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Lab Assistant
#51 Old 7th Mar 2017 at 3:07 AM
I mean I had no issue in sims 1 when sims just magically had mystery meat and greenstuff and their wallet was magically charged. That didn't feel like it was lacking in any way. That game felt deep to me because I got to connect to my sims. Without too many needless things to clutter up the game I could use my own imagination to make the game what I wanted, I didn't need the feature explicitly in the game for it to feel deep.
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Theorist
#52 Old 7th Mar 2017 at 2:28 PM
Imagination is huge; without imagination we don't connect to our sims or feel immersed in their lives. But I don't want to have to "pretend" all the time. I want certain elements actually simulated. The trick is to offer choices so that everyone is happy. In TS2 you could make your sims garden to grow their own food or send them to the store to shop for groceries. Or (and I can't remember if this was a mod or not), have them order groceries over the phone and have them delivered to your sim's door so you could focus on other things.

Now all that simulation is gone. Just click on the refrigerator and there you go. Click on a bookcase to buy books. It's simplified to the extreme and it makes the game less and less of a simulation and more and more of a tablet game where the point is to skill up and achieve goals. I also really, really miss all the conditional logic they used to put into these games. Take for one example wishes/whims. In the past sims had wishes to 'marry so-and-so' just like they still have a whim for that today. The difference is that the code had conditional checks on it; the sim would not spin that whim if they were ALREADY MARRIED TO SO-AND-SO. Now the code is just totally random. Same with traits; conditional code would look for certain logical conditions so you had some variety in behavior. So those are other areas that have been grossly simplified.

I like the cooking in TS4 in the sense that there is lots of variety of foods and recipes. The animations they put in the BG are nice, too. But really they're pretty easy to add so I think that's why they keep expanding them. Some appliances could be considered a novelty in TS3, too; you had ice cream makers and fryers and pizza ovens from the Store. The Stuff Packs are really just re-packaged Store content it seems. But where are the juice makers we had in TS2 where we could actually make juice from the produce your sims grew in their gardens? Again, the depth is missing.

It started with TS3, this missing detail and depth, but IMO they have found a new low in that regard with TS4. As far as I'm concerned TS4 makes TS3 look brilliant in comparison.

¢¾ Receptacle Refugee ¢¾ ~ Where are we going, and why am I in this handbasket!? ~
Laura's Legacy
Mad Poster
#53 Old 8th Mar 2017 at 8:01 AM
I really like that 4 has the search option. I miss that a lot when I am in 3.
Mad Poster
#54 Old 8th Mar 2017 at 4:19 PM
I don't need to assume - that's already a function in the game (with the right expansion installed). If a player doesn't want to shop from the catalog, they can visit a store. I'd love to see ordering online, though. Have a Sims visit you with a large box and it put he furniture in your inventory.

Now, some things need to be streamlined because they would be a genuine inconvenience. Purchasing from a catalog is a processing requirement, but if players want to, they can set up several furniture stores and clothing stores for each and every asset.

However, many tasks could be done at home if you Sim is a hermit, but back in the TS2 days, players could (and often do) merge lots, so a variety of tasks in one trip, or shop from home. There was no need to visit many do the games commercial lots, since most of the objects allowed Sims to interact with them from home. So much so that Sims could start a home business with these items.

Dynamic. Flexible. Versalfile. Options. That's what it's all about. Not cutting things out and claiming them to be an inconvenience. That's like playing a shooter and all of the enemies are dead. "You we're going to kill them anyway."

->> Check Out Checkout: Journey To Employee Of The Month! <<-

~ Just a click a day is nothing short of helpful! ~
dodgy builder
#55 Old 8th Mar 2017 at 4:52 PM
Some people just like to argue ...
Mad Poster
#56 Old 8th Mar 2017 at 8:41 PM
Fair, but the Sims has no real objective.

Quote: Originally posted by Volvenom
Some people just like to argue ...


I dooooooo.

->> Check Out Checkout: Journey To Employee Of The Month! <<-

~ Just a click a day is nothing short of helpful! ~
Theorist
#57 Old 8th Mar 2017 at 11:48 PM Last edited by tangie0906 : 9th Mar 2017 at 12:08 AM.
Actually you could make an argument that the objective is for your sim to make more and more money so they can buy more and nicer stuff. Think about the wishes they get for purchasing stuff. It's the ultimate nod to consumerism; if you want a good night's sleep, you need to earn enough money to buy a better bed!

They've gotten away from a lot of that, more or less, but it's still a part of the game. So shopping is not a redundant activity IMO. However I'm all for choices. The game is so diverse (or at least it used to be) that I'd like a way to order over the phone or computer and have stuff delivered or even just buy it through the catalog if I please. I remember when I was engrossed in something I was doing with my sims I used to get so annoyed with appliances breaking all the time in TS2 that when my sims had enough money I'd just go to buy mode, delete the thing, and buy a new one.

My game, played my way.

And another thing! I dislike calling this or that an 'inconvenience' in this game. A month or two back, someone was complaining about the open world in TS3 and saying what a hassle it was to waste all that time traveling from one place to another. So, OK - for that person, open world and cars were 'inconvenient'. But what's inconvenient to one Simmer is part of the gameplay to another! Personally I loved adjusting the camera so it was locked and hovering above the car and I enjoyed the scenery along with my sim (would have been great if they'd been able to place the camera inside the car - sort of a first person view - while traveling; not crazy about first person view in any other part of the game but that would have been pretty neat).

For some people, in-game shopping and watching their sim travel around the open world in a car WAS part of the gameplay. That's why I'm all for choices; if something doesn't work for you, do what does. But don't keep supporting the removal of gameplay from the game, please and thank you.

¢¾ Receptacle Refugee ¢¾ ~ Where are we going, and why am I in this handbasket!? ~
Laura's Legacy
Mad Poster
#58 Old 9th Mar 2017 at 12:51 AM
It's a Life Simulator. Not everything can (or at least should) be magically one and done. Sure, streamlining is more convenient, but it's about what's also taken away that counts. Sure, fading away to leave the lot is a hell of a lot more convenient, but it's also immersion breaking and feels a little cheap. If it's all about convenience, let's cut more features and make the game about getting skills and generating money.

The game will quickly become one of those clicker games.

->> Check Out Checkout: Journey To Employee Of The Month! <<-

~ Just a click a day is nothing short of helpful! ~
Test Subject
#59 Old 9th Mar 2017 at 6:59 AM
I hope it's not. I want to be able to play for a while before having to buy Sims 5.
Field Researcher
#60 Old 9th Mar 2017 at 9:35 PM
I'm so ready to move on. I stopped buying the EP's, GP's, and SP's after the last overpriced Backyard stuff crap. All the add on's and stuff is not going to fix this game. I'm gonna wait and see if they bother to make a Sims 5, and what kind of disaster or redemption that turns out to be.
Field Researcher
#61 Old 9th Mar 2017 at 11:55 PM
Okay, going back to imagination and in correlation with The Sims: **skip to my point**

This has been bothering me for the LONGEST time. Why is it that a Sim 4 lover (an extreme one to where they bully and discredit others and bash the predecessors) makes an argument to another sims player that they lack imagination because they want more content in the Sims 4? I'm not saying anyone has made this argument on this forum. It just popped into my mind and triggered an irritating memory from THOSE forums that shall not be named.

First of all, I am a writer. My whole career is based off of having immense imagination. Whenever I gaze at pictures and paintings, I'm creating a story right then and there. I can create stories in a matter of seconds. I am Tommy flippin' Pickles when it comes to imagination-graham canyon, mega diapey babies and all! Simmers in general have vivid imaginations and have come up with at least one story to go with that home, sim family or whatever they're creating. Imagination is part of creation.

Why do these extreme lovers insist I, as well as other players, don't have imagination because of our critiques and wants of more content for this game?

Before Sims 4 was announced, I had already had a vision on how they could improve the franchise after Sims 3. The Sims Team could've kept the open world, CASt, cars for sims to drive in, and not create such a buggy mess next time! They could've added the action to chew gum, skateboards, pre-teens, maybe have community buses to take sims to work and where ever else, farms and farm animals, and bunny rabbits. They could've implemented expansion packs, such as Seasons, into the base game. They could've added new expansion packs such as a carnival ep! But they took steps backwards and want players to pay more for less!

No, the problem isn't the lack of imagination or the lack of content, it's the lack of depth.

The last time I play TS4 was in January after toddlers had came out. I created this mean sim who didn't get along with one of her more artistic roommates at first. I wanted them to hate each other. But then when I turned my attention to my other two roommates, the mean girl and the artist were having a good ole time and became friends! I didn't want them to become friends. When I queued up negative interactions, they switched over to joking with each other. When I did the mischievous interactions, there were positive outcomes. When the artist was painting, the mean girl hopped and bopped with a smile on her face, carrying her food, I wanted her to eat in the dining area, to the artist girl's room, and was chatting it up like old pals! Every sim is preppy in this game-no diversity whatsoever.

Before then, I had a gold-digging sim who's children was supposed to resent her. The twins ended up becoming bffs with the mom despite me telling the twins to yell at the mom and play jokes on her in a mean way. Your mom THOTTED UP AND DOWN THE SIM STREETS, SCAMMING SIMS OUT OF THEIR WALLETS BUT YOU WANT TO PRETEND LIKE NOTHING HAD HAPPENED? YOU NEVER QUESTIONED WHY YOU GOT A NEW DADDY EVERY WEEK AFTER YOUR BIO DAD DIED, AFTER CHEATING ON HIS REAL WIFE, NOT THE WHORE OF A MOTHER YOU HAVE, AND YOU ALL DIDN'T CARE ABOUT HIS PASSING??? REALLY???

In my Sims 2 game, two of my sims from different households LOATHED each other and would not stop fighting each other-about ten times in a row they would scrap until the would go potty and eat...then fight again! Whenever my sims would have a negative interaction with another sim, along with a low relationship, it would be difficult for a positive outcome to occur unless some time has passed between them. Married sims would cheat on their spouses, their spouses would become upset and they would not auto woohoo (ACR mod) until their wounds healed. THAT'S more real and THAT'S DEPTH! You don't just get done fighting or yelling at someone and then joking about llamas the next second. Nooooooooooooo! Keep implying their mother is a llama and beat their butt!

**point** The problem isn't the lack of imagination, it is the lack of depth. The team could keep the same semi open world, the look of the sims, but have traits that actually have a significant affect (effect? sleep...) on how they communicate with others in their neighborhood. No, instead let's shove out less content for more money to cover up what's missing! That's a FANTABULOUS idea! No one will notice because it's THE SIMS. If sims acted the way I created them instead of happy-go-lucky folks, there wouldn't be a problem with these soulless Barbie Dolls. Barbie and Ken have more scandals than these sims... **point gotten: The End** Sorry for derailing the thread. It won't be the last ep because THEY KEEP SHOVING OUT PACKS TO HIDE WHAT'S MISSING!!! You think you need more packs to make the game feel complete, more whole. That isn't the problem. You can't keep shoving pointless objects and interactions into the game that will, a majority of time, result in a positive outcome when you don't have depth. It is the deprivation of a soul, not content or imagination! They are milking off of this desperation from players!!! The more they throw out bread crumbs, the more simmers want. It's psychology (or whatever) at it's finest! THE FREAKIN' END!
dodgy builder
#62 Old 10th Mar 2017 at 12:48 AM
Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
I'm already scrolling for days to find an item in some of the menus. In typical EAxis fashion, everything including your kitchen stove are in deco category.


yea, well I don't know. If I find a kitchen stove in deco, I assume it's deco. That assumption has served me well so far. Not so long ago I found a bathtub with routing issues, and a sink that never got wet, and neither was in the deco section.

Quote: Originally posted by acrobativity
I hope it's not. I want to be able to play for a while before having to buy Sims 5.


You don't have to move along when it comes. Several people still play even Sims 1.

Thinking about my needs though, I hope they come up with a fancy thing to make it possible to switch between Sims 3, 4 and 5 without ever having to open a new game. I can see me ending up with decition problems.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#63 Old 10th Mar 2017 at 7:13 PM
Hey, I created this thread and sort of abandoned it. I didn't mean for that to happen and I got sort of busy. There's a lot of good stuff here I'd like to comment on though.
Quote: Originally posted by AncientRome
I suppose I'm one of the few people that would pay $10 for huge updates instead of a lackluster stuff pack that I don't need or want.

I suppose that's true. However, my problem with the "Game Packs" is that they're so focused on one thing and they seem to be what the Sims' team is spending most of their time on.

Quote: Originally posted by SillyMerricat
Two years, six months and two days into the Sims 4 cycle (September 2, 2014 - March 4, 2017) we have 3 expansions and 4 game packs, which are about half an expansion each. So right now EA has released the equivalent of 5 expansion packs of content.
That's still behind schedule for where one of the others games would be even if that were true. However, I'm going to have to call you out on the "half an expansion thing". Take dine-out as an example. That was part of night life and it's own store set for TS3 that they popped out while they had expansion and stuff packs coming out. Nightlife's "restaurant" functionality was hardly 1/4 of the content.

Quote: Originally posted by SillyMerricat
I've been playing these games since the Sims 1 first came out. I've played all four, loved and hated parts of all four so yeah, I think I'm invested in them. And no, I don't agree that there's been a serious decline in quality with the Sims 4.
No one's telling you can't like a game or you're wrong for liking a game. I can see what people would like in TS4's streamlined approach. The Sims has always been a mammoth of a game from a technical aspect. However, I think it's hard to say that this point that The Sims 4 isn't missing content that's core to the series and that makes it a lower quality game than the others. What it comes down to is the objective amount of content that other games have, and The Sims 4 just doesn't have it. If the question is quantity or quality, TS4 has neither.

Quote: Originally posted by Siletka
Not sure why these threads keep popping up. Clearly EA isn't done milking the sad cow.

I keep hearing that but is that true at this point? I mean, I don't think it is either, I think that really they're just spending less on TS4 than they did on the other games. However, after Simcity, they still could throw the franchise out. I never thought they would with Simcity but now the only thing left of that franchise is a base game from 2013 a single expansion back and a phone app that looks like cheap knock-off. Just because they'll keep milking it doesn't really mean anything.

Quote: Originally posted by Tangie0906
It started with TS3, this missing detail and depth, but IMO they have found a new low in that regard with TS4. As far as I'm concerned TS4 makes TS3 look brilliant in comparison.

Honestly, everyone acts like TS2 and TS3 are totally different games. YMMV but I've always sort of seen TS3 as "The Sims 2.5". I mean, look at how different TS1 and TS4 are from the two games.
Field Researcher
#64 Old 11th Mar 2017 at 1:28 AM
Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
My mind doesn't work like that. I see stove and I expect it to function like stove. I see food, I expect it be edible. I see shelving I expect to put stuff on it. I do not care if object put in deco or vehicles or outdoor plants.



What objects are these exactly? They EA objects? I not sure I ever have that problem with EA objects, but I honestly not dismiss possibility that EA bugged certain objects.



Then move on? I mean, no one has gun to you head and forcing you to play and/or even care about The Sims 4...


Oh I totally Moved on I Uninstalled the damn thing!!!! I like coming to the forums to see what else EA/Maxis has fucked up in the game.
Lab Assistant
#65 Old 11th Mar 2017 at 4:29 PM
I wonder what Will Wright's up to these days...
Top Secret Researcher
#66 Old 12th Mar 2017 at 10:01 PM
Quote: Originally posted by Anarchy Blues
I wonder what Will Wright's up to these days...
He must be taking an angry poop.
dodgy builder
#67 Old 12th Mar 2017 at 10:20 PM Last edited by Volvenom : 12th Mar 2017 at 10:30 PM.
Quote: Originally posted by Anarchy Blues
I wonder what Will Wright's up to these days...


He sits laughing on his sofa, points at EA "asking who's laughing now?".

Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
My mind doesn't work like that. I see stove and I expect it to function like stove. I see food, I expect it be edible. I see shelving I expect to put stuff on it. I do not care if object put in deco or vehicles or outdoor plants.


Oh I see, then you should probably get out more I guess. The world can be really complicated, and doesn't seem to get easier, rather the opposite.

... and it didn't occur to you that they have separated things into sections for a reason? I used deco food the other day, and I'm happy doing that. After all I don't support my downloaders with food, they will have to find that on their own. Thinking about the crime it is to eat my deco? Nah don't think so. If I put down a bowl of apples, it's not meant for you to eat it.

Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
What objects are these exactly? They EA objects? I not sure I ever have that problem with EA objects, but I honestly not dismiss possibility that EA bugged certain objects.


Instead of getting stuck with EA's "game" look and lack of choice, I move on to CC. Thinking about it, they were both from the same creator. Not that EA's items has any less problems, I just tend to not use them ... and if It's EA's objects who should I complain to and do they really care? No I prefer to stick with CC, if I'm not satisfied there's always something else around I can use instead.

Talking about moving on, someone even prefer to move backwards to 3 or even further back to 2.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#68 Old 25th Mar 2017 at 9:42 PM
Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
Then move on? I mean, no one has gun to you head and forcing you to play and/or even care about The Sims 4...


Yeah, I know right? There's a surprising amount of people who think they have to own literally EVERY Sims game. I ducked out after TS4. I still maintain that 2/3 were the high point of the series. I think The Sims is on its way to becoming an Apple Store app that EA creates to capitalize off what ever brand loyalty Sims fans have left.

Mark my words, they'll basically abandon the recipe that made the game popular in the first place and slap "The Sims" onto a half-polished phone game. They already did it to Simcity.
Mad Poster
#69 Old 25th Mar 2017 at 9:58 PM
Quote: Originally posted by HarVee
Somethings are often 'streamlined' because they cause inconvenience to players. Going to a shop to buy stuff may be realistic, but not convenient. Can you imagine how annoying it would be having to traverse all around town to furniture store to buy a chair because the buy catalog doesn't exist?

Case in point; The shopping was removed because it ultimately was inconvenient and distracted the player from other more interesting tasks.



I'm already scrolling for days to find an item in some of the menus. In typical EAxis fashion, everything including your kitchen stove are in deco category.

They could have provided quick/easy alternatives. That's why in TS2, If you didn't feel like going through a loading to purchase groceris, you could always just order it at your doorstep. Same goes for furniture: either buy it from a store (that is, If you have GTW) or choose to get it straight from the buy mode.
Mad Poster
#70 Old 26th Mar 2017 at 8:21 AM Last edited by gazania : 26th Mar 2017 at 3:08 PM.
I did not predict the death of Sims 4 in the beginning, and I won't now. I'm not psychic.

I'm not getting the impression that this series is selling as well as Sims 1, 2 or 3; not only from here, but from other sources. One thing I read over and over in YouTube comments on anything Sims 4, for instance, are remarks about how much better Sims 2 and 3 are. I do not believe that everyone from this forum went over there! However, this does not mean the game is not selling at all. There seems to be quite a flurry of excellent CC content, which indicates something, I believe. (Though I still think that adf.ly and shorte.st are nasty blights in the Sims 4 community.) One thing that does interest me is that except for one milestone, we haven't heard much from EA about the Sims 4 sales figures, as others have pointed out. I recall EA crowing much more about Sims 1, 2 and 3.

Maybe in the current economic and PC game sales climate, and perhaps in the wake of having to do such a turn-around with the online characteristic of Sims 4 after the debacle of SimCity 2013, EA is doing as well as it expected with Sims 4 under the circumstances. However, without a side-by-side comparison of Sims 1. 2. 3 and 4 sales that include digital downloads (I believe we had problems finding the exact sales figures because of that), I might very well be putting 1 and 1 together and getting 11, based on my opinions of the game.

This is an older source, but a source it is:

http://honeywellsims4news.tumblr.co...revenue-says-ea

(And with that, I'll call it a day with this post. I just had three wisdom teeth pulled on Friday, and I'm reading and re-reading these sentences after having taken my evening Oxycodone [Oxycontin]. It might be time for sleeping this drug off. I THINK I'm coherent here! If not, I apologize.)

Thanks to ALL free-site creators, admins and mods.

RIP Sunni ... truly a ray of light.
Test Subject
#71 Old 26th Mar 2017 at 7:00 PM
It annoys me that the last 2 expansions and latest gamepack basically add up to a half-baked version of Night Life from TS3.
It angers me that Get Together is essentially just recycled Dating/Party/Wedding code, and that retail is a poor man's version of OFB with a lack of creative options.

I think comparisons are completely justified. If you look at the state of TS4, even adding up every stuff pack, expansion and gamepack, and compare it to where TS3 was at this point only qualifying the first 3 expansions, theres a huge lack of endearing, immersive, quality content in my opinion.
I hate dooming and glooming but I think if the next expansion was the last I wouldn't complain a bit. I've witnessed a pattern of disappointment and I feel like the developers don't really know where to take the series. Every expansion feels like its trying to aimlessly add in recycled content as cheaply as possible.

I wonder if part of this is brought on from the failure of Sim City? I'd imagine EA has nu-Maxis on a tight, TIGHT leash after that, and more than likely content and budget constraints are comparable to a Chinese sweatshop.

Grah, I think the worst part of all of this, is that its made it so dang hard to go back to previous entries in the series! If TS4 got anything right, its great looking Sims and a pretty pleasing art style. Going back to TS3, with those potato monstrosities is truly hard!
Lab Assistant
#72 Old 26th Mar 2017 at 7:26 PM
When I heard TS4 was going to be released i got really excited. I have been playing most of my life, I had the sims 2 ultimate collection and almost all of the sims 3 expansions, and I was expecting sims 4 to be sims 3, but better. I bought the game as soon as possible, got really pumped during the installation (lol), and then started it up.
I have never been so disappointed in my life.
After that, I was still under EA's trance, and bought the expansions, hoping it would 'fill that gap', but those all lacked the feeling I got from the previous games. I mean, look at the sims 4 families! They are super boring, and their background stories are soo lame. TS2 family stories were so well thought out, and yeah, maybe a bit creepy (#OliveAndHerCreepyBackyard), but I really enjoyed that and played the story out. Sims 4, on the other hand, I don't know what to do with them. They somehow even made the Goths boring!
I am keeping my fingers crossed for sims 5.
PS, I miss will wright! I can't believe he left this game to these fools...
Lab Assistant
#73 Old 28th Mar 2017 at 7:38 AM
No expert here....I played S1, S2, and now S4. I ducked S3 because the initial commentaries were so negative. I'm sorry I did that...but whatever. Please, though, allow me to comment on the state of EA. EA owns POGO....a game site on which I've played since its inception back to Sept 1999. It was first independent....then AOL bought it....now EA has it. Initially EA seemed to keep it running well but in the last couple of years it's been a disaster. New games are introduced on POGO that don't play well; don't give out the tokens they claim; freeze up; simply are maddening. In addition, a lot of the newer games are in association with other producers and to play well they require boosters/power-ups/whatever that....cost GEMS. POGO runs tokens bonuses (play a game, get a bunch of tokens) on Thursdays and Sundays that often list the previous week - were never updated. The also have a token giveaway called "Celebrate with Pogo" (oddball/random token giveaways for playing certain games). They stopped announcing "Celebrate". When you chase it down, it gives the date as March 17 with the next date March 20....but it's already March 25. If you're really determined, you can look at the master game list for BONUS beside a game....no one there seems to care. If you have a problem, you have to contact EA support (yep, the exact same as it you have a Sims problem). I have yet to EVER reach anybody who's ever played any pogo games and they have no idea what I'm talking about. One night it took me 3 hr and multiple "helpers" to conclude I was NEVER going to get an answer or help of any kind. At least we have the forums and other sites to help with Sims problems. Bottom line: EA gets cursed in this household for not only the Sims...but POGO. And it's all the same incompetence. EA is either under-staffed, under-talented, or BOTH. Actually I think both and can only imagine the stress EA's employees may be under....I'd really pity them if EA didn't also stress out my life :-P
Mad Poster
#74 Old 28th Mar 2017 at 2:28 PM
Some of this stuff does not apply to Sims 4, since it came out in 2014. But hearing some of these points sounds like an echo. Perhaps our perception that newer games in general don't quite cut it isn't a mere matter of a few disgruntled opinions.

2001? This would place our series in Sims 1!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zlc8piKQccU

Thanks to ALL free-site creators, admins and mods.

RIP Sunni ... truly a ray of light.
Field Researcher
#75 Old 28th Mar 2017 at 6:31 PM
People are right in saying the sims 3 store was designed to nickel and dime people.

This article is interesting. The CEO says EA doesn't want to nickel and dime people with micro transactions. (even though that's what they did with the sims 3). Anyway, this article may be an interesting read for some.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/e...c/1100-6432356/

https://www.extremetech.com/gaming/...crotransactions
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