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Mad Poster
#51 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 5:42 AM
I hate microtransaction games. I want to just pay for the game once and it's mine. How do people afford constant extra spending without going broke?
Undead Molten Llama
#52 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 7:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charity
I hate microtransaction games. I want to just pay for the game once and it's mine. How do people afford constant extra spending without going broke?


Well, it can go either way. Say you buy a game for 50 (of your local currency, whatever ). That's your cost, and that's all you ever put out. A lot of these mobile games are free but you might pay 1 or 2 of your local currency for something to have in the game, a feature or an object, it depends on the type of game. But in a lot of them, you don't necessarily have to pay anything. For instance, I have EA's "SimCity Build-It" on my tablet. It's a little game similar to SimCity, and you can spend real money in it to buy things to expand your city or speed up production of materials and products and stuff. I poke at it sometimes and then forget about it for months at a time, and I haven't paid any real money and don't feel a need to. But say you did decide to spend 5 real units of currency on something for a game. IF that's all you ever do, you're way ahead of the game vs. a game you pay 50 for. But, if you get hooked on the game and you play it for a while, you might over that "while" pay out 1 or 2 whatever 50 or 25 times, in which case you've spent the same amount of money as you would have for a game that cost 50, so you're no better or worse off. But, if you become an addict and you HAVE to have more and more stuff for the game and you end up paying 100s or even 1000s, then...Yeah, you've got a problem. I read relatively recently that someone went to jail for embezzling like a million dollars from his company and what he was primarily doing with the money was buying stuff for a mobile game called God of War, I think it was. I mean...I can't even imagine how you could possibly spend that much money on/in a game...but apparently you can. And whoever makes that game must be laughing all the way to the bank.

But anyway, I think if you have common sense and self-control, games with microtransactions are fine in you don't mind games with microtransaction. If you have no self-control or if you have anything like an addictive personality, then...Well, I'd steer clear in that case. Game publishers, of course, are relying on people with addictive personalities and/or little-to-no self-control.

THAT said, I'm old and curmudgeonly and prefer to plunk down my $50 for a game and be done.

I'm mostly found on (and mostly upload to) Tumblr these days because, alas, there are only 24 hours in a day.
Muh Simblr! | An index of my downloads on Tumblr.
Mad Poster
#53 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 7:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCad
Well, it can go either way. Say you buy a game for 50 (of your local currency, whatever ). That's your cost, and that's all you ever put out. A lot of these mobile games are free but you might pay 1 or 2 of your local currency for something to have in the game, a feature or an object, it depends on the type of game. But in a lot of them, you don't necessarily have to pay anything. For instance, I have EA's "SimCity Build-It" on my tablet. It's a little game similar to SimCity, and you can spend real money in it to buy things to expand your city or speed up production of materials and products and stuff. I poke at it sometimes and then forget about it for months at a time, and I haven't paid any real money and don't feel a need to. But say you did decide to spend 5 real units of currency on something for a game. IF that's all you ever do, you're way ahead of the game vs. a game you pay 50 for. But, if you get hooked on the game and you play it for a while, you might over that "while" pay out 1 or 2 whatever 50 or 25 times, in which case you've spent the same amount of money as you would have for a game that cost 50, so you're no better or worse off. But, if you become an addict and you HAVE to have more and more stuff for the game and you end up paying 100s or even 1000s, then...Yeah, you've got a problem. I read relatively recently that someone went to jail for embezzling like a million dollars from his company and what he was primarily doing with the money was buying stuff for a mobile game called God of War, I think it was. I mean...I can't even imagine how you could possibly spend that much money on/in a game...but apparently you can. And whoever makes that game must be laughing all the way to the bank.

But anyway, I think if you have common sense and self-control, games with microtransactions are fine in you don't mind games with microtransaction. If you have no self-control or if you have anything like an addictive personality, then...Well, I'd steer clear in that case. Game publishers, of course, are relying on people with addictive personalities and/or little-to-no self-control.

THAT said, I'm old and curmudgeonly and prefer to plunk down my $50 for a game and be done.


Once you've paid for an extra once it's too easy to do it again. I prefer not to be tempted. And I prefer games like Sims 2, where extra stuff you can get free from the community (or make yourself).
Top Secret Researcher
#54 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 1:25 PM
I don't think anybody on earth actively enjoys freemium games, they offer extremely shallow gameplay full of micro transactions and are just designed to exploit a need of instant-gratification. They are the McDonald's of Computer Games.

As for PC gaming. AAA PC-gaming is dying. Indie-PC gaming is thriving. And that's no skin of my knees, indie games can often be a lot more creative and innovative than AAA titles. Of course Indie-games and the culture around them have their own issues. That whole early-access stuff which I'm personally am not a fan of, or games simply not being finished or languishing in development hell for years and years due to lack of resources and manpower.

But well, it also has a lot of good things about it.

Avatar by MasterRed
Taking an extended break from Sims stuff. Might be around, might not.
Mad Poster
#55 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 2:16 PM Last edited by simmer22 : 22nd Jul 2019 at 9:46 PM.
I do play a few of the microtransaction games, BUT I don't give 'em money. If the playability is hampered in any way by not doing microtransactions to get on with the game, I don't see the point (I don't mind waiting for lives or bonus features that simplify the game). I did play the SimSocial game for a while on Facebook, but the further you got the worse the playability got, until it was unplayable, because none of my friends or relatives played it, or stopped after a short period of trying (you needed help to collect "important" stuff, or microtransactions, which I refused to do). I admit I've gotten hooked on a few Facebook games, but not to the point where I've paid to advance in the game. I simply see the lack of lives or resources in the game as a "get off this crap and do something sensible instead". It's no wonder these games are free to download and made to be very addictive, because once you do go beyond the step and give them money, if you don't have enough self-control, you risk spending a lot of money on absolutely no gain. You might as well throw your money out of the window, because that's how much use those microtransactions are, particularly in the games where you're paying for lives or bonus features that you end up using up almost immediately. It's a tiny bit different for games where you actually get something you can keep in the game (kinda like the TS3 store was), but a lot of these "microtransactions" aren't as "micro" as they pretend, some are actually quite pricy when you think about it - a dollar or two seems like a small enough sum there and then to not be a big deal, but do it enough times, and it quickly adds up to quite the sum.

When my old laptop slowly started fizzing out, it started really struggling with running Facebook, and this got me unhooked from several of the games I played (in addition to Facebok itself - I now only use it if I absolutely have to, which is birthday greetings and the occasional chat with a friend), which I in retrospect was probably for the best. Even without doing microtransactions, these games are highly addictive. I understand how someone can throw away a lot of money on these games if they first start, because if you've done it once, it's easier to keep doing it.

I still play Candy Crush and I admit I'm a little bit addicted, but not nearly enough to pay for it (I have a couple other similar games too, but I don't play them as much). I was unhooked from Candy Crush too, but did the mistake of downloading it to my tablet when I had a really boring week at the hospital, and got hooked again (but didn't connect it to my Facebook). At first just for fun, then trying (and succeeding) at beating my FB score, and maybe playing a bit too much (soon at Level 2300, which is a bit crazy since it's just been roughly 3 months since I installed it ) - but truthfully it's so much easier to beat than when I first played because you get a ton of free boosters. I've had several streaks with around 50-100 levels without losing lives, and I've beaten several levels with less than 3 swipes, so most of the levels aren't exactly challenging. Some I've beaten so fast I didn't even realize it at first. May even have beaten one while half asleep (I woke up to a finished level with no memory of actually beating it). The version I first played on Facebook was much harder and more tedious, and perhaps a bit less addicting, to be honest.

The mobile or FP games are usually based on the same 5-10 game setups, with the actual variation being in the graphics, and they're all quite empty - they're mostly about trying to do one or more tasks to beat a level, lock up new features, rinse and repeat.
Mad Poster
#56 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 6:53 PM
I play one game like that, cooking fever. But, I justify it by saying that I don't play online role playing games that one has to subscribe to monthly. Also, I'm almost done upgrading all the restaurants. After that I can save enough in game to buy and upgrade any new ones. It's the ONLY one I play and it's my secret vice.

"Fear not little flock, for it hath pleased your Father to give you a kingdom". Luke 12:32 Chris Hatch's family friendly files archived on SFS: http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?t=603534 . Bulbizarre's website: https://archiveofourown.org/users/C...CoveredPortals/
Instructor
#57 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 7:05 PM
I don't play any online or phone games.
Top Secret Researcher
#58 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 7:16 PM
I mean I play them occasionally when i have to go on a longer train journey or something. And I would lie if I said I have never done a purchase, but I've never played one for an extended amount of time or put a sizable amount of money in them.
But a thing just is with a lot of phone games you don't really get an immersive experience, and you can often literally see where they try to manipulate you into micro transactions. And a lot of them are very, very similar to each other, just painted in a different colour, so to say.On occasion they can be good to help me get through public transport, but overall they fall short on pretty much everything I expect from a game.

Avatar by MasterRed
Taking an extended break from Sims stuff. Might be around, might not.
Theorist
#59 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 7:49 PM
Smorbie that does sound possibly more interesting than the average app game.

When I have to wait I I go for a more old-fashioned approach and take along my crocheting or something like that. Only at the very start of a crochet project do I need my whole focus to get into the groove of the pattern but once it's started I can deal with distractions which makes it perfect for hauling along to appointments and such. Remember how Miss Marple always had a knitting project? It's because you can look busy and be productive while all the time you're being as nosy as possible.
Mad Poster
#60 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 9:55 PM
^ I miss the days when I was perfectly happy sitting down with embroidery or some or another crafting project (you know, back in the days when the most advanced cellphone game was a grey line eating black dots, if you even had a cellphone - I didn't get one all to myself until 10th grade, and it had a black and white pixellated screen. The one before that had one single line for texts, no games, and I had to share it with mom). I managed to locate most of my arts & crafts suppplies from my childhood and early teens a few days ago. That made me really happy. Found a lot of pre-packaged projects I hadn't even started yet, so perhaps some day I will.
Undead Molten Llama
#61 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 10:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orphalesion
But a thing just is with a lot of phone games you don't really get an immersive experience, and you can often literally see where they try to manipulate you into micro transactions. And a lot of them are very, very similar to each other, just painted in a different colour, so to say.On occasion they can be good to help me get through public transport, but overall they fall short on pretty much everything I expect from a game.


This is true now, yes. But that will change. Technology moves very, very fast, and there are things going on with, for instance, mobile computing and VR that are pretty amazing and certainly immersive and you won't be tied to a screen in front of your face, be it a computer monitor or a TV. You see it already with augmented reality. The tech's not quite there yet for inexpensive mass market purposes, and neither is the infrastructure, but the foundation is all there, so it won't be long. (Again, in the grand scheme of things. I'm not talking about next month. ) This is the sort of thing toward which the mass market is moving, toward freeing people from stationary screens (and not just for gaming, of course), and mobile devices -- mostly smartphones -- are, for better or worse, the intermediary.

As I said, there will always be people who will resist change, people who want to stay with the familiar, people who, in the specific case of gaming, will want a real, tangible screen in front of them and a real, tangible input device of some kind under their hands. Generally speaking, it will tend to be older people who are that way, but not always, of course. There is nothing wrong with being that kind of person, and this is the market to which smaller companies and independent groups/individuals can cater...until those niche markets disappear, at which point they will then move on to the next niche market that's been left behind by tech moving forward again. This is one of the functions that smaller companies fulfill; the other main one is that they're the ones on the very cutting edge, who have risk-taking owners/investors and who develop new stuff and sell it to people able and willing to pay for it. Large companies eventually suck up that stuff and make it cheaper -- often buying out those smaller companies -- and therefore available to more people. The large corporations are always going to be most interested in the mass market -- neither the cutting edge market nor the resistant-to-change market -- because that, of course, is where the most money is. Traditional PC gaming is becoming less and less mass market and more and more niche as time goes on, so like I said, that will become less and less the focus of the large game developers/publishers and more the focus of smaller/independent ones, so long as there is a large-enough niche market to support them.

I'm mostly found on (and mostly upload to) Tumblr these days because, alas, there are only 24 hours in a day.
Muh Simblr! | An index of my downloads on Tumblr.
Top Secret Researcher
#62 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 10:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCad
This is true now, yes. But that will change. Technology moves very, very fast, and there are things going on with, for instance, mobile computing and VR that are pretty amazing and certainly immersive and you won't be tied to a screen in front of your face, be it a computer monitor or a TV. You see it already with augmented reality. The tech's not quite there yet for inexpensive mass market purposes, and neither is the infrastructure, but the foundation is all there, so it won't be long. (Again, in the grand scheme of things. I'm not talking about next month. ) This is the sort of thing toward which the mass market is moving, toward freeing people from stationary screens (and not just for gaming, of course), and mobile devices -- mostly smartphones -- are, for better or worse, the intermediary.


Hey if it's a good game I don't care on what platform it is, mobile, handheld or PC with physical screen or VR. But right now in 2019, I haven't really found a mobile game yet that offers me immersion (unless it's a port of a PC/Console game) And here I'm not sure whether it's just the technology (several Final Fantasies are available on mobile, for example) but the design philosophy. Right now the bulk of mobile games I have seen seem to be very simple cashgrabs, similar to browser or facebook games (indeed many of them are also on mobile)
Sure, it's likely that in the future mobile phonesa nd tablet will be able to run more complex and graphically stunning games, but will the design philosophy change with that? Plus there's the smaller screen to think about. Though maybe the "gaming" mobiles and tablets of the future will have a functionality similar to the Nintendo Switch, where you can play on the small screen, or dock it to your TV and play on the big screen as well.
But right now the move to mobile seems, at least as far as I can tell, less motivated by consumer choice or technology, and more by game companies hoping to create more profit out of less effort (and the general dislike of many companies have for PCs as a gaming platform, due to the easy of game piracy on it)

With VR. Well yeah here I feel similar to mobile games. Right now, in 2019, there's not enough interesting games that exploit VR enough for me to justify the purchase price of a good headset. And, don't forget VR, like 3D movies, has already attempted to create a mass market several times in the past, and has failed time and time again, it's still open to see whether the current attempt will finally be the "winner".

Avatar by MasterRed
Taking an extended break from Sims stuff. Might be around, might not.
Instructor
#63 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 11:00 PM
VR is too expensive right now, but if it takes off it should keep the PC gaming going (Steam has pretty many VR games, not sure of the quality.)
Field Researcher
#64 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 11:27 PM
Very veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery interesting!!
Undead Molten Llama
#65 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 11:43 PM
I think we're kind of in a transitional period, at the moment. PC and console gaming are both a little past their peak; interest in both is falling as (the average, non-"gamer" adult) tends to want more portability, things they can do on the go to alleviate boredom or that they can hand to their kids to distract them when they're out and about. So, that's what mobile gaming mostly is right now, kind of the new GameBoy, to the point that it's becoming the mass market. The technology isn't there yet to have the sort of experience that you can have on a PC or a console, though, so that's where the "real gamers" still are and will probably remain for a for a while yet, until the tech is fully developed and "filters down," so to speak, to the point that it will be affordable to all (or most, anyway) gamers. But "gamers" aren't necessarily the mass market here. The mass market is the person who likes and plays games but isn't a tech-savvy, computer-nerd "gamer."

Basically, we're in a technology valley at the moment, and it's not yet clear what's going to make it up the wall of the valley first. But something will, eventually, and it will likely involve augmented or virtual reality in some way. Perhaps a small HUD headset that plugs into a mobile device but that doesn't fully obscure your view of the real world, or perhaps...Who knows? Cyber-implants. It's kinda wide-open at the moment, but the general trend is away from stationary screens...although as you said, there could be something that can dock with both. That would likely be how it would be while transitioning away from stationary screens, at least.

As for the "cash grab" and microtransaction thing...I don't know that that's going to last for too long, in the grand scheme of things. For the moment it makes money and virtually eliminates piracy, so they're milking it. But I'm betting on subscription services slowly taking over, probably with multiple plans you can buy into and the more you pay, the more you get. EA's already doing something like that through Origin, for instance. And, on a non-gaming front, Adobe led the way with its cloud-only software with subscription-service access to it. And before that, there were of course media streaming services like Netflix. Media publishers (including game publishers) like this model because, indeed, it circumvents the traditional kind of piracy nicely. So, I can see that being the sort of system that's going to develop more fully for gaming, especially as always-on internet becomes more available and affordable on a world-wide basis.

I'm mostly found on (and mostly upload to) Tumblr these days because, alas, there are only 24 hours in a day.
Muh Simblr! | An index of my downloads on Tumblr.
Mad Poster
#66 Old 22nd Jul 2019 at 11:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orphalesion
I mean I play them occasionally when i have to go on a longer train journey or something. And I would lie if I said I have never done a purchase, but I've never played one for an extended amount of time or put a sizable amount of money in them.
But a thing just is with a lot of phone games you don't really get an immersive experience, and you can often literally see where they try to manipulate you into micro transactions. And a lot of them are very, very similar to each other, just painted in a different colour, so to say.On occasion they can be good to help me get through public transport, but overall they fall short on pretty much everything I expect from a game.


A lot of them are similar. How many match three games do they think a person needs?

"Fear not little flock, for it hath pleased your Father to give you a kingdom". Luke 12:32 Chris Hatch's family friendly files archived on SFS: http://www.modthesims.info/showthread.php?t=603534 . Bulbizarre's website: https://archiveofourown.org/users/C...CoveredPortals/
Forum Resident
#67 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 12:40 AM
+1 for Cooking Fever! It's a great game. Sorry. I came here literally just to say that lol.
Mad Poster
#68 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 12:49 AM Last edited by simmer22 : 23rd Jul 2019 at 1:04 AM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smorbie1
A lot of them are similar. How many match three games do they think a person needs?


They're easier to make, I guess. Find a different wrapping (Bubbles, fruit, candy, pets, etc.), make up some new bonus features for when the player matches more than 3 items, and you're good to go with your Match-3-Items game number one million and one. They even make new games by simply renaming the old one and giving it a few different features, relaunching it as a new game (CandyCrush Soda, possibly one more).

Crossword games, Match 3, Create-a-farm, Pretend-to-Cook, HuntForItems (With/without MiniGamesIncluded), Sims1/Tycoon/Theme pretender, Dexterity games, and games where you place items that try to destroy other items (plants VS zombies kind of style) - these seem to be the ones repeating in the simple mobile/Facebook game pool.
Instructor
#69 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 1:30 AM
Match 3 and Hidden Object games suck. They are boring. Used to see them a lot on Game House. Stopped subscribing years ago. Went back with my new computer and was able to get the ones I played sometimes or would ever play back again.
Meet Me In My Next Life
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Mad Poster
#70 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 7:27 AM
I've been bouncing a lot of ideas off the game's creator and other supporters. Been even working on the idea documents... though some kinda shitshow went down today and I and most other editors are locked out due to some turd's immaturity.
Mad Poster
#71 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 12:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
I did play the SimSocial game for a while on Facebook, but the further you got the worse the playability got, until it was unplayable, because none of my friends or relatives played it, or stopped after a short period of trying (you needed help to collect "important" stuff, or microtransactions, which I refused to do).


I played and liked Sims Social. I even bought some stuff (not extra lives etc.; if I'm going to buy something I want it to be non single use, so I bought clothing or furniture (and wished that you could make your own, like in Sims 2 XD). But, of course, they pulled the game and anything you bought was lost.

That's another reason why I prefer games that you buy and can keep forever on your computer. And honestly, I don't see that as an old fashioned way of playing. You just can't get into a mobile game as much as something like Sims 2 and I will get years of use out of a game if I'm given the opportunity. I can see why that wouldn't be optimal for companies trying to sell stuff though lol. People these days are trained to have shitty attention spans.

As for Sims Social, my character there is now living in a converted boat in Bluewater Village with her 4 pets (I got over enthusiastic during pet week in SS and made 2/3 of the pets available XD). I think that's my house with the most animals. As the pets were all babies in SS my husky and lab now take up a lot more room too hehe.
Theorist
#72 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 5:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
^ I miss the days when I was perfectly happy sitting down with embroidery or some or another crafting project (you know, back in the days when the most advanced cellphone game was a grey line eating black dots, if you even had a cellphone - I didn't get one all to myself until 10th grade, and it had a black and white pixellated screen. The one before that had one single line for texts, no games, and I had to share it with mom). I managed to locate most of my arts & crafts suppplies from my childhood and early teens a few days ago. That made me really happy. Found a lot of pre-packaged projects I hadn't even started yet, so perhaps some day I will.

It's all about what you want to do. If you want to do crafty projects you will and if not oh well--those pre-packaged projects will still be there thirty years from now and then you can box them up and send them to a thrift shop. I've done this with a lot of my junk, things I had stashed for projects that I'll never manage to make because I spent too many years playing video games then I decided to help rid the world of the excess supply of acrylic yarn that's been being stuffed into closets for fifty years. So see? Priorities.

I think for me one of the reasons I have a hard time getting excited about video games is because by now I kind of feel like I've done it all--leastwise the types I like--almost to death. And of course I get so easily side-tracked anymore. I mean there I was playing TS2 when I decided I needed to build something, then that led to making some wall and floor coverings, then before I can get that finished I realize I need to do some more work on a big project, and for a break in that I end up throwing time here and there into a crowd-source project. I remember a time when I actually could focus on something for more than five minutes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charity
I played and liked Sims Social. I even bought some stuff (not extra lives etc.; if I'm going to buy something I want it to be non single use, so I bought clothing or furniture (and wished that you could make your own, like in Sims 2 XD). But, of course, they pulled the game and anything you bought was lost.

That kind of thing is always a turn-off for me. I have all my old games on discs, even the ones I've rebought from GOG for convenience sake. I have all my TS3 store stuff (I got what I wanted when I could get it from watching ads). They may take down the website but at least I'll still have my stuff.
Mad Poster
#73 Old 23rd Jul 2019 at 7:03 PM
^ I think my cutoff for buying stuff for a game goes with "do I get the actual files, or do I just get the item in the game, and lose it if the game no longer works?"

I'm in general a little bit skeptical to internet-only games, because there's a certain risk in whether you'll be able to play them some time from now. If you get an actual installer and the files, it's fine, but if it absolutely needs internet connection I'm a bit hesitant. I have all 3 Sims games I own as Origin now (had some issues with the last TS3 EP on my old laptop so I figured why not), but honestly I'd rather be without.

I have TS2 and TS3 as CDs, so I do have hard-copies and no-Origin versions of them, which means I can technically play those games even if Origin should crash and burn some amount of years back now - but I don't feel like I have that security with TS4 since it's Origin dependent. All the EPs (well, two) I have for TS4 came with the covers, but only the basegame had actual CDs, so I kinda felt a little cheated - in addition to the forced Origin, and the fact that one of the CDs didn't want to run on my old laptop so I had to "cheat" it a bit through Origin to make the game work.
Mad Poster
#74 Old 24th Jul 2019 at 5:32 AM
I have all the EPS on disks, even though I use the UC now. I still wonder if I should hunt down physical copies of the two SPs I only have digitally, but then I tell myself I'm just being paranoid and I have them in the UC.
Theorist
#75 Old 24th Jul 2019 at 4:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charity
I have all the EPS on disks, even though I use the UC now. I still wonder if I should hunt down physical copies of the two SPs I only have digitally, but then I tell myself I'm just being paranoid and I have them in the UC.

I would but that's just me hating on Origin and its ilk. On the one hand I figure it would take something pretty drastic for EA to close down Origin. On the other hand it is EA.
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