiming that I would say it was a success) Then I said that it was a failure and now you say that I would still make that argument. Nope, I wouldn't.

I think the issue here is that you simply think your opinion is fact. Whether your expectations are higher or whatever, your opinion isn't worth more than any other random gamer's opinion. You simply believe that your opinion is better than ours and as such you have higher expectations and better tastes in games...when you simply just have a differing opinion.

Who is the "us" in this context?

Just us poor people that like Sims 4, who will buy any crap that EA throws at us apparently.

Ok but remember "people that like Sims 4" are not a homogeneous bunch, nor one team in a football match. I somewhat take issue with your use of the collective pronoun there inasmuch as it can subconciously serve to keep animosity alive.

You are taking issue with the wrong person then, I'm not the one saying that consumers will buy trash as long as it's marketed well. That people that bought the game have been tricked with clever marketing and do not know any better.

Nor did I use it in that way, I used it in the context of the argument that audioromance was making and jokingly just as well. Since people like me have been tricked into buying and liking Sims 4 because i just can't tell a good game from a bad game. I'll need someone else's opinion next time I buy a game on if whether it's good or not and if I've been tricked again. Either ways, I wouldn't worry about it. It's not like I'm in a social group based around liking the game or anything. I've stated over and over again that my opinions are my own.

And just what is wrong with people who are in social groups based around not liking the game? See I knew it, you're trying to pick a fight with us! May the best team win!

My question for H.O.W. is a little different. Why is it that you take offense to the idea that a significant portion of those who bought the game may have done so thanks to marketing? You seem to assume that this idea means that those people are stupid or lack the mental capacity for individual thought when that's just not true. Marketing as it is now is so sophisticated that even the most savvy shopper can be lured in because it plays on the weaknesses of human nature. Sometimes they are as subtle as having the bakery section of a supermarket blow their oven vents towards the front of the store so that your nose subconsciously makes you hungry, or as in your face as the gauntlet aisles at checkout where they play on human impulses. These are only examples of everyday, physical marketing. Ads are just as sophisticated.

So why are you so personally offended, or did I miss a comment that specifically said people who fall for ads are stupid? I could have, there was a lot of text.

See, now you used 'us' !

But all I mean is i'm not in a group here, I just post on the forums and with my own opinion... The boards should be used for discussing the game and sharing opinions on the game. Comments suggesting that those of us that bought it and enjoy it have been fooled are not helping and as said earlier are pretty condescending.



See, audioromance didn't only suggest that people buy things because they are marketed well. They also was saying that no matter what you think, the quality of that game is not good because they just expect more from games.



The issue is trying to prove your opinion on the game is simply just the correct one.

No I didn't. I never used you or any of the rest of your team who don't belong to a social groups.

This can go back and forth for like 6 more pages, but the bottom line is. Some people are content with the game and the possibility that it will improve and add the features they like or new features in the future. Others are unhappy with the game because they were expecting more which, in my opinion, isn't terrible. I'd say the numbers speak for themselves, but the numbers can lie.

I just want toddlers. I think we're going to get them ... eventually, but they won't be anywhere close to previous games. As much as I want to think anything is possible.. babies confined to their cribs make me feel like that isn't so and other aspects in the game seem very limiting.

It is because people like to think they are above such tactics when in reality they play into them more than anyone else. I know how dangerous marketing can be because I work in the medical field. Marketing drugs is a huge booming industry which puts consumers at high risk and even in physical danger. Yet people still think "oh you are just being stupid" until it is someone they know who is hurt by it.

Also we are now comparing food and medicine...things based on facts and sciences...to video games...things based on opinions.

If you need more weirdness in your life, you should ask your doctor about The Sims 4.

The Sims 4 is a computer game that allows you to live vicariously through tiny AI people, letting you customize their houses and styles to your heart's desire.

Disclaimer : The Sims 4 is an EA game and with that there are some risks involved.The SIms 4 side effects include : frustration, disappointment, excessive optimism, malaise, the inexplicable need to defend your choice to play the Sims 4, diarrhea, and in some cases happiness and contentment.

Talk to your doctor to find out if The Sims 4 is right for you.

You may as well give up H.O.W. This is just turning into another self righteous bashing the Sims 4 thread. You are not going to be able to bring about any change here. Feeding on negativity is one of the least desirable traits of human nature, but it is a fact. Look at talk radio, television news, and the tabloids, nothing gets a discussion going as much as finding fault with something or someone and bringing them down. So maybe the "bashers" will be successful. Maybe this will be the end of the series. EA posted great returns this year on many of their games, they are having a good run with or without the Sims. They might decide that the Sims is no longer worth their time and trouble, given the split in the two types of games they created by bring out the Sims 3. At this point it may be impossible to please the so called fans, and they will call it a day.

As far as some other competitor jumping in... well that has not happened in15 years, so I wouldn't hold my breath. The Sims is an extremely difficult and complex and I imagine tedious game to design. It takes a lot of time and effort to produce, (not to mention money) especially if you are starting from scratch. In this day and age of Freemium where companies can literally make billions off of "gamers" (I'll be polite) willing to shell out hundreds sometimes thousands of dollars to keep playing there are easier ways to make money. Don't try and tell me about Skylines or whatever it is called. Those type of city builders games are much easier and simpler to make. They are all over the place (Steam has dozens) including the Freemium market. So all of you wishing for EA"s comeuppance over Sims 4 which you are sure they deserve... Remember be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

You're right, but I'm going to add to your point. They're imagery (I think that's what it's called); relating one thing to another unrelated thing. I use it in my writings all the, time and in college, in some classes, I was required to use them in essays. It's more engaging as well. It's like bringing two different magnets together, one negative and one positive, to create one strong unit. See what I did there? Eh, could have been better. Imagery is used to strengthen an argument. So, relating TS4 to a non-related item is used often in discussions and enhances a person's point. This game has been related to cars as well.

Completely agree. For something completely unrelated, but related to your comment: the edge effect (not to be confused with the edge effects different term). Mostly used in art, but it is about bringing two things together and showing the similarities and differences within them. You can do it with nearly anything if you want. Science and art are similar to each other in many ways and yet people often think of them as two worlds apart. Either way I only made the comment because I agree that people seem to underestimate the power of marketing. If it didn't work we wouldn't use it. We are all victim to it from time to time.

Melodramatic much? I haven't seen much bashing other than people quite calmly saying that they expected more. If that's bashing then people should start referring to me as your highness because I'm the Queen of England.

Discussion and exchanging your opinions isn't bashing. The MAIN problem with this thread is an implied winner. No one is trying to convert you or anyone else. No one is trying to make you hate the game. We're saying our opinions.

Well...that's a pretty snarky comment. Saying that I'm lost and that you can't believe you have to explain this.

You brought it up so yes, you are comparing marketing medicine to marketing video games.

Your entire posts the past page has been about how EA can sell crap and that's what they are doing. Doesn't matter if people like the games.



A post from the last page, whether a game like Sims 4 is trash is your opinion. So the idea that they are marketing a bad product is again...an opinion.



Pretty snarky there again.

But again this you pushing the game as bad as a fact.

THIS is my entire point about the marketing subject. You say that EA could sell a crappy game, I'm telling you that a game being crappy is your opinion in the first place

You bring up medicine as an example of how marketing can be dangerous while the discussion was about how marketing can sell even 'bad' games. What else am I supposed to think here? My comment wasn't at all snarky.



Yeah, that's what I meant earlier about how EA is doing just fine and their value is expected to go up with the release of that Star Wars game later this year.

I also agree with that. I don't see one popping up, I hope another game like the sims pops up. I doubt it though. You are right though, the game is a lot more complex than people give credit for. The idea that the Sims team is supposed to create A.I smart enough to resemble humans...well good luck with that. It's only expected then that sims will often play musical chairs or leave their baby outside in the snow

Hiii, Mendota! I haven't seen your name in a while! How's it been?

I would actually hate it if the sims franchise were to end. People, like me have been playing the sims for over a decade, and to see our franchise come its demise would be depressing Competition can come, but I see your point about how their hasn't been a competitor before and such. But as time grows on, a lot of people are becoming more and more interested in game development, and it's becoming more and more serious than before. So, competition could come

Sims is a complex and difficult game to design but not impossible. Cities Skylines is also a difficult game to design. Great games aren't easy. Also, people are expressing their concerns about this game and the future of this franchise. I know some people come of as angry and frustrated, but deep down, they are truly nice and passionate people, so please, let's not call anyone "bashers."

Btw, I'm so happy you're here!

Just like highlander there can be only one! But hey at least you get to be Queen right?