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Lab Assistant
#26 Old 25th Jul 2013 at 7:25 PM
That'd be quite sad, I want to start modding so I can start giving back to this amazing community.
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Forum Resident
#27 Old 25th Jul 2013 at 11:28 PM
I think that EA will try to make the game unmoddable so that they can sell you more Store content. Not that the unmoddability will last long, given our talented and dedicated modding community. And if it truly cannot be modded, the players will revolt and EA may allow us to mod. After all, we got Sims 4 to be offline when we spoke out against SimCity, right? The customer is always right.

~Someday my prince will come... And he better not bring all his hood's character files with him.~
@)->----- Place this ASCII flower in your sig as a thank you to all of our amazing moderators at MTS!
TS3 vs. Your CPU: The Solution
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Alchemist
#28 Old 25th Jul 2013 at 11:53 PM
Quote: Originally posted by Vss2eip
EA isn't stupid enough to ...


Stop right there.
Née whiterider
retired moderator
#29 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 12:10 AM
Thankyou very much. I need somebody with a human touch...

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Alchemist
#30 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 12:12 AM
Lab Assistant
#31 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 12:29 AM Last edited by Vertigo : 28th Jul 2013 at 3:45 PM.
Even the idea of playing it without mods is scary.
Née whiterider
retired moderator
#32 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 1:20 AM
I can't tell if that's a pop reference I don't get (if so, given the type of pop being referenced, I'm quite proud of my ignorance); or if you're just happy to see me .

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Alchemist
#33 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 6:48 AM
C'mon, it's the next two words of the song we're singing. Isn't it?
Scholar
#34 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 8:07 AM
Quote: Originally posted by Petchy
Some people could probably take apart Sims 2 and put it back together if they tried.


I wish they would. And then, find a way to change it just enough it wouldn't infringe on EA copyright and release it. Once there was competition, EA would scramble like a cockroach in light!

Quote: Originally posted by coltraz
C'mon, it's the next two words of the song we're singing. Isn't it?

Hey you always on the run, Gotta slow it down baby, gotta have some fun!

Sarcasm is a body's natural defense against stupid.
Lab Assistant
#35 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 9:05 AM Last edited by LaRiennee : 26th Jul 2013 at 9:16 AM.
Well, I highly doubt this will ever happen. Everyone knows that EA counts on modders to fix their crappy work because they sure as hell are too lazy to do it.

No mods means more work for EA.
Née whiterider
retired moderator
#36 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 10:47 AM
Hmm. It might be. The only tune I can think the words "Hey you" to is that of the Pink Floyd song.

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Inventor
#37 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 12:28 PM
Mods fix the games. They would be moronic to make modding impossible/ user unfriendly.

Although looking back to all of the sims games, they have encouraged user creativity with body shop, HomeCrafter, CAS(tyle), as well as the TS1 tools they had which I remember using to making custom pictures and floors and stuff. I think they understand the creative nature of their fanbase so I doubt they would deprive us of these privileges.
Field Researcher
#38 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 1:45 PM
then it would be me proof, so to speak.
Mad Poster
#39 Old 26th Jul 2013 at 2:16 PM
Quote: Originally posted by The Shoveler
Companies will always attempt do what they think they can get away with, and the bigger they are, the more infallible they believe themselves to be. Just because they "learned their lesson" once in the past doesn't mean that they will play nice from then on. It just means that they'll try again from a different angle and hope that the new customers (plus any of the old ones that stuck around since last time) either won't notice or won't care

...


My advice would be to hold off on TS4 and continue to play TS3 for a few weeks as the forums light up and the reviews roll in. No amount of pre-order swag is worth the potential frustration. It's not as if TS3 is suddenly going to suck once TS4 is released.


That was my plan with Sims 3. Never could quite warm up to it. I'm still thinking, "Maybe one day ...."

My problem is, I don't trust EA. It could swear on a pack of llamas that the DRM won't be invasive and creators will have the freedom they enjoyed in Sims 2, but I will still wait six months to a year (and at least one expansion pack) before I consider buying it. EA has ruined the trust of so many with its tactics.

Thanks to ALL free-site creators, admins and mods.

RIP Sunni ... truly a ray of light.
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#40 Old 27th Jul 2013 at 10:09 AM
Quote: Originally posted by YukiShine
Exactly. And some paranoid corner of my brain is wondering if EA doesn't really see a problem here... Seeing how they try so hard to pretend TS and TS2 have never existed, I doubt they are interested in prolonged game survival. They want the players to stay interested for as long as they release expansion packs and stuff packs and then to move on to the next installment along with the company.

Except I never did buy any EPs for TS3. I wasn't talking about playing the game for years and years (even though that is what i have done with TS2).

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Site Helper
#41 Old 27th Jul 2013 at 6:43 PM
Quote: Originally posted by YukiShine
Seeing how they try so hard to pretend TS and TS2 have never existed, I doubt they are interested in prolonged game survival. They want the players to stay interested for as long as they release expansion packs and stuff packs and then to move on to the next installment along with the company.
Why should EA want people to continue to play old games?

They don't make much money off of the old games. Even if the older games are still selling, they aren't going to make as much money as they can with new game. Older games tend to sell at a discount, and they sell less copies because most people who want the game already have it.

It makes sense that they want people to buy the latest and greatest, especially while it's full-price. I just question their tactics for achieving this. Make the new game better than the old one, and people will flock to the new game.

Unfortunately, they have decided to stop selling the older games, to try to force us to play the new ones. To a certain extent, it's working. If a new player can't find the older games, they'll probably try the new ones instead.
Mad Poster
#42 Old 28th Jul 2013 at 10:17 AM Last edited by gazania : 28th Jul 2013 at 5:06 PM.
Quote: Originally posted by Mootilda
Why should EA want people to continue to play old games?

They don't make much money off of the old games. Even if the older games are still selling, they aren't going to make as much money as they can with new game. Older games tend to sell at a discount, and they sell less copies because most people who want the game already have it.

It makes sense that they want people to buy the latest and greatest, especially while it's full-price. I just question their tactics for achieving this. Make the new game better than the old one, and people will flock to the new game.

Unfortunately, they have decided to stop selling the older games, to try to force us to play the new ones. To a certain extent, it's working. If a new player can't find the older games, they'll probably try the new ones instead.


I'm of two minds with this.

Yes, companies do want you playing the latest shinies. Of course they do! But ... sorry if I'm repeating myself ... many companies still carry the older games; some even older than Sims 1! I mentioned Nintendo as an example. Of course, it's going to push the latest and greatest. But EA can certainly move the older games to digital exile at Steam or .... and probably more appropriately .... Good Old Games.

Or EA can quietly allow digital downloads at an Amazon store that is seemingly unaffiliated with it.

It's just that currently, I've been buying EPs and SPs at the "Big Three" (Half, Amazon and EBay), and are amazed how expensive Apartment Life still is, considering the game is a few years old now. New, unopened games can go for about $70 and up. "Like News" (opened, but still in excellent condition; perhaps an extremely light surface scratch or two at best) go for $30. One reason why I'm hesitating at getting it, though not the main one.

FreeTime ... a little better. That is around $21 now in "like new" condition. Around $52 for a new game.

Bon Voyage ... Better still. Around $19 "like new"; $54 brand new.

Those may not sound that bad, but this is four to five years after they came out! Only the most-enjoyed and popular games could command that high a price after so long a time. Most older versions of a series wind up in the bargain bins. These last three Sims 2 expansions are still quite expensive for supposedly-obsolete games

Thanks to ALL free-site creators, admins and mods.

RIP Sunni ... truly a ray of light.
Inventor
#43 Old 28th Jul 2013 at 11:40 AM
Intelligent producers know very well how much modders can do for their games. Therefore, their games are not only moddable but are released with modding tools as well: the most recent example is Shadowrun Returns which came out about a week ago. Some critics were not very impressed with the game or, rather, with the first story, but they all ended saying something like "but wait to see what fans will do." So basically they still encouraged us to buy the game.

On the other hand, Eaxis is not sure at all what to think and do about modders. I am sure that their top brass views then as an unwelcome competition and would prefer TS4 to be on-line only and completely unmoddable; only the lower (or the lowest?) ranks, people who actually work on the game, are at least dimly aware of what mods mean to a part of community. (Not to all of it; there are tons of people out there who don't know anything about them and are happily playing the vanilla game.) In the end, a sort of compromise will be reached, as it was with TS3.

Probably, but don't count too hard on it.
Née whiterider
retired moderator
#44 Old 28th Jul 2013 at 12:10 PM
That's a product of EA's strategy, gazania. Because the TS2 games are no longer being produced, but there are still many players who want to buy them - to replace lost or broken disks, to complete their collection etc - the few remaining copies are in high demand, so the price goes up. As Mootilda says, if EA had made 3 better than 2, that problem wouldn't really exist.

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Scholar
#45 Old 28th Jul 2013 at 12:37 PM
That would be awful.I can't imagine how I will play without mods
Mad Poster
#46 Old 28th Jul 2013 at 5:20 PM Last edited by gazania : 29th Jul 2013 at 1:00 AM.
Well, since I've played Sims 3 on console, I can get an idea of life without mods. (Not perfect, but a slight clue.)

I played Sims 3 for a few weeks, enjoyed it, forgot about it.

EDITED because I was going way off-topic!

Thanks to ALL free-site creators, admins and mods.

RIP Sunni ... truly a ray of light.
Instructor
#47 Old 31st Jul 2013 at 8:40 AM
I would not buy it. Period.

Yes, EA can make the game non-moddalbe. The easiest way of doing this is the Software as a Service model. With this game, the code for the game does not reside on your computers, it is found on EA's servers. You cannot modify the program because it does not exist anywhere on uyour computer. There is nothing to mod. Needless to say, this was, at least originally, a big part of what the Sims 4 was all about.

For me, the best analogy is Microsoft's Flight. Since about 2006, the leading flight simulator was Microsofts Flight Simulator X. (However, a few die hards stuck with the even older Flight Simulator 2004.) That program allowed for virtual flying of general aviation, helecopters, gliders, military aircraft, tube liners and private jets all over the world. If you wanted to fly a Douglas DC3 from Kathmandu to Timbuktu, you could. It as very open to modding, and modders took the game to places Microsoft never envisioned.

Then some geniius at Microsoft came up with the idea of Flight. Instead of flying just about anything with wings, and many things without, one was confiend to a simple general aviation aircraft on the big island of Hawaii. It could not be modded, so third party developers had no interest in promoting it. It did not even have a cockpit, which is the big part of any flight simulator. Microsoft advanced the program at a glacial pace, eventually allowing gamers to fly around the rest of Hawaii. Big Whup!

Or gamers could simply stick with Flight Simulator X. While Flight had more pretties, FSX had a lot more depth in its gameplay.

Flight crashed and burned within six months of its release. Microsoft discontinued it and closed down their shop. They had basically wasted a lot of money on a product no one wanted.

Now keep in mind, flight simulators are one of the oldest and most successful franchises in gaming history. The Flight Simulator franchise stretches back to the likes of the Commodore 64. One really has to work to screw that up. But Microsoft did.

There is no guarantee that the Sims 4 will be a success. In fact, it seems that EA releases more games which bomb than games which succeed. If a game does not move, retailers like Walmart will pull it off of their shelves in a New York minute.

At most EA will release the base game and one EP. If it does not sell, EA will kill the franchise.

If EA strays too far from the things that have made the other Sims series successes, then the Sims 4 will fail. Suceess of the Sims 4 is not guaranteed.

Right now, my guess is that the Sims 4 is going to be a disaster. Start with the fact that EA apparently had to abandon its plans to require a persistnet online presence -- after it experienced the Sims City debacle. So they are left with no eye popping feature. If they make it non-moddalbe, that will be the last nail in its coffin.
Field Researcher
#48 Old 1st Aug 2013 at 9:40 AM
I loved the Sims everything until..... TS3.

And I thought my dedication would be as it was with TS2 but (like many others I know) the enthusiasm dried up very quickly because even with the creative CC's and mods then seriously screwed up my game. Every EP I installed made the problem worst and the need to go back to every creators site to download the fix cc or mod was tedious, and half I forgot where to go!

So hence I am not the proud owner of the TS3 series I stop playing and stop buying a long time ago. TS2 had the odd problem but it never became that the game crashed every 10 minutes or wouldn't save and most of the problems occurred when the only change was a EP install (stop using cc's/mods so stop downloading them)

And I never got a fix and the vanilla was just too boring
Test Subject
#49 Old 2nd Aug 2013 at 3:02 AM
I'm very wary of EA on these games. I purchased Spore from them, it's not that great, but for whatever reason I ended up having it uninstalled 3 times. Computer crash... An install resulting in an error (counted as 1 even though I had to go through the process again)... And I think my cousin accidentally uninstalled it. DRM would not let me play it ever again.

TS3 had great concepts for EP's and the series itself being about a community aging with your sims. Nothing was executed right, all the EP's were dull. I might as well be playing the base game I only use the furniture!

They'll probably have TS4 unmoddable. Or attempt to anyway. Getting rid of that always online thing would make that very difficult, but they could require internet on start up and various random connections throughout your playtime to make sure everything is identical to their servers, if not? Whoops, corrupt save. If that isn't possible, they'll figure out a way. Don't worry, EA ALWAYS finds a way.
Lab Assistant
#50 Old 3rd Aug 2013 at 6:32 PM
Even if they attempt to, we'll probably find a way around it. And if they *do* make it moddable, then we'll go about our usual business.

On the other hand -- if they include a modding tool, expect that there are glitches and bugs and other nasties that come with it.

But if they found a way to make TS4 permanently unmoddable? Unless the game was absolutely perfect (with *maybe* the occasional silly glitch here or there, but nothing serious), I wouldn't buy it. EA's notorious for bugs and horrible content. And making us PAY for said horrible content. EA's not getting half a penny out of me unless it either makes a perfect game or a decent, moddable one. So mod-proof is pretty much a no-no.

TS2 Challenge Addict.
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