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Replies: 23 (Who?), Viewed: 1313 times.
Banned
Original Poster
#1 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 7:36 PM Last edited by ScaryRob : 13th Feb 2015 at 8:09 AM.

This user has the following games installed:

Sims 2, University, Nightlife, Open for Business, Pets, Seasons, Bon Voyage, Free Time, Apartment Life
Default Wall Phones Won't Work (SOLVED, after considerable testing)
(Edit: Problem solved, see post #19, below)

I'm in the testing stages for a new Lot (planned for uploading) and have run into a problem I've never seen before. Well, two issues, actually. I asked about this yesterday in the Stupid Questions thread, but it seems to be a bit more involved, so I'm asking it here today.

Firstly, the wall phones aren't working. They ring if someone calls, but my Sims won't pick up and they can't make any outgoing calls. If I cue them to make an outgoing call, they merely touch a button (Beep!) on the phone and that is all.
The tabletop phones work fine.
Now, someone suggested this is a conflict with some CC I may have in my Downloads folder. I don't have much in the way of CC, but I removed some suspect material and it had no effect.
Then I noticed something odd that makes me think this is not caused by CC in my Downloads folder.
This is what happened: I moved my test Sims out of the Lot, which of course means they took all the furniture with them. Then I moved them back into the Lot and, lo and behold, after installing a wall phone they were able to use it normally (as well as a tabletop phone). In other words, when the Lot is devoid of all fixtures and furniture, the newly-installed phones work fine.
There is CC on the Lot, mostly build objects consisting of about 5 custom windows, 2 custom plants and 1 custom decorative object, all of which except the decorative object remained on the otherwise empty Lot after the test Sims had moved out (and then back in).
So this gives me the impression that there is actually something about the Lot itself, when it is fully furnished, that's causing the wall phones to not work.
(Yesterday, I also tried removing all CC from the Lot, piece by piece, and test the wall phones, but removing the items did not fix the issue.)

The second issue I've noticed on this Lot is that if my test Sims are swimming in the swimming pool and I tell them to take their car for a spin, they change into their everyday clothes while they're still in the pool. Then they get out and drive the car.
It is possible that this is not unique to this Lot, and may in fact happen all the time, since this may be the first time in which I cued Sims in a swimming pool to do an activity that required them to be dressed. I mean, normally, if I tell them to do something else while they're in the pool, they will go do it without changing clothes, like telling them to do something around the house. But since they have to leave the Lot in order to drive the car, they presumably have to be dressed, so in that case changing clothes while still in the swimming pool might be something that happens in everyone's game all the time.
Anyone else ever see this?

(I will test to see if this happen on any other Lot.)
Edit: Tested this with another Lot in another 'hood and it happened there too, so I'm guessing this is "normal" behavior. (In other words, another Maxis bug/glitch.)
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The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#2 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 7:47 PM
Are the handsets on the phones? If not, you can either hunt round for them or sell off the phone and replace (I think that works).

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Banned
Original Poster
#3 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 7:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxon
Are the handsets on the phones? If not, you can either hunt round for them or sell off the phone and replace (I think that works).

Huh? I was not aware that the handset could be anywhere but on the wall phones. Nor have I ever seen any Sims hunt around for a handset.
In any case, I'm pretty sure I sold and repurchased the wall phones during testing yesterday, which didn't fix it. Well, the wall phones never worked from the get-go, during my testing. Phone rang for the first time and they would not pick it up.
I'll go try again, to make sure.
Banned
Original Poster
#4 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 8:09 PM Last edited by ScaryRob : 13th Feb 2015 at 10:38 AM.
OK, how does a defective wall phone end up in a brand new, never occupied Lot?

Are/were the Maxis folks sadists in addition to being incompetent?
I just spent about 3 hours screwing around with this shit.
Shit like this gets me very close to chucking this POS game out the window.

(Thank you, Maxon. :lovestruc :lovestruc :lovestruc )

Seriously, how does a wall phone, sans handset, end up in a brand new Lot?
There is ZERO chance that my test Sims did it, as the pic above is from the Lot as taken straight from the Lot bin - never occupied.

(Note: Post has been edited to conform to a PG rating. )
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#5 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 8:24 PM
Is it one of your own lots or someone else's (or are you saying EAxis? - in which case POS is correct)? 'Cos if it's someone else's I'm guessing they play tested the lot before upload (which is considered bad form BTW).

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Banned
Original Poster
#6 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 8:38 PM Last edited by ScaryRob : 9th Feb 2015 at 9:34 PM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxon
Is it one of your own lots or someone else's (or are you saying EAxis? - in which case POS is correct)? 'Cos if it's someone else's I'm guessing they play tested the lot before upload (which is considered bad form BTW).

As I wrote in my OP, I'm testing a new Lot, so it's my own.
And, for the record, I test clones of my Lots, not the same files I upload.

So how can this possibly happen?
There is absolutely no way, no how, that I had a Sim on that Lot at any time prior to my test Sims yesterday. This is only the second of my Lots that includes CC and I've spent the last several days dealing with that. I haven't messed with Sims, playing or testing, for about a week prior to yesterday when I first put two test Sims onto the Lot.
I don't know where that defective wall phone came from, other than straight from the electronic objects bin, or it became defective just from me moving it around various places during the building process.

Am I pissed? I'm trying not to be...
Mad Poster
#7 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 9:46 PM
You have have a problem with your game outside of that phone for that phone works just find in a patched game.

You either have a mod/hack that effects phones.

When you build lots for upload you should use the AGS (if you can) making a clean and empty environment with no Maxis content and with as few EP/SP's to get it uploaded the safe way.

If you can't use the AGS then you need to make them using only the CC needed for it in your download folder.


ADDED: That photo in post #6 reminds me of my ADD days.

All my Beginning Hoods here at MTS. http://www.modthesims.info/member.php?u=7749491
All my Beginning Hoods as Shopping Districts plus Old Town. http://www.modthesims.info/download.php?t=523417
MooVille, a tribute to Mootilda and her fabulous lots http://www.modthesims.info/download.php?t=534158
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#8 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 10:43 PM
That's because it's the front of the Monster Manual.

Weird Rob - don't know what to say except maybe 'moving it around'. I've never seen that either.

Edit - or maybe not - the cover I remember is this:
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.co....n-treasure.html

Though this says it's the player's handbook:
http://www.davidlouisedelman.com/fa...x-appreciation/
I read that from cover to cover.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Née whiterider
retired moderator
#9 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 10:46 PM
You can pick up the handset independently of the base unit and move or delete it, so you might have done that by accident. Or perhaps a CC issue caused the handset to glitch and you hit Delete.

What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact.
Mad Poster
#10 Old 9th Feb 2015 at 11:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxon
That's because it's the front of the Monster Manual.

Weird Rob - don't know what to say except maybe 'moving it around'. I've never seen that either.

Edit - or maybe not - the cover I remember is this:
http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.co....n-treasure.html

Though this says it's the player's handbook:
http://www.davidlouisedelman.com/fa...x-appreciation/
I read that from cover to cover.


I have 4 complete sets of books/manuals for ADD and over 100 adventuring modules including the complete set of Dragonlance series.

All my Beginning Hoods here at MTS. http://www.modthesims.info/member.php?u=7749491
All my Beginning Hoods as Shopping Districts plus Old Town. http://www.modthesims.info/download.php?t=523417
MooVille, a tribute to Mootilda and her fabulous lots http://www.modthesims.info/download.php?t=534158
Banned
Original Poster
#11 Old 10th Feb 2015 at 12:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nysha
You can pick up the handset independently of the base unit and move or delete it, so you might have done that by accident. Or perhaps a CC issue caused the handset to glitch and you hit Delete.

I just tried picking up the handset by itself and it won't work. I'm thinking that's the most likely thing that happened, but how do you do it?
I do notice that when I pick up the entire wall phone, the body becomes luminescent, while the handset stays solid color.
I'm referring to the more expensive wall phone, btw, the one in the picture uptopic.
Banned
Original Poster
#12 Old 12th Feb 2015 at 5:14 PM
Nysha?
How do you pick up the handset by itself?

Also, Maxon, what made you conclude (correctly) that the handset might be missing and that I should "hunt around" for it? Is this something you've done?

I'm under the impression there are things I don't know about these phones.
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#13 Old 12th Feb 2015 at 8:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaryRob
Also, Maxon, what made you conclude (correctly) that the handset might be missing and that I should "hunt around" for it? Is this something you've done?
Firstly, the wall phones aren't working. They ring if someone calls, but my Sims won't pick up and they can't make any outgoing calls. If I cue them to make an outgoing call, they merely touch a button (Beep!) on the phone and that is all.

This is a fairly precise description of what happens when the sims have previously had a call and put the handset down without taking it back to the body of the phone.

What is odd about what you are describing is that it is usually an issue on lots that have been played (because it requires the sim to be dumb enough to put the handset down somewhere they shouldn't).

As for what's happened with your lot, I have this to say: I have no idea.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#14 Old 12th Feb 2015 at 10:04 PM
If you had move objects and were doing other things it's possible you picked up and deleted the handset part.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Banned
Original Poster
#15 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 2:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by joandsarah77
If you had move objects and were doing other things it's possible you picked up and deleted the handset part.

I deliberately tried that, but it wouldn't work. I also tried with snaptogrid off. I clicked all over the phone and nearby areas, I moved the phone around, but the handset would not separate from the body.
I'll mess around with it some more.

I can absolutely guarantee that no Sim set foot on that Lot prior to my two test Sims when I noticed the phone problem. I'm a Lot builder and I haven't actually played the game for about 2 weeks, other than testing.
I suspect there is some off-the-wall way (unintentional pun) that a handset could be separated from the body when in build or buy mode. I know I definitely moved that wall phone around a bit, trying out various locations, but nothing different from what I usually do.

I now wish I hadn't deleted the Lot with the missing handset. In fact, I'm wondering whether its still laying around somewhere on the Lot. Probably not, since I deleted that "defective" phone, but I wouldn't put anything past this satanic game.
Banned
Original Poster
#16 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 2:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxon
This is a fairly precise description of what happens when the sims have previously had a call and put the handset down without taking it back to the body of the phone.

I don't think I've ever seen that, in-game. I guess I've seen Sims finish telephone conversations when they were away from the body of the phone, but I guess I just always assumed that the handset would return itself to the body automatically.
So how do you find a missing handset, in-game? Is there a menu option that comes up that allows a Sim to look for it?
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#17 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 2:57 AM
If you click on the phone the sim will go find the handset. Usually it's on the floor somewhere nearby as sims don't walk too far from the phone base.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Banned
Original Poster
#18 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 3:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by joandsarah77
If you click on the phone the sim will go find the handset. Usually it's on the floor somewhere nearby as sims don't walk too far from the phone base.

Ahh, well you see, all this info is helpful because my test Sims did not find the handset when they tried to answer the ringing phone, nor when I tried to have them make an outgoing call. All they did was walk up to the body and press a button, which went "Beep!".

Is it any wonder I hate cell phones? I've never owned one IRL - and never will, if I can help it.
Banned
Original Poster
#19 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 7:47 AM Last edited by ScaryRob : 18th Feb 2015 at 4:22 AM.
(Note: I'm a player with all EPs and SPs installed.)

Problem solved!

After some more clicking around in build mode without any Sims on the Lot, I've discovered the How's and Why's of the disappearing telephone handset. Well, really only the How's. The Why's is anyone's guess.

This is going to sound somewhat complicated, but the bottom line is that players - especially Lot builders - only need to be aware of the issue to avoid the problem. And even if the problem occurs, the simple solution is to just delete the phone with the missing handset and install a new phone.
But it was worthwhile finding out the cause of this problem, even if it only occurs occasionally.

So, here is what I found:

Firstly, the problem affects both types of phones, both wall mounted and tabletop.
Secondly - and this is the weird part- it only affects copies of Lots that have been taken from the Lot Bin. In other words, if a player has started building a new Lot and has not ever had the Lot in the Lot Bin, the problem will not occur.
Likewise, if a Lot has been taken from the Lot Bin but the player has exited the Lot and then re-entered it, the problem will not occur. This is probably what happens most in the game, that once a Lot is placed in a neighborhood, players will repeatedly enter and exit the Lot during various playing sessions, so once this has happened the problem will not occur.
It only occurs during the first play session after a Lot has been taken from the Lot Bin and placed into a neighborhood.
Note also that once a phone has been sold and then repurchased the problem will no longer occur with that particular phone. It will still occur with other phones that might be on the Lot.
Note also that all tests were done with unoccupied Lots, as I do not keep occupied Lots in my Lot Bin because they cause neighborhood corruption.

Thirdly...here's what happens:

If, after a Lot is taken from the Lot Bin and the player has entered the Lot in build mode, a telephone is deleted (in any of a number of ways) or sold (by dragging it back into the Buy Bin) and the action is then undone using the Undo button, the handset will disappear.

Here are the four ways that I know of that a phone can be deleted:
1) You have a wall phone mounted on a wall. You remove the wall segment by pulling it away using the Ctrl Key and then undo this by clicking the Undo button. The handset will have disappeared.
2) You have a wall phone mounted on a wall and delete either the wall or the phone using the Sledgehammer and then undo the action using the Undo button. The handset will have disappeared.
3) You have a tabletop phone on a surface object (table, end table etc.) and you delete either the surface object or the phone using the Sledgehammer and then undo the action using the Undo button. The handset will have disappeared. (Note that surfaces cannot be sold with telephones placed upon them, so this method of removal cannot happen. The only way to remove a surface that has a phone on it is to Sledgehammer it.)
4) You have either a wall-mounted or tabletop phone and sell it, by putting it back into the Buy Bin, and then undo the action using the Undo button. The handset will have disappeared.

Note that if a phone is sold and a new phone is bought, the problem will not occur with that phone. (It will still occur with other phones on the Lot.)

It all sounds more dreadful than it is.
For one thing, the fact that no one reading this thread seemed to be aware of this problem, or at least not specifically what causes it, shows how infrequently it occurs. On the other hand, it's entirely possible that many people just don't like reading my threads.

To repeat: The problem only occurs during the first play session after a Lot has been taken from the Lot Bin and placed in a neighborhood and then only if a phone has been deleted or sold and the action is undone using the Undo button.

So, what happens to the missing handset(s)? Who knows. It disappears into the netherworld of cyberspace. I haven't seen any handsets laying about in any of my Lots, so I don't know where they are. Maybe under a couch cushion or in the fishtank. (I actually did look closely in a nearby fishtank in the Lot in question uptopic.)

The solution: Just be aware that whenever you delete or sell a phone and then undo the action using the Undo button, the problem may occur. Forget about trying to remember whether the Lot you're playing was taken from the Lot Bin, it's just too much to remember. This is a game, not work.
If you do notice a missing handset, or if your Sims are unable to use the phone and just walk up to it and press a button that goes "Beep!", like mine did, just delete the phone and install/buy a new one.
As stated earlier, I think this is an issue that affects mostly Lot builders, such as myself, since we almost always require several sessions to build a house and sometimes put the Lots into the Lot Bin for safe keeping and other reasons, only to withdraw copies of the Lot at a later time to finish working on them or to update them. This is when the problem will most likely occur.

And here is the proof of my tests. These are pictures of several telephones in houses I took from my Lot Bin from which I then deleted or sold the phones, or deleted the walls/surfaces they were mounted/placed upon, and then used the Undo button to undo the action, which resulted in the missing handsets. The pictures show the phones with the missing handsets. It happened every time the above procedure was followed, without exception.

Finally, anyone who wants to quickly test this issue themselves merely has to take an unoccupied Lot out of the Lot Bin, enter the Lot in Build Mode, delete or sell a telephone and undo the action using the Undo button.The result will be a missing handset. (Edit: I have no idea if the problem also occurs on occupied Lots that are taken from the Lot Bin, but most players will not have occupied Lots in their Lot Bins because they cause neighborhood corruption.)
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#20 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 8:33 AM
Interesting Rob, I'll have to keep this in mind when I am building. Thanks for the thorough test.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#21 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 11:39 AM
Actually, that kind of makes sense (in a weird twisted EAxis manner) and it is worth knowing about. Basically delete phones manually and/or don't undo the action. As the handset is a separate object what must be happening is something like - when told to undo, the game calls up the GUID for the phone but 'forgets' (i.e. was not coded to) call up the (linked) GUID for the handset. Basically, that's a coding error.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Banned
Original Poster
#22 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 5:45 PM Last edited by ScaryRob : 13th Feb 2015 at 6:37 PM.
After a couple more tests this morning, I had to edit my previous post because the problem in fact also occurs when a phone is sold back into the Buy Bin and the action is undone using the Undo button.
In other words, if a Lot is taken from the Lot Bin and a phone is removed in any way during the first play session and the action is Undone using the Undo button, the handset will disappear.
If, on the other hand, a phone is sold and a new phone is purchased, the problem will not occur with that phone.
Banned
Original Poster
#23 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 5:51 PM Last edited by ScaryRob : 15th Feb 2015 at 7:18 AM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxon
Actually, that kind of makes sense (in a weird twisted EAxis manner) and it is worth knowing about. Basically delete phones manually and/or don't undo the action. As the handset is a separate object what must be happening is something like - when told to undo, the game calls up the GUID for the phone but 'forgets' (i.e. was not coded to) call up the (linked) GUID for the handset. Basically, that's a coding error.

Yes, that logic makes sense, even though I have no idea what a GUID is.
The strange part, as I mentioned in my lengthy post above, is that the problem only surfaces during the first play session after a Lot is taken from the Lot Bin.
I also noticed that saving the game immediately after entering a Lot that was just taken from the Lot Bin will not prevent the problem from happening.

Crazy stuff.

ps- I actually very vaguely remember this problem surfacing some years ago and perhaps being discussed by some people. I'm referring to many years ago, back during the Maxis Exchange days , around 2004-2005 when I first played the game. I just seemed to have the image of a phone without a handset in my head prior to this recent issue.
ps2_ Then again, there have been/are other issues with phones, so maybe I'm confusing this with something else.
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#24 Old 13th Feb 2015 at 6:35 PM
A GUID is a code by which the game identifies it's different bits. It's a Unique Identity Number (hence the UID bit). Everything in the game that can be interacted with, animated, placed, sold, appear etc. etc. has a GUID - it's what the game uses to keep track of all that crap.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
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