Add color channel

[SimVeggie]

I did a search but I'm not 100% on what terms to search for, so please forgive me.

I want to add color channels to already existing objects. User created mostly, but If game objects are a good place to start then that where I'll start. The tutorials I'm finding all start with meshing. I just can't wrap my head around 3D on a flat computer screen, I just get lost. Using them with clear steps is not a problem just actually manipulating meshes make my head hurt.

I used to recolor a lot of plants for sims 2 and I'd like to do something with them in sims 3.

Thank you for any help and/or links that will help me!

[Inge Jones]

Last time someone asked this, we didn't know a way to do it. I haven't heard anything to say that status has changed since then.

[Whiterider]

I assume, then, that question is about making non-CAStable objects CAStable, or about adding a 4th channel, not regular adding of the first three channels to an already-recolourable object?

[Inge Jones]

Oh - if it was to add another color variation to the ones you can pick from in the catalog when purchasing the object, then that's simple enough. I took the word "channel" at face value, it could be the OP didn't mean that exactly.

[orangemittens]

Hi SV...it's good to see you :) Adding a 2nd or 3rd channel to an object that already has one recolorable channel is not difficult and does not require meshing.

If the object has no recolorable channel (an example would be the EA painting named Smooth Jam in Three Parts) then you will need to clone an object that does and replace its mesh with the plant mesh you want to add extra channels to. This would still not require meshing per se...it's a pretty easy process to just exchange one mesh for another. You might also need to change other things so that the new object has the properties you want it to have and not those of the item you've cloned. Most, if not all, of these changes would still not require meshing.

What object(s) are you wanting to work with and what characteristics must it have in-game to fit your plan for it?

[SimVeggie]

Thank you for the replies. Channel I guess wasn't exactly the right word. Which could be why my search was unsuccessful :)

Yes I would like to add another color variation to an object kinda like in CAS where you pick a t-shirt and you can add another design to it.

But after reading OrangeMittens' post I can see where I'll want to add more channels. So that the pot can be recolored as well as the flowers.

So I was thinking the Ring-o-Posies commercial planter has 1 color channel, so I would need to clone something with 2 or 3 color channels and exchange the mesh...correct?

But if I wanted the Sawed-off Lightcaster to have its 2 recolor-able channels on the base only (not that I would) then I would need to add a color variation...correct?

Can you recommend some tutorials to read that are beginner friendly? Thank you for all the help, just getting the terms right should help! LOL

[Inge Jones]

So did you find out the answer to your original question?

[orangemittens]

If an object has one recolorable channel you can use s3pe to enable the second and third channels quite easily. To get the object to show the new channels where you want them you would edit the Mask img. This doesn't require any meshing.

The Ring of posies has a single recolorable channel and the flower portion is an overlay on an alpha much like what you probably worked with a lot in Sims 2.

So you can do what you're looking to do with that object in at least 2 ways. First you could add new overlays with different colors (and shapes if you wanted) for the flowers and leave the pot portion alone. This would require you to make new Overlay img's and add them to the package using s3pe. Then, again using s3pe, you would make other changes to the .package the same way as a painting gets new images. None of this requires meshing. For this process you could use the painting tutorial I wrote since you're performing the same procedure. You would end up with a pot that is recolorable in CAS and multiple flower colors to choose from when the item is purchased or when the player chooses to recolor it in CAS. Think of this one like the flowers are analogous to a painting image and the pot is analogous to a recolorable painting frame.

The second way would be to make the flower portion recolorable in the same way that the pot part is. This would end up giving you flowers that the downloader recolored in CAS and could result in plaid flowers :P Again though, this could be done without meshing.

I think, for what it's worth, that the way to go in this case is the first way. Not only would it give you control over the final appearance of the flowers, it would give you an object like those in Sims 2 where multiple user-made recolors are selectable when the item is purchased or when the player decides they'd like a change.

[SimVeggie]

Sorry for not replying sooner...the weeds in the garden are talking over then I was to hot and grumpy to sit down at the computer and do anything productive. LOL I think I'll go though your painting tutorial again (I tried it once and failed, but I used a store mesh). Then I might look around at some basic object creating tutorials because I kinda like the idea of the plaid flower idea. I was thinking about painting in the red-green-blue different variations. I'll try the first way you mention to get a handle on things then see what I want to do :D Thank you for all the help.

[orangemittens]

If you have questions about the painting tutorial I'm happy to answer them in the tutorial thread :) Once you've finished that you would need to take a look at Cmo's multiple images tutorial to learn to add more overlays to your package and have them show up as choices in Buy mode. Again, if you have questions I can help with that.

For the plaid flower idea you don't need an object creation tutorial per se because you aren't going to need to create an object. What you would need to do is export the overlay, the mask, and the multiplier. You would make the overlay an all-black alpha so that when applied to the object it is not visible. This makes it so the game recognizes the flowers as a recolorable part of the mesh.

You would need to create appropriate shadowing for your flowers (you could keep the pot part unless you're changing the shape of the pot) and alter the multiplier accordingly. If you don't change this the flowers will have no shading and look flat in-game.

Then you would paint the part of the mask that the flowers are mapped on to pure green (the pot is on the red channel so the next one is the green channel). Following that you would need to use s3pe to go into the OBJD and enable the second channel. This would make the object have two recolorable channels (instead of one which is what it has now) and make the game recognize the flower is the part you want the second channel applied to. I haven't looked at the specular for this particular object. It may need changes also but prolly won't.

None of this requires meshing or object creation per se as much as it requires editing of the dds IMG's. The only circumstance that might require changes to the actual mesh would be if you didn't like the way the flower was mapped. Then you would have to change the mapping in a 3D editor like Milkshape or Blender.

If you decide to give that process a whirl and run into questions post 'em here and I can help.

[SimVeggie]

I followed your painting tutorial and got that to work perfectly and then I did the multi-painting one. That one I had a little trouble with but I got it in the end. When replacing the instance numbers I couldn't find the original one to replace, then I redid it from scratch and got it to work. Now I'd like to attempt the full on plaid flower. Unfortunately I have no idea where to find the overlay, the mask, and the multiplier. I looked at all of the image files and I feel that its something simple I'm missing. If you could point me in the right direction I'd be very grateful!

[Inge Jones]

I have a tool due into test cycle very soon that would help with this :D

[SimVeggie]

Awesome!! I can't wait to try it. All of your programs are neat and clean and easy to use. Thank you.

[orangemittens]

I followed your painting tutorial and got that to work perfectly and then I did the multi-painting one. That one I had a little trouble with but I got it in the end. When replacing the instance numbers I couldn't find the original one to replace, then I redid it from scratch and got it to work. Now I'd like to attempt the full on plaid flower. Unfortunately I have no idea where to find the overlay, the mask, and the multiplier. I looked at all of the image files and I feel that its something simple I'm missing. If you could point me in the right direction I'd be very grateful!If we're still talking EA's flower barrel (ring of posies) the overlay, mask, and multiplier are named as follows:

Overlay - sculpturePlantFlowe_0xD1A775558C582085

Mask - sculpturePlantFlowe_0x6F1F6F6BA3DC83E6

Multiplier - sculpturePlantFlowe_0xd1A775558C582087

In s3pe they should be the first three IMG's after the empty Overlay and these names will appear in the Name column.

[furballvie]

I dont mean to hijack this thread but it seems to be close enough to what I would like to know ... am I correct, that (so far) it is not possible to activate the alpha as a fourth color option in CaS, on an object that only uses R, G and B?

I tried it with a dresser that had one color option only, making it three was easy enough, but even though I (correctly) created the alpha channel, CaS would not recognize it as fourth color "slot" ... anyhow I will try to find a dresser from one of the new stuff packs that has all 4 active and use it as a base

[cmomoney]

You can use the Texture Tweeker (http://dino.drealm.info/den/denforum/index.php?topic=625.0) to enable the 4th channel, as well as other pattern/texture operations.

[Inge Jones]

Yes it can now be done. Please see http://dino.drealm.info/den/denforum/index.php?topic=625.0

[furballvie]

Thank you both very much! :D

[furballvie]

I am sorry to be a pest ... could it be that the tweaker does not like package files created with the TSR workshop? It either crashes when I try to activate the 4th slot (error message in german about some "exception in the application yadda yadda" and that "an object reference was not set to an object instance" roughly translated) or it cannot open the file at all (error message: Did not manage to find or open a suitable catalog resource (eg OBJD)) ...

that is SO me - if it was made by a human I am sure as hell gonna break it -.-

sorry for bothering you

Yes it can now be done. Please see http://dino.drealm.info/den/denforum/index.php?topic=625.0

[Whiterider]

Perhaps it'd help if you attached the file you're working on? :)

[Inge Jones]

Well in short there may well be things it doesn't like about TSRW packages, but if I can get the package you were trying on, I might be able to spot some way of working around it.

[BloomsBase]

I think it is because TSRW reads(and writes) from the XML files, you need to update those aswell.
It is possible to update sims3packs/packages created with TSRW with a extra channel, did a few.

[furballvie]

thank you, I really appreciate you're taking the time to help me here :)

for the clothing item it would be the 2nd variation that I would like to activate the alpha for

thanks again for your help, time and patience :)

Perhaps it'd help if you attached the file you're working on? :)

[Whiterider]

Ah, well TT3 doesn't do CAS content, which will be the cause of the problem with that file. :)

[Inge Jones]

Oh it just occurred to me - with the dresser anyway - Furballvie, you *did* remember to edit the mask didn't you? To give it an alpha channel where you want pattern D to show? If it only has red, green and blue channels, it will of course only show the first three patterns in the game. Although TT3 makes it possible to enable that 4th channel, it will always be up to the creator to edit their images appropriately, as no tool can guess which areas of your mesh are intended for which channel.

Also tick "enabled" on pattern D

[BloomsBase]

Also keep in mind that CAS mask textures have a diffrent setup on the channels then the mask for objects.

[Whiterider]

Actually, they don't. EA use red, yellow, pink and alpha for CAS content, and red, green, blue and alpha for objects - but you can use RGBA on CAS content, or RYPA on objects, and it works fine. I guess the CAS team and the object team just had different habits.

[BloomsBase]

Uh, yes they are....
CASp are layered diffrent:
While the first channel is always ''completly''(When RGBA is used the first(R) channel must have a cutout same size as the alpha channel.) white(R) the 2nd(G) and 3rd channel(B) are colored on top of the red channel and will overrule it.(R is overruled by G and B while G is overruled by B.)


Object mask textures do not work this way, on those each channel must not interfear with others.

[Inge Jones]

Bloom that isn't strictly true always for objects. It depends on a "blend" setting, which I don't understand entirely how to use, and is mentioned in about 3 different places, including the xml and the TXTC. But if blend is true, then an area of the mask that is >0,>0,>0,>0 will have all 4 channels bleeding through each other. If false, then only the pattern on the 4th channel will show (override) on that pixel.

[BloomsBase]

Exept that i never seen any objects use a CASp mask setup or vice versa.
Since i started with creating CASparts i assumed objects would use the same setup and although they work without any problems my creations got rejected on TSR for not following that setup.
The reason i found out btw :)

[Inge Jones]

Yes I am sure there are usage conventions, like the team who made most of the casparts had their preferences and the team that made objects had a different preference. But it's good to understand all the possibilities that the game will accept, to allow flexibility in creating.

[BloomsBase]

Tell that to the people on TSR lol :)

[furballvie]

Oh it just occurred to me - with the dresser anyway - Furballvie, you *did* remember to edit the mask didn't you? To give it an alpha channel where you want pattern D to show? If it only has red, green and blue channels, it will of course only show the first three patterns in the game. Although TT3 makes it possible to enable that 4th channel, it will always be up to the creator to edit their images appropriately, as no tool can guess which areas of your mesh are intended for which channel.

yes, that's what I did and I kinda expected the 4th color slot to "magically" appear once an alpha channel would be present in the mask - but alas - it never is that easy, is it ^^

Also tick "enabled" on pattern D

which program do you mean? in TSR WS there is no pattern D available at all, while in TT3 I see the option but cannot select it and when I try to "upgrade to 4 channel CAST table" it crashes ^^

[BloomsBase]

in TSR WS there is no pattern D available at all, while in TT3 I see the option but cannot select it and when I try to "upgrade to 4 channel CAST table" it crashes ^^

3 to 4 recolor option is at the top of the texture tab in TSRW.
Always worked fine for CASparts, just update the mask with a alpha channel and change the format when saving(DXT5interpolatedalpha)

[orangemittens]

3 to 4 recolor option is at the top of the texture tab in TSRW.
Always worked fine for CASparts, just update the mask with a alpha channel and change the format when saving(DXT5interpolatedalpha)I may be mistaken here but it seems like furballvie is trying to create an object (dresser) with 4 recolorable channels. If so is a texture tab for CAS parts going to help?...isn't that a tab for clothes and accessory kinds of things?

[BloomsBase]

I may be mistaken here but it seems like furballvie is trying to create an object (dresser) with 4 recolorable channels. If so is a texture tab for CAS parts going to help?...isn't that a tab for clothes and accessory kinds of things?

He/she wants to do both, see post 23.
Little confusion but i mentioned it was for CAS.

[orangemittens]

He/she wants to do both, see post 23.
Little confusion but i mentioned it was for CAS.Sorrries for the confusion. You responded to this quote "in TSR WS there is no pattern D available at all, while in TT3 I see the option but cannot select it and when I try to upgrade to 4 channel CAST table it crashes" but answered about a CAS tab so I was just trying to clarify what you meant. I don't use tsrw so I wasn't sure if you meant CAS tab in that tool worked for CAST items or not.

[BloomsBase]

I know.....

I don't know with wat program furrballvie uses to clone and make the edits to the object packages.
If he/she uses s3OC/s3PE updating a package with TT3 shouldn't be a problem.

TSRW however needs the xml files to be updated aswell, otherwise the 4th color option will not show.(it will ingame but not in TSRW)

[Inge Jones]

TT3 does update the XML.... and it appears to make it show in TSRW as an *extra* object!!! (Going by the other similar thread)