The tree house or tag would be great! But the kids aren't really lacking, in my opinion. They play together with the dollhouse and on the playground equipment, they have different types of relationships with each other, have goals specific to childhood, and have some great kid objects like the violin, the art table, and the concoction station. There are more kinds of interactions available to them through the pie than I remember with Sim children in the past.

I agree about elders. We still need a decent middle age because "young adult" and "adult" don't cut it. And I wish the teens had more going for them in this game. They are too much like little adults with little to distinguish them. We could even use with ages between toddler and 8 years old and between 8 years old and 14. Those are huge jumps.

Personally, I think that Elders have never looked better. I really dig the way that you can make them look age appropriate without having them look completely god awful. But I definitely agree that they need something to flesh them out that makes them play differently than the other two adult life stages. Like maybe different aspirations you can have that's unique to that stage, and different interactions with things too. I'm hoping that something like that comes with the inevitable Generations type expansion. If I remember correctly, there really wasn't much that was unique to them in the Sims 3 until that expansion hit.

That's mostly because they just used the same teen-to-adult mesh with a new texture on top? The elders in the Sims 4 usually look no more than 50-60 max.



It's not difficult to look good when you never really age. Then again, there are some people like Keanu Reeves who really don't either.

Actually I think it's because the sims in general just look a ton better. It's a lot easier to get unique looking sims that have actual definition to their faces (that age especially can bring), since they're not starting with the round pudding faces of Sims 3 or the weird, huge mouthed style of Sims 2 that was way too far the uncanny valley for me to ever really like. The wrinkles look a lot more natural on them too, at least to me anyway.

It's not and I don't appreciate it going off topic while I've been gone a few days. :/ Anyway, so what if EA messes up or not. It's not the first time. It was about the Kotaku article and open discussion of what people thought about it. It not a toddler only topic or hate EA or Simmer topic. So please keep on topic about the game and not about your utter despise of fellow gamers.

The game just wasn't received as well as Maxis had hoped. I won't deny there are players that love the game. But not every Simmer does like it. The article discusses just one of the reasons why: family play. There are other reasons why as well. I'm not sure if the communication is there whether or not Maxis understands what makes Simmers love each of the games. You ask any Simmer each time, and you'll get a different response. No one Simmer is exactly the same or plays the game exactly the same. So if anything this thread is about, is why there is that lack of communication between all Simmers and the Maxis team?


Sadly the blame game was even done by EA: http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/...axis-idea-18315

I agree the Sims Olympus should have never been done and I hope online games are reserved for side Sims games only in the future.



Yes being a family player, I wish babies were free, toddlers get introduced again via patch and not tied to objects like babies, children get play interactions back, teens get more distinctive traits and actions and are a tad shorter with different facial structures than YA/Adults, and Elders look different from YA/Adults and treated less frail and given their retirement parties back and be able to share real memories again with their family.

I did see that rumor. I don't believe it. Even if it is done, I won't be buying. I didn't for the Sims 3 store and it won't be any different for the Sims 4. DLC from GPs and SPs I think is already asking enough. If Maxis wants to boost sales for their expansions, the base game still needs a lot of work to function better. Culling feature needs to be flushed down with the angry poo.

I have answered this question for myself and will be seeking no new answers to it. There was a MTS user on these boards when TS4 first came out. S/he constantly claimed that TS4 was a console game.
I agree, after prolonged consideration. I'm sorry to have forgotten the name, but that person was spot on.

Online consoles.

And we, all of us here, no matter the side or the lines in the sand, we're all PC players.

Future is somewhere else with someone else. Or it was supposed to be, if there weren't for this reaction and criticism - bad reception - on our part. Though, this is already optimism. Mostly I don't think that they listen, not any more.

But I'm trying to be optimistic about the 5. Or the competition. Or both, when I am most optimistic.
No, when I'm most optimistic, I dream of TS5 as a pure PC game, and an advanced simulation, following in the footsteps of its great predecessors, and being better.

ETA: I mean, they don't even poll older players. I thought it was an ageist thing. Or a really silly marketing strategy. But it really is more of a platform thing.

And it seems like a silly strategy anyway.

Yeah I agree it feels like one too. I'm mainly a PC gamer. I hope for the best for the Sims 5 as well, but I admit I'll be upset if the online attempt is taken again. It would stink if the Sims becomes a FPS game next as well.

Well, I'm not the only one to take it off-topic. So don't only scold me and nothing I said even suggested that I despise anyone here.

It's not a lack of communication, it's just that they can't listen to everyone and people expect things to be done right now quite frankly. IF not now, then show you are working on it now. They gave us plenty of things in response, family tree, pools, and other things in patches. If they are working on toddlers, it's not going to be something they can just whip up and toss into the game. Also if they are working on it, they won't show us until they are ready to show us. They've been pretty consistent with that method. From pre-release where people were begging for info about the game until now. They are not the only ones who do this either, it's just safer to hold off on bragging about features that are not complete.

So in short, they can't possibly listen to every single simmer because you are right, that no simmer is the same.

They started it!!!!

If they made TS5 into a FPS, they would risk being sued by Rockstar for copying GTA. Then again, if they stick with loading screens between lots, and no cars, they might be safe.

The sims look better and more varied by default, but for some reason EA made the trade off that they're far harder to customise now. It really annoys me all the details and sliders they culled.

And I tend to agree with those saying EA does - generally - an EXTREMELY poor job of communicating with consumers. They have the odd staff member who can and will pick up the slack, but it doesn't make up for their hyper-aggressive code of silence. They tell us strictly what they think we need to hear. They ensure the relationship is, largely, one-way. When the company does reach out to the community it is always shrouded in self-interest and a mild contempt for all critics. I know of no other company that is quite this bad at PR and community management, and I realise what a huge call that is.

I spent tons of money in the Sims 3 store. I know, I shouldn't have encouraged it, but I love the game. It's so pretty and it usually runs well now that I'm modded and patched with finality. If I can't be arsed to buy GTW, I can't see how I'll buy anything from the Sims 4 store. The game will continue to be an occasional Sim-making spree for me, but nothing more.

I can totally see how culling the receptacle made everyone think positive about this game. People finally start to respect and love EAs vision.

I doubt very much that the plan was to make anyone do anything other than move on and leave the Sims 4 section for those who play the game, same as those who play the game participate in the other sections of this board. You don't typically find people who are not interested in Sims 2 hanging out in that section, etc..., yet Sims 2 players themselves will take moments to look at their game critically. I emphasized moments because it does not dominate their section nor is the negative humor, speculation, and anger sprinkled throughout almost every thread.

If I remember correctly, when it was closed, it was suggested that the receptacle could go somewhere else such as the off-topic area.

I think a good thing is that everyone has settled on the fact that regardless of your opinion of the Sims 4, it's a ok/meh-diocre/crap game at the moment and there's a lot EA has to do to make it better.



It's almost universally understood that the Sims 2 was the best of the series in terms of gameplay. Other than quibbles here and there, what's there to complain about?

People can complain about the lack of features that came later in the series, but the game is done and finished, and it's reasonable to expect that an older game will be lacking certain features due to development choices and technological limitations at the time.

This is the thread where people complain: http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?t=538429

Again, quibbles.

Wait so that thread is allowed to exist but we couldn't keep the Receptacle?

It's nowhere near as sardonic as the Receptacle. Then again, the Sims 2 was nowhere near as unfinished as the Sims 4.

Family trees still need to recognize relationships. There is still incest occurring in the game. Culling also needs to be addressed because people are experiencing ghosts getting culled from their family trees. So that is two features introduced that is being ruined by the culling features.


I don't care who started it, I'm ending it. So end of discussion regarding that. This thread is welcome to everyone, but please avoid fighting if possible.

Careers, well with how they were patched and changed actually upset people. People who liked goals liked the old system and people who don't like goals still don't like how long it takes to be promoted. So yes there were patches, but sadly those patches still reflect the core design issues. But yes I agree if toddlers are done, I want them done right. But eight months of waiting only to find out they are "exploring" it now feels like a waste of time especially with a big feature like that. I know if pets are introduced before toddlers, it will be a big slap in the face to many players.

It's true Maxis has no obligation to make any Simmer happy. But if they keep only wanting to appeal to a niche market only, their profits will remain lower than the predecessor games. I still have a feeling the Sims 4 was designed as the type of game Gurus enjoy rather than Simmers. I actually had a discussion about this with a Guru when discussing about goals in the game. They liked the goals. I said I did sometimes but like even when I play MMOs I like going off the path and finding my own way even if it means falling off a cliff. The adventure of not knowing where you are going in a game can be thrilling.


Yep exactly.

That's an interesting observation regarding how the Gurus felt about the goals. It also reinforces the speculation I have that beta testing remains of very limited utility to this studio. I would have thought proper testing, beyond merely looking for bugs, would be to test game play balance. And to do so, you would need some type of sampled cross section of players to see who like what or not, and why, so you can achieve better balance on release of the code. Clearly, this genre is difficult to test because there are a variety of play styles, unlike the linear progression of an FPS or tasking in an RPG. But you would somehow like to get that feedback BEFORE release, but it really does seem as though they rely on their own judgements of game play, rather than the audience.

I suppose if you really know a genre well you might get away with that and still produce an entertaining product. But I can't figure out what made these folks think they could do that, when they made so many poor design choices in TS3 that they were called out on. Just from that experience, you would have expected them to be extra cautious with 4 to make sure all the "categories" of players could find solid game play. Instead, they kind of just dumped on everyone with the "We like it. Why don't you?" approach. Which would indicate some serious flaws in their studio's management philosophy, which extend well beyond simply not enough time or money, but a lack of commitment to the end user, the player. The folks who have to pay money for this stuff. I'm glad they're having a good time playing it, though.

Well, do we dare hope that the extreme disappointment expressed by many fans will inform their future decisions? I enjoy S4, but it is lightweight and I would most likely enjoy another Sims game where the fans' expressed wishes were taken into consideration.

Honestly? No. What will get their attention are the sales figures, which currently are known only to them. A variety of indirect data does support this as the weakest selling Sims release for this franchise. And certainly, the interview that spawned this very thread seems to suggest they swallowed that bitter pill of fan disappointment already. So they're not utterly deaf and blind to the reception provided on this release. Regardless of those player sentiments, the only thing that can shake a studio in a large corporation like EA up is the financial performance. And based on the hard information that is available, this was not a grand slam launch for them.

Having said that, it does not mean it is impossible for EA to get their shit together and build something more on this version, although the inherent limitations will likely limit how far that build out can take it. And certainly, I would expect a very different approach in development to any next version, should they choose to continue, as despite all evidence to the contrary, I cannot see them repeating the same mistake twice.

So for now, they will keep working on this version and try to get what they can from it. However, for a "heavyweight" version of a life sim, it will probably have to occur in the next version. Which doesn't mean this version can't still be fun within the environment provided. However, it appears there are too many limitations in this game engine to flesh out the game with the kind of full, immersive experience one would hope for in a life sim in this version. That would have to come much later. If there is a next version, of course.

Then again, we have the first SP just released, which should have been a tempting release for a game in need of expansion of stuff to do, and they went with sparkly suits and dresses. Although they did include a buffet table (wasn't a buffet table in the base game of 3 though? I don't remember buying it) and the drink fountain (I do remember the chocolate fountain thingy for sale in the Store for 3, so I guess there's a basis for charging for that). I have no idea what to make of that decision for the first SP, but it probably wouldn't have been in my own top 5 if I were making that decision. But that's just me.

There is no incest in the game, it's just a U.I glitch pretty much. The culling is a problem, luckily there is a mod to fix that.

But that's the thing for me. We really don't know what they will do next month. I remember people freaking out about the pools quote and how they thought pools couldn't be done (I was here telling people that the article was pretty much misquoting the dev there.) and what like a month later we got pools. If they are working on toddlers we will not know it until they advertise it or it leaks. In the meantime they will pretend like they have nothing up their sleeve. People asked for a OFB all throughout TS3 and here comes GTW.

If you dislike the game then it will feel like they are not catering to you and if you like the game you will feel like they are listening just fine. It's a perception thing but the reality is that they can't listen to everyone at once and also plenty of people enjoy the game.

Sure, they don't go for it. The problem here is that many simmers - at least many that I know - use what the game shows them as hints to give their sims a unique character. What they do autonomously, what they think, what they are talking about, how they look and react adds up to something that goes beyond the set of traits that's applied to the sims in CAS and makes even two sims with the same traits different. If you watch your game that way and see that blood relatives are in a romantic conversation, this glitch, although not fleshed out, is still enough to make you want to bleach your brain afterwards.

I don't disagree, it's still just a glitch though and on the list of glitches/broken things throughout Sims history, this one would rank pretty low.

I've been trying to work with the Gurus getting the incest glitch fixed for awhile. They've admitted it being a glitch and thought it was fixed last year. I sent them my save files. It could be related to the UI. I keep thinking it is fixed and sadly someone in forums gets hit with it again. There was one incest issue that was fixed by a recent patch. So I hope it will be squished someday. Mods shouldn't be used to fix a game. I know EA left modders to fix the remaining bugs the Sims 3 had, but I would hate if the same trend would occur for the Sims 4 as well. Oh genetics was also another issue I was occuring. It doesn't quite work right for some reason. I have this Smurf family in my game. Both parents have blue skin and eyes. But notice how not all the kids look like their parents.




I admit I changed Baby Smurf's skin to blue, but all five girls were born with different colored skin.

But yes it is true, only time will tell what the future brings. I still remember when the Sims 1 and 2 had a little preview of the next expansion. It was nice and got everyone excited about the future. So far the expansions for the Sims 4 involve around the single life. You can't go hiking as a family. You can't talk while fishing. I heard no teen or child outfits for the party stuff pack. Calling GTW, an OFB copy I don't agree with fully. It's more of a OFB/Ambitions hybrid. There are no lemonade stands, toy making machines, no home businesses, or registers useful to check out customers with. There is just nothing new for children, teens, and elders to do with the extensions for the Sims 4 so far. If I were to get an expansion for the Sims 4 if toddlers would return, I probably would get GTW anyway. Killer deal breaker for me is not being able to have alien toddlers. I blame Sims 2 and 3 for making me fall in love with those.

Oh dear I moved my photos. Fixing now.