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Nysha's New Creators for July - posted on 1st Aug 2018 at 9:00 AM
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Page 7 of 43
Field Researcher
#151 Old 14th Apr 2011 at 8:43 AM
Thanks for all your comments, everyone. What I meant was I did want to use the life path rolls, but I didn't want to roll for aspirations. It nearly always produces something ridiculous for the poor Sim (Billy Example is very neat, shy and serious, and spent most if his childhood reading and rolling skill wants. Teen birthday comes around, roll the die, Pleasure aspiration... yeah, that fits. ) I still use a variety of aspirations because my Sims have such varied personalities - and also because if I just used one or two aspirations, I'd get bored fast. I just didn't want to roll.

Off to think about settings now - I'm getting there! Baby steps, VT.
Test Subject
#152 Old 20th Apr 2011 at 7:36 PM
Are any of you still doing the challenge? I am currently writing up my "intro" to the Kingdom but I was wondering if anyone else was doing the challenge.

Do you have a blog with your Simmie tales? PM me the link. I like reading!
Test Subject
#153 Old 21st Apr 2011 at 5:17 AM
Yup, I think there's at least 3 of us. I haven't played in a while, but I have plenty of content to post. Now if I would only sit down and post it.....
Instructor
Original Poster
#154 Old 21st Apr 2011 at 1:00 PM
I am working on an MS Access Database for tracking progress in the challenge. I have spent the past several months in set up, and now I'm holding off play until I finish the database and write the remaining intro chapters to post on the website. I will also make the database available once I figure out how .... it's looking like it will be very useful, though. :D
Test Subject
#155 Old 23rd Apr 2011 at 10:16 AM
I just wanted to say that this challenge looks amazing, and I can't wait to start!
Not sure when I'll start though, 'cause I really should be doing something else, hehe.
Something my professors would probably deem as being more important, but I beg to differ!
How can ruling a kingdom not be important?!

I do have two minor questions, although I have read most of the posts in this thread.
If you say there's a 14/20 chance of something happening, you do the 20-14 = 6, so anything above 6 means it's succesful, right?
But if I wanted to make it so that 1-14 is succesful, that's fine?

And then I'm not sure how having nested nobles in a sub-neighborhood works.. Could you expand on that?
Test Subject
#156 Old 25th Apr 2011 at 9:05 PM
Hi Fnus, it doesn't matter which set of numbers you use, as long as the odds are correct. Personally, I start from one. (Ex. Girl child aging from infant to toddler with 12/20 chance to survive, I roll 10, she survives. Ex Serf teen on her 11th pregnancy 7/20 to survive, I roll 10, and she dies.)

The sub hood concept is a bit confusing, but I suggest choosing a blank hood that is very large, and laid out in a grid pattern (Like Driftwood, or Pleasantview). In my game, each little division will eventually be presided over by a Nobleman. Each Nobleman will have mini jurisdiction over the indicated number of plot squares.

For example, A Baron will preside over 150 plot squares. Peasant and Serf lots are 9 to 16 plot squares each, so he can preside over a subhood consisting of 5 Peasant and 7 Serf lots for a total of 143 plot squares. The baron will collect any and all taxes from those families (40% of their income, in my game it will be either as cash or crops) as well as settle any disputes (for storytelling purposes, because I settle all disputes). Of the 40% that the Baron will collect, he can keep 15% as his own income, but must pay the rest to the King/Crown as taxes.

Setting it up this way will create a very larde devide between the very rich land owning nobility, and everyone else, as was the way at the time.

Good luck starting your challenge!!! I hope you're in it for the long haul. I've been playing on and off for a while, and I expect this challenge will take me Years (!) to complete.

And with that, I'm going to insert a Shameless plug for my own blog! 1605 has been posted. I'm not sure if were allowed to plug out progress blogs here. If not, I can post the info in the thread itself.
Instructor
Original Poster
#157 Old 26th Apr 2011 at 4:00 PM
Cococure, Yes, let's all please shamelessly plug our blogs here!! It makes it so much easier to tell when to go run and read updates (which I am now doing!!!) I have three weeks left of this semester and then I shall begin updating, too.

OK, just read the update--I really hope LeShawn comes home! I think baby Brandon looks like he misses his mommy Also, so sad about Bronwynn! I'm beginning to think that name might be a bad one!
Test Subject
#158 Old 27th Apr 2011 at 6:50 PM Last edited by Cococure : 28th Apr 2011 at 8:42 AM.
Do any of you have "Middle Bourgeois" Families yet? I'm thinking about opening a second business for my family, but I'm having a hard time deciding what to sell! Any time I've had a business the sim was almost always selling grown crops. The current home business is selling candles and other candle based lighting systems. I have almost no experience running an owned community lot. Anyone have any advice?



Also, 1606/7 has been posted!

http://warwickshirebycococure.blogs...and-spring.html
Field Researcher
#159 Old 3rd May 2011 at 8:32 AM
Still here everyone, and unfortunately still struggling to VTOS this challenge. I've come to the conclusion that I'll have to rewrite a good chunk of it and that it will take ages, but hey, I'm getting somewhere at least. *scrambles for a seed idea*

- VT
Instructor
Original Poster
#160 Old 4th May 2011 at 3:55 PM
Cococure,

Is anyone selling furniture yet? I had a very thriving community business selling furniture in my modern hood. I don't have any middle bourgeoisie yet--been too busy with end of semester matters irl to get down to real business (no pun intended) with my new challenge hood. Another that I had good luck with was toys and another was flowers. Now, I realize these are probably not the foundation businesses for a broader economy. I'm still trying to sort out the whole merchant class thing and the stable economy idea for my hood. This one has really got my head spinning. Ideally, I'd love for every item sold to be somehow produced by the economy that sells it--so items actually move and have market value. But, of course, so many goods come from thin air and have a value already assigned to them within the game system, so that part won't really work out for me, at least not totally. Still, I am committed to not having my sims sell their wares to thin air--farmers will have to find a buyer for their produce, and merchants will have to sell at what the market will bear. And I'm thinking that my poor serfs will not be able to cart around trenchers of smelly fish in their inventories for season after season. If they can't sell it to a merchant within one season, it will "spoil" and they will not get any money for it at all--perhaps they could just stock the fridge with it, or I'll cancel the funds they receive for selling to thin air, I don't know yet ... Ah, well, enough thinking aloud.

VT: I know you're germinating something interesting!
Field Researcher
#161 Old 10th May 2011 at 8:26 AM
So far the only thing I've got is that I want to reverse the gender roles. Patriarchal hoods/challenges drive me crazy fast - after all, I am known as the Amazon Queen of the TS2 community (to myself, if no one else). But that will involve quite a bit of rewriting (as I predicted) to say nothing of what altering the setting from medieval to as-yet-undetermined VTOS will do.

By the way, I am definitely going to try some of your ideas about buying and selling.

- VT
Instructor
Original Poster
#162 Old 10th May 2011 at 2:14 PM
VT, Actually I quite like the idea of a matriarchal hood. Of course, the whole thing is just as sexist, only in reverse--at least if you play according to the challenge system Which is not to say that matriarchal systems are de facto sexist, just that the system the challenge sets up is. But, then, that is ultimately the point of the challenge to see if you can overcome that hierarchical, patriarchal society--because, of course, I hate it too. And the more I play this challenge, the more I get a feel for how it really works, and it makes me all the more incensed with it.

Especially with regards to the economy. If I may, I will pontificate briefly (as if!): as a result of of setting up my MS Access database to keep track of the challenge, I came to a decision regarding taxation. Now, of course, it makes no sense that this would come from creating the database, but it really did. In order to set up the Household Income table, I wanted a table of income sources. Upon looking them over, I saw that many of these things were also assets--the garden plots, the pond, even a beehive. Of course assets should be taxed, I thought, but separately--and these taxes would go to the local subnh, not the crown. So, I began playing under this assumption, and wow! things suddenly got exponentially harder.

Case in Point: a lower bourgeoisie starts a small home business. Now, of course, in game it costs nothing to open a home business. He buys a blacksmith station (got it here at MTS, don't remember actual name, it is the robot station redone), and gets to work building little robots. He turns his sign over and starts selling. The robots fly off the shelves, and in the first two seasons appears to have a thriving business. On paper, though, the whole thing is a total mess. His balance sheet on the home business monitor shows his total earnings for the business as -$612, which wouldn't be so bad--at least the income taxes are $0, he can declare a total loss for the first two seasons. But, the business is a level 3 (booming, remember?), so it is valued at $15,000. If he has to pay taxes on the assets, that is already $4500 and he only has $20 in his account. He is certainly NOT rich enough to own a home business. So, I guess he has some choices: get a job to pay the taxes, marry and hope she has a good dowry (there are no townies in game, so that's not likely), borrow from the crown, default on taxes and go bankrupt--and potentially go to jail for tax evasion.
At any rate, it certainly puts into sharp relief why it is so hard to get out of poverty.

One thing I have decided: assets will only be taxed once every 4 seasons, to make it somewhat manageable.

And it makes me wonder: should I add this as an option to the challenge?

Which brings me to a larger question about funds and economy--who the money goes to. I think that titled landholders should receive monies from the serfs who live on their lands. Free men (peasants and up) would just pay income taxes to the crown. Each subneighborhood would have a local tax collector who took in revenue from income taxes that would be levied for the crown. The presence of a middle man makes bigger fraud possible, which makes the whole thing more interesting .... Taxes on assets, like property taxes, would remain local and enrich the subnh economy. These would be levied by a county clerk and then be used to build community lots for the public good. Tithes and Bills should be considered tax shelters to lower property (asset) taxes. This is where those titled landowners come into their due--they have a lot of property and should have to pay accordingly (!). No trickle down theory here: this is well before the enclosure acts took place and serfs could still expect some common lands to hunt on!

Ah, well, but I knew I would not be able to be brief. I'll stop here--if anyone's still reading, you're a saint! or as big a geek as me!!
Test Subject
#163 Old 13th May 2011 at 5:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3g7e
Case in Point: a lower bourgeoisie starts a small home business. Now, of course, in game it costs nothing to open a home business. He buys a blacksmith station (got it here at MTS, don't remember actual name, it is the robot station redone), and gets to work building little robots. He turns his sign over and starts selling. The robots fly off the shelves, and in the first two seasons appears to have a thriving business. On paper, though, the whole thing is a total mess. His balance sheet on the home business monitor shows his total earnings for the business as -$612, which wouldn't be so bad--at least the income taxes are $0, he can declare a total loss for the first two seasons. But, the business is a level 3 (booming, remember?), so it is valued at $15,000. If he has to pay taxes on the assets, that is already $4500 and he only has $20 in his account. He is certainly NOT rich enough to own a home business. So, I guess he has some choices: get a job to pay the taxes, marry and hope she has a good dowry (there are no townies in game, so that's not likely), borrow from the crown, default on taxes and go bankrupt--and potentially go to jail for tax evasion.
At any rate, it certainly puts into sharp relief why it is so hard to get out of poverty.



M3g, I've been thinking about the same concept! My family has their home business selling lighting. While the family is bringing in Cash on a daily basis, any bills they pay, the money that they spend to restock the business, and the taxes they pay on daily revenue is greater than their income. So even though the business is booming, it is actually $6k in the Hole!

How can this family be successful if the business is a sink hole?

Having little to no experience in running a business selling items that aren't grown or fished, I'm reluctant to open a community lot business for fear of bankrupting the family and failing my challenge. I'm thinking I need to step away from the challenge for a while so that I can learn the finer points of business ownership.

Also, I really like your idea of having a tax collector for the free men (Peasants). Taxes (bills/property taxes) paid by peasants to the collector could potentially be used to improve the local community (parks etc), as well as be used for loans if peasants want to to open a business but lack the cash on hand.

I was originally going to have the titled landowners collecting taxes from Peasants AND Serfs living in their subhood. This structure would have the cash going in a strictly linear fashion (bottom to top), but by adding the collector, with the option to have the cash flow back into the community (although briefly, and with interest) would add another level to the hierarchy, and give more options for crookery
Instructor
Original Poster
#164 Old 13th May 2011 at 2:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cococure
How can this family be successful if the business is a sink hole?


Agreed. And I don't know. It's one of the many simming mysteries. And since I've never really played businesses (outside of a very few home businesses), I don't know if I've ever had a truly lucrative business before. They've probably all been failures.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cococure
I'm thinking I need to step away from the challenge for a while so that I can learn the finer points of business ownership.


Same here. Perhaps I should open a thread on the main boards to see if others have more experience with simming businesses. There surely has to be people who have more knowledge on this.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cococure
I was originally going to have the titled landowners collecting taxes from Peasants AND Serfs living in their subhood ..., but by adding the collector, with the option to have the cash flow back into the community (although briefly, and with interest) would add another level to the hierarchy, and give more options for crookery


Exactly. That's what I really love about it.

On a similar note, I've been thinking about where the crown funds go ... most medieval Kings used their treasure chests for conquest and war. I've got a little idea tinkling in the back of my mind for how to open up new subhoods in future--perhaps the crown would have to raise a certain amount of money and get an army going. That would require loyal vassals in existing subhoods and a certain number of able bodied men. Or, one could missionize and try to convert the heathens in a new land. For this option, there is a religion mod (more like EP) created by Chris Hatch over at B.A.S. (an adult site, but this mod is family friendly) that would be really interesting for the second, missionary, option above.

But, for now, I need to stick to just getting Warwick sorted!
Field Researcher
#165 Old 13th May 2011 at 8:11 PM
M3g7e , I am curious -- why did you decide assets should be taxable and payed by the serfs?

I'm only wondering because in the middle ages, the land that serfs farmed and everything on it would actually belong to the lord already; therefore, the serf could be charged rent over and above the tax he'd have to pay on his crops, but taxing the lord for the actual assets would seem to fit better.

As for businesses, I am glad you are starting the other thread, because this is an area I struggle with also!

Cheers, Vllygrl
Instructor
Original Poster
#166 Old 13th May 2011 at 10:52 PM
Vllygrl, good point--I don't have a good reason for the decision, since I hadn't really sussed out the whole system. So, yes, I think you are right, but it would only apply to serfs, right? Free men, i.e. peasants and up would have ownership of the chattel on their lots and would be responsible for the assets taxes. If this is right, becoming a peasant is almost a penalty. Of course, that rent charged to the serfs might be quite high, too--perhaps it could be calculated as a percentage of the assets taxes? Just thinking aloud here, but that would make sense to me. What do you think?
Field Researcher
#167 Old 14th May 2011 at 1:11 AM
Hmmm . . . sounds almost like it might be better to stay a serf! However, it does tie in to something I read which I put it into my Medieval Charter Challenge -- that is that part of the reason for the rise in towns during the middle ages was that peasants fled the land and went to the towns -- once they had survived living in town for a year and a day, they became free men and thus began the rise of the yeoman class. So that could certainly explain why they left the land for the towns, eh?
Instructor
Original Poster
#168 Old 14th May 2011 at 6:00 PM
Yes, I think so. In terms of play, that might mean that peasant boys--especially younger sons would go to town to "seek their fortunes" and try to get some sort of low level labor position, or become apprenticed to a guild. It looks like for any lower class people, the way out to the class above is one through the future generations, and not through "hard work and perseverance," but then this is not the new world, is it? It looks like you'd be better off NOT to inherit the family farm, then.
Top Secret Researcher
#169 Old 15th May 2011 at 4:32 AM
I'm not playing any specific challenge, but a lot of my ideas are similar to these, so I thought you wouldn't mind me chipping in.

On the subject of taxes, I am making peasants (who are my lowest, and non-free, class) pay heriot when the head of the family dies. This is to renew their bond with the lord, and entitles them to continue living and working as they are used to doing. They have to pay half their cash, and give up their three best assets to their landlord. In medieval times, it was generally paid by giving the best beast to the lord. If heriot was not paid, the family would effectively be outcast, which wasn't really any kind of option. They couldn't leave the lord's estate without permission anyway, so would have to do whatever was required in the end.

I don't want to run an entire tax system - it bores me to worry so much about the numbers - so I am picking a few occasions when it is appropriate to pay a special tax, and making it fairly hefty. In medieval/Renaissance times they also had poll tax, hearth tax, window tax and numerous others. I have a hearth tax in my Random Occurrence Scenarios, so that one will strike the hood every now and then too.

To get around the disadvantage of inheriting the family farm (and thus remaining at your parents' status), if the heir marries above his station, his children are entitled to the benefits of the higher rank. Also, once he is truly head of the family - after Dad dies - he can upgrade the family house, or move to one that better reflects his improved status.
Field Researcher
#170 Old 16th May 2011 at 1:09 AM
Oh this is interesting information, aelflaed! Thank you for sharing -- I hadn't heard of the heriot tax before you mentioned it, although I have heard of the other ones. How did you go about your ROS? What else do you have in it besides the hearth tax???

Curious, Vllygrl
Top Secret Researcher
#171 Old 16th May 2011 at 1:55 AM
Losing your husband and your best cow in one go must have been hard on many peasants. Window and poll taxes were pretty unpopular, too! There are quite o lot of boarded-up and bricked-in windows on some old houses aorund England.

My ROS is designed to be a hood-wide thing rather than affecting indvidual sims or households. So if the hearth tax comes up, all eligible sims pay. If there is a blizzard, all households spend the appropriate time that winter snowed in. They just had an earthquake, in fact. For that, I get a randomised order of owned lots for the hood (there are only eight so far!), and the earthquake affects a certain number of those lots, in the order given by the roll.

I have several categories....Acts of God, War and Penance, Public Health and Community Events. I don't roll it myself, but use Hook's RandomStuff program which picks a scenario out of each section for me, and I use two of the scenarios given.

Apart from the obvious natural disasters and plagues, my sims suffer peasant uprisings, feuds, and crusades. They have to pay ransom for sims taken captive in war. They have to make charitable donations of food, and fast for Lent. A group of sims can be sent on pilgrimage, and sometimes there is a shipwreck providing treasure trove for the community.

I can post the text file if you would like - I've been considering uploading it but haven't taken pictures or done a blurb for it.
Test Subject
#172 Old 16th May 2011 at 4:08 AM
Please do! I've come across so many variations of ROS' and I'm picking and choosing the bits that I like to include in my game
Top Secret Researcher
#173 Old 16th May 2011 at 7:52 AM
Okay then....

File attached, but here is a sample of some of my scenarios, to give you the idea.

HERESY. d6 families are tainted by unorthodox beliefs. Each household must spend three days in penance (at church or in private prayer, 6 hours daily), and supply candles worth $200 for the altar. No bathing on penance days.

CHARITY. Paving their way to heaven with good deeds, d6 households give food to the needy. Prepare 10 group meals and gift them to poorer families, or to the Church.

PILGRIMAGE. d10 local women spend one season making a pilgrimage to a distant city. Return with relics, and max motives for two days. The women become friends during their shared experience.

Hope you find something useful!
Download - please read all instructions before downloading any files!
File Type: txt AE_MedievalNeighbourhoodROS.txt (5.7 KB, 166 downloads) - View custom content
Description: Text file with guidelines for adding random scenarios to your simming. Can be used with dice or a dice-rolling program.
Field Researcher
#174 Old 16th May 2011 at 12:55 PM
Love it, aelflaed! Very interesting how you take the neighbourhood approach rather than strictly individual families, thereby involving more sims in a more interconnected way. Brilliant! That really makes your ROS unique from most of the ones I've come across. I love your scenarios, too!

I use Hook's Randomizer too (marvelous invention, that!) and I never thought of randomizing the family list on my ROS the way you do but I really like that idea! I have become fascinated with the whole ROS thing and thanks for sharing yours!

Vllygrl
Instructor
Original Poster
#175 Old 16th May 2011 at 2:13 PM
This is really cool Aelflaed. I love it! It is a nice addition to what Warwick already does. The challenge seeks to understand how one may change their fate--either by accepting providence or by working against one's "natural place" in the order, so all of the randomness has to do with success/failure of individual behaviors. I like how your scenarios add a measure of global randomness to the whole system. I think I may try this out once I have the neighborhood more established. I've barely gotten most of my sims out of CAS, so we're not ready for a plague just yet--maybe in a generation or two.

I saw your post earlier on the heriot tax, too. It's a good idea. I understand being loath to run a full taxation system. It looks like a good alternative--probably not one I will use, but I'm glad you brought it up since I really hadn't heard of it, and likely wouldn't have thought of it on my own. As I've said elsewhere, this challenge is really more of a play style anyway. I think individual players will probably find what works best for their own play style and with what makes sense in their worlds--so as long as we're not making it too easy on our simmies, it would be a good alternative. I know you said you weren't playing Warwick, but it sounds like you've got the right sort of mentality for it! We welcome your input.
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