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simsample
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retired moderator
Original Poster
#101 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 12:16 AM
Oh wow, so you could not only modify the position, but the size of the water too! But we are restricted to square tiled areas, not rectangular?
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SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#102 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 1:23 AM
#0 is rectangular so we can have rectangles, so is #4
the restriction is that the tiles are square so its not efficient to have a plane with odd proportions.
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
buxcosim
Lab Assistant
#103 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 1:50 AM
Quote: Originally posted by simsample
Oh wow, so you could not only modify the position, but the size of the water too! But we are restricted to square tiled areas, not rectangular?
Great work on the technical end, everyone! Sadly, all of the above posts were way beyond me, so I guess I'll have to wait for the "Complete Idiot's Guide to Editing Water Planes" tutorial!

At any rate, I don't mind being limited to square tiled areas. I'm just happy that custom water planes are slowly but surely becoming a possibility! I'll still need to wait for the incredibly dumbed down tutorial though; anything more technical than "change this byte in this resource to specify this" and my head starts to hurt!

If only EA had made the water plane resources simple, like five data points: x, z for corner 1; x, z for corner 2; and y for altitude. They could have designed the rendering system so that any time it finds a 707 water resource in the world, it simply reads the coordinates and creates the plane and the rendering info automatically. That way, all we'd need to do is copy a 707 resource, change the values to get the coordinates we want, and then paste it into a world. But we shouldn't even have to do that much: They gave us a program to create custom worlds, the game now supports raised water planes, so would including a "Draw Water" tool that generates the 707 resource automatically have been too much to ask for?

/end rant

(I sometimes feel that there's a secret cabal of programmers at EA whose job it is to make things needlessly complicated so that user-created worlds will lack some of the features of EA-created worlds - mainly because user-created worlds are often better than EA-created worlds!)
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#104 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 6:42 AM
YAY SandrineD Gratz on figuring out the 3rd part.
This should work for making custom water planes:
http://zaidesthings.com/projects/th.../waterplane.php
I haven't been able to test the planes it makes yet as I'm away from home and don't have The Sims 3 on my laptop.
Note: Rectangular planes, planes that have a X2-X1 or Z2-Z1 not dividable by 32, planes by the edge of the map or Big planes may be buggy.
simsample
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retired moderator
Original Poster
#105 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 12:32 PM
Excellent work, zaide_chris- I will test it as soon as I can.

Thank you to you and SandrineD for working on this!
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#106 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 2:05 PM
Quote: Originally posted by zaide_chris
Note: Rectangular planes, planes that have a X2-X1 or Z2-Z1 not dividable by 32, planes by the edge of the map or Big planes may be buggy.


I'm not sure if that's correct as #2 has a tilesize of 37.333r and #3 has 40.
I rather suspect it is that the tiles themselves must be square.
so you can have a rectangle like #0 which is 192x160 but it is 6x5 tiles but not, for eg, a weird size like 192x175. I could be wrong but I think it is so.
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#107 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 2:14 PM
Wont be able to do any testing til monday I think but I'll see if the 707's work.
I also intentionally generated a non-square-tiled one to see what happens.
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
kiwi_tea
Retired
retired moderator
#108 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 2:15 PM
I wish I could help research this, but my dyscalculia means I'm beginning to feel lost even before I start. I really want to thank you guys for this work, and I hope if it's even possible, the results can be rendered in a way that doesn't demand too much calculation or numerical juggling. But that may be an unrealistic hope.

SandrineD, simsample, zaide_chris, you guys rock for really digging in to crack this.
CAW Wiki - A wiki for CAW users. Feel free to edit.

GON OUT, BACKSON, BISY BACKSON
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#109 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 8:34 PM Last edited by zaide_chris : 21st Aug 2011 at 8:46 PM.
Quote: Originally posted by SandrineD
I'm not sure if that's correct as #2 has a tilesize of 37.333r and #3 has 40.
I rather suspect it is that the tiles themselves must be square.
so you can have a rectangle like #0 which is 192x160 but it is 6x5 tiles but not, for eg, a weird size like 192x175. I could be wrong but I think it is so.


Quote: Originally posted by zaide_chirs
may be buggy.
I'm not sure as i haven't been able to do in game testing note the "may" as in my tool isn't perfect yet.

I know there are rectangle planes but my tool when given the same Z, X1, Z1, X2 and Z2. the files that come out are not exact matches but square place that have tiles of 32 come out 100% the same.

Edit:
kiwi_tea if you know your way around S3PE try using planes made with my tool at http://zaidesthings.com/projects/th.../waterplane.php I need testers.
Square planes with a X2-X1 and Z2-Z1 both divisible by 32 with no remainder are a good spot to start.
Rename them to:
S3_707CA200_00000000_0000000000000000%%+UNKN.bnry
S3_707CA200_00000000_0000000000000001%%+UNKN.bnry
S3_707CA200_00000000_0000000000000002%%+UNKN.bnry
S3_707CA200_00000000_0000000000000003%%+UNKN.bnry
etc..
Also you need to import the 90624C1B file from simsimsample's first post or set 12th byte of yours to the number of water planes your useing.
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#110 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 10:50 PM
I should be doing something else but couldn't resist...
recoloured the dds to purple the water texture... makes the detail more interesting
three files created by zc's php page
first two with bad sizes the third is square but not mult of 32
x1 z1 x2 z2 xs zs
#0 129 513 225 607 96 94
#1 513 513 609 703 96 190
#2 769 513 969 713 200 200
rendered in image from the bottom so the top one is #2

C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
simsample
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retired moderator
Original Poster
#111 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 10:57 PM
It worked! *simsample does happy dance and throws flowers at SandrineD and zaide_chris*

I love the purple water, Sandrine! That #1 is especially interesting.

What I did was this:
#0
y200
x1 100
z1 100
x2 1060
z2 1060

#0
y200
x1 100
z1 100
x2 1060
z2 420

As you can see, one is square but the other seems to stretch to infinity! (It looks chopped off because of the max draw capabilities of my computer, but it does indeed seem to go on forever.) An infinite river! Why did that happen, I wonder?





The odd artefacts on the thin river are just y-fighting, where I have the y co-ord the same for both.

This is excellent, I'm going to test it some more tomorrow.
Screenshots
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#112 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 11:01 PM
it doesn't seem to like the rectangles.
when you get a chance let me know the tiling on the long thin one.
by that I mean following the last set of FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF... what are the next 2 values
eg 03 00 00 00 02 00 00 00
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#113 Old 21st Aug 2011 at 11:04 PM Last edited by zaide_chris : 22nd Aug 2011 at 12:34 AM.
OK the first group
has the blocks in a order of a spiral pattern like
for a 2by2
Code: 
3 0
2 1

for a 3by3
Code: 
4 5 6
3 0 7
2 1 8

for a 4by4
Code: 
f 4 5 6
e 3 0 7
d 2 1 8
c b a 9

I haven't figured out the order for non square planes
This is the code I use to make the spiral I'm going to add another page that makes them with out the spiral as it may not be needed but I doubt it.
Code: 
	function spiral($X, $Y){
		$number = ($X*$Y)-1;
		$centerX = floor($X/2);
		$centerY = floor($Y/2);
		$direction = 0;
		$return = array();
		$returnX = $centerX;
		$returnY = $centerY;
		$layer = 1;
		$return[] = array($returnX, $returnY);
		while ($number>0){
			--$number;
			if($direction==0){
				--$returnY;
				$return[] = array($returnX, $returnY);
				if($centerY-$layer==$returnY){
					$direction=1;
				}
			}elseif($direction==1){
				--$returnX;
				$return[] = array($returnX, $returnY);
				if($centerX-$layer==$returnX){
					$direction=2;
				}
			}elseif($direction==2){
				++$returnY;
				$return[] = array($returnX, $returnY);
				if($centerY+$layer==$returnY){
					$direction=3;
				}
			}elseif($direction==3){
				++$returnX;
				$return[] = array($returnX, $returnY);
				if($centerY+$layer==$returnX){
					$direction=0;
					++$layer;
				}
			}
		}
		return $return;
	}


Edit: The page now has a debug and use grid for group one option:
http://zaidesthings.com/projects/th.../waterplane.php
Debug just dumps all the variables after making the grids and spiral it doesn't make a download.

Edit: simsample your infinite river is my spiral function dying honorably.
buxcosim
Lab Assistant
#114 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 3:41 AM
This tool sounds awesome! Off to go measure my world to see where I want a water plane, and then on to testing...

Thanks to everyone for helping to crack this and to zaide_chris for the tool!
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#115 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 4:47 AM Last edited by zaide_chris : 22nd Aug 2011 at 5:50 AM.
Okay, I'm back home and I Tested using a grid for the planes and not a spiral and it seems to work fine. It does not match the layout of the EA made planes but it does work so i'm going to change my script to use a grid for group 1 by default. The use gird option is also going to be replaced with a use spiral one.

Edit:
I added a option to force one tile it lowers file size and seems to have no side effects but it may have some in the game.
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#116 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 7:21 AM
is it down? I get this...

db ecountered a fatal error.
Code:1
Could not connect to db server.
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#117 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 7:37 AM
Sorry, Should be working now.
TVRdesigns
Field Researcher
#118 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 11:00 AM
Okay, did some testing while discussing some stuff with zaide_chris on #create, and here's what we discovered..
  • the planes work in actual game
  • they cut away properly, without any issues, just like the regular EA planes
  • you CAN fish on them, the animation is there and the buoy floats on the plane but you will NEVER catch anything. After discovering this, I tested EA's worlds, fished exactly where bridgeport and twinbrook's spawners were placed and its the same result.. so obviously, its unnavoidable.
  • My plane was made without spiral on, which means that its not perfectly square.. there was some questions raised whether this was safe, I can confirm, at least from a very small testing point of view, it doesn't make a different glitch wise.. nor lag wise.
  • A couple of questions were raised while we were back and forthing, including whether we could change the flow of water direction, as my stupid planes flow away from my waterfall.. it looks funny, but really.. its just annoying..
  • Another one was whether he could make actual custom shapes... as in, non rectangle/square planes... to me, makes no sense, as you just cut away what you don't need using terrain tools anyway, but I can see some use being made out of it eventually.
And thats all so far... if I find anything else out, or I can think of any other questions, I will post more I guess..

As a side note, I am so grateful that we have creators here at MTS that have dedicated the last... well.. 6\-8 months on this.. its a HUGE undertaking, and for you guys to have figured it out, its just phenomenal.. you guys deserve something special, but.. I'm really cheap. so.. you can have some pixel candy, but you can buy it yourself.
I didn't see you there. Hello. *runs* | Visit my CFF World thread
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#119 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 11:10 AM
I guess these WP's are using the general water texture, same as sea.
This is prob why the water always flows one way.
So the next qn is... can we specify them to use diff textures?

I was working on doing my own 707 creator but if you got it working I might look into other things.
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
zaide_chris
Lab Assistant
#120 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 11:26 AM
It's working spiral only works for square planes but it doesn't seem to be needed.
Force one tile seems to work too but it is even more off from EA's files.

I'm looking in to the 0500 WORD and 03000000 DWORD now hopefully one of them rotates planes
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#121 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 1:59 PM
pretty sure the 0500 is a file type thing, the first thing usually is, so the program knows what to do with it.
03 I am still not sure, for no particular reason I start to believe it is to indicate triangles as this is not otherwise indicated.
It may be obvious to use triangles but, while computer can be very clever, they also need spoon feeding sometimes!?
C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
simsample
e3 d3 Ne2 Nd2 Nb3 Ng3
retired moderator
Original Poster
#122 Old 22nd Aug 2011 at 7:22 PM
Hooray! My rectangular plane is working now, thanks to the 'force one tile' tick box.



That's more like I had envisaged, I wanted to find a substitute for those fake river water objects that EA put in the China world, for my own custom world. And a rectangular water plane would do the trick! So thanks for making that work, zaide_chris!



Quote: Originally posted by SandrineD
it doesn't seem to like the rectangles.
when you get a chance let me know the tiling on the long thin one.
by that I mean following the last set of FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF... what are the next 2 values
eg 03 00 00 00 02 00 00 00

It has a lot of tiles, SandrineD! The values are 1E 00 00 00 0A 00 00 00. I attached them for comparison, the one called 'Infinite River.rar' is the one made without force single tile on the early version of zaide_chris' tool, so I guess that was using a spiral array? Anyway, if you compare that to the one pictured above, which is 'One Tile.rar' then you can see immediately that one is only 1kb, the other 51kb, so you can tell something went amiss! To clarify, both were made using the same parameters, as mentioned in my previous post:
y200
x1 100
z1 100
x2 1060
z2 420


Quote: Originally posted by TVRdesigns
you CAN fish on them, the animation is there and the buoy floats on the plane but you will NEVER catch anything. After discovering this, I tested EA's worlds, fished exactly where bridgeport and twinbrook's spawners were placed and its the same result.. so obviously, its unnavoidable.

Did they break this in a patch? I'm sure I've had sims catch fish from the Twinbrook dam before.
Screenshots
Attached files:
File Type: rar  Infinite River.rar (1.9 KB, 20 downloads) - View custom content
File Type: rar  One Tile.rar (284 Bytes, 25 downloads) - View custom content
SandrineD
Lab Assistant
#123 Old 23rd Aug 2011 at 12:25 AM
I know I said I wouldn't but I did anyway
finished off my own version
its a lot less idiot proof than chris's so if you fear hex use his

but the results are lovely
still with the purpled water

includes one square and one rectangular and both work A++
and no forced one tile

C'est la vie, they say, because they can't change their world, but, we can! That's why we have CAW! :rolleyes:
buxcosim
Lab Assistant
#124 Old 23rd Aug 2011 at 12:33 AM
My results so far...

I was attempting to create a square plane - 704 x 704 (22 tiles x 22 tiles) but it wasn't showing up in CAW. I'm using the 906 from Bridgeport, and the other two raised water planes (both from Bridgeport) are working fine. I didn't have time to play with it last night, but today, I'm going to try reimporting the 906 at the same time that I import the new 707 file (which I renamed to 707...004 so it woudn't conflict with the other two I was using) to see if that helps. I'm also going to go back and recreate the 707 and check the "force single tile" box, just in case that's part of the problem.

Quote: Originally posted by simsample
Did they break this in a patch? I'm sure I've had sims catch fish from the Twinbrook dam before.
I haven't played Twinbrook recently - too lazy to go back and add in all of the LN lots I need - but I remember catching fish in the small park on the central lake. I also - after upgrading and patching for Gen - caught fish in one of the raised planes in Bridgeport, but I haven't patched up for the latest stuff pack (don't see the point of them!), so maybe that's a new bug!
simsample
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retired moderator
Original Poster
#125 Old 23rd Aug 2011 at 12:41 AM
SandrineD, I'd be interested in testing out your tool, too, if you'd let me! (That sounded rude :o) Do you have a link/ download?

buxcosim, try just a single 707 with the 906 from Twinbrook. That will tell you whether it's a problem with your 707 or with the 906! I'm glad you remember the fishing working, I thought I was going mad!
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