Replies: 22 (Who?), Viewed: 1194 times.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#1 Old 26th May 2020 at 9:00 AM
Default How to make bigger eyes with smaller iris/pupils, but prevent pixilation?
I've been trying to make a set of eyes for an anime character, so I made the eyes bigger, but the iris/pupils smaller to more closely rematch the character. I've tried both eye recolours and contact recolours, but they always end up looking pixilated when zoomed in, due to the bodyshop image file being so small. Is there a mod, or some method to have bigger eyes, but not having it look so pixilated? I've made so many attempts at it, and so far, this is the best I can manage. Is there a way to make the image file for bodyshop larger? I know if I make it bigger, it can no longer be read, so is there a way to edit the package file to make it readable if increase the image size? I've run out of ideas

Screenshots
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Instructor
#2 Old 26th May 2020 at 10:07 AM Last edited by vegan_kaktus : 26th May 2020 at 10:30 AM.
I usually never edit things through bodyshop, I always create the recolor file through bodyshop but then replace textures etc in SimPE so I apologize if I'm a bit clueless here. You say that if you make the bodyshop file (which I assume you mean the texture size?) bigger, the game won't read it. Is this related to bodyshop? If so, perhaps it's as easy as replacing the texture file in SimPE with a bigger texture size? I'll make a quick recolor of some eyes and try myself, I'll be back!

Edit: yep, it worked! I just made a new file in photoshop (size 1024x1024) made some eyes and then replaced the texture in the file in SimPE. If you want a more thorough explanation, let me know!

Animals are here with us, not for us.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#3 Old 26th May 2020 at 10:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegan_kaktus
I usually never edit things through bodyshop, I always create the recolor file through bodyshop but then replace textures etc in SimPE so I apologize if I'm a bit clueless here. You say that if you make the bodyshop file (which I assume you mean the texture size?) bigger, the game won't read it. Is this related to bodyshop? If so, perhaps it's as easy as replacing the texture file in SimPE with a bigger texture size? I'll make a quick recolor of some eyes and try myself, I'll be back!

Edit: yep, it worked! I just made a new file in photoshop (size 1024x1024) made some eyes and then replaced the texture in the file in SimPE. If you want a more thorough explanation, let me know!


Yeah, I don’t know why I didn’t think of that. I’ve done that with texture recolors for objects. Thanks for the help! I’ll see if that fixes my problem.
Instructor
#4 Old 26th May 2020 at 11:13 AM
We're all like that sometimes haha! Glad I could be of help (hopefully)

Animals are here with us, not for us.
Mad Poster
#5 Old 26th May 2020 at 11:13 AM
Not sure why that would work, as all face textures will automatically resize to 512x512 anyway. If you add a 1024x1024 to anything face related, it will still show the auto-generated 512x512 mipmap. It has to do with the skin - anything overlaying the face has to be 512x512 because the face is 512x512, so it really doesn't matter if the texture is bigger.

What I'm thinking is happening is that your Bodyshop may be generating too small textures due to not being set up properly, for instance 256x256. This would cause very pixellated eyes. This can be fixed by importing a DXT3 or DXT5 texture sized as 512x512 in SimPE (you need the Nvidia DDS tools for this - the Import or DXT1 options give a crappy result). Or even better - by fixing the problem in Bodyshop so it stops happening. I think it's an issue with GraphicRules in the CSConfig.

There is no point using 1024x1024 with face textures. Really. They sincerely won't work. Only way you can make them work is to size up all (and I really do mean all) face textures for all skins to 1024x1024. That's the only way they'll show properly. And then you may have problems the other way, with blurry 512x512 textures for pretty much 99.99% of beards, makeup, eyes, and whatever else you've got that's made for a 512x512 sized face (if it's just plain textures it tends to work, but then there's always that time when it doesn't, like every single time a bump map is involved with a skin texture - those things do NOT like uneven resizing...).

I had a lot of issues with this back when I wanted to make infant outfits better quality, and ended up having to size up the babies' skins to make them accept the larger sized textures. It was really the only way it worked. It's the same with all textures that overlay the skin (this is true for any TXMT that says SimSkin - it will only take on the largest texture of the largest skin textures available. SimStandardMaterial doesn't count because it doesn't overlay the skin)
Instructor
#6 Old 26th May 2020 at 11:16 AM
Ohhh haha, wooops. Did not know that

Animals are here with us, not for us.
Mad Poster
#7 Old 26th May 2020 at 11:37 AM
I'm not sure if this is very common knowledge, and I haven't seen a lot of other people talking about it.

It took me quite a lot of time to figure out back when I was doing a lot of experimenting with infant defaults. I was kinda desperate because I tried everything and those infant outfits came out blurry no matter what I did with the files, except for when I used a skintone changer with scaled up skins (it was that far back). After a lot of trial and failure I tried scaling up the infant textures in my default skins, and voila! The outfits suddenly looked perfectly sized. Later I noticed the bump map issue in some toddler outfits with 1024x1024 textures, and realized this was a problem too - because the outfits behaved perfectly fine when the textures and bump map were scaled down to 512x512 (which is the size of a toddler skin), and I think I tested out the theory with a 1024x1024 skin but got the problem in reverse with all bump maps now misbehaving because they were too small. I've done a bit of testing on faces and makeup too, and they seem to follow the same logic, not really wanting to show any bigger than the skin they were put on to.

It's possible you'd be able to get a slightly better detail level if you use a 1024x1024 texture despite the mipmap issue, in that the compression down to 1/4 the size could give a somewhat smoother result, but it depends on which result you want. Usually you don't get quite as good a detail level, or get a somewhat blurrier result.
Test Subject
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Original Poster
27th May 2020 at 12:56 AM
This message has been deleted by Natsumi.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#8 Old 27th May 2020 at 4:24 AM
This is what I've managed so far:

Here is a rough idea of what the eyes should look like:

And here is the texture file image that I've managed so far:

I've tried cutting out the eye from an image of the character, which looked really pixilated, so I ended up making it myself, which wasn't hard, but it still looks messed up and slightly pixilated due to the larger eyes. It's at least better than before now that I know how to use a larger texture image size, but does anyone have any suggestions on how I could make it look more accurate to the characters eyes, without pixilation? I've never attempted eyes before, I've more stuck to clothing and modding, so I'm new to this area

Thanks in advance!
Screenshots
Mad Poster
#9 Old 27th May 2020 at 12:03 PM Last edited by simmer22 : 27th May 2020 at 12:40 PM.
I did a bit of messing about in Photoshop just to test out a bit on detail level, and maybe you can use some of it. I haven't done any testing in Bodyshop, but I've left all the layers open for adjustments, removal, color changes, or any of the sort. Let me know if you need some other format (the layers are color adjustment layers with masks in Photoshop, regular layers in Gimp because for some reason mask layers don't translate well). I based the eye size off some defaults I have, so the iris is a tiny bit bigger than in the last one you posted. I think it can handle being sized down a little bit, though. I've left everything editable in the PSD. Also added a PNG file and a resized one (about the size of the one in your last post) so you can test it as-is.

For eyes, you're working down on a one-pixel level, so you need very fine details. I don't think you've said which program you're using to edit the eyes, but for any sort of fine-tuned edits, I'd highly recommend getting a program with some good tools. Personally I prefer Photoshop, but Gimp is a nice alternative, and there are other programs as well).
Screenshots
Download - please read all instructions before downloading any files!
File Type: zip Eye.zip (58.8 KB, 1 downloads) - View custom content
Test Subject
Original Poster
#10 Old 27th May 2020 at 9:45 PM
Thanks! I tried them out, and they look a lot better than anything I could ever manage, but they still end up looking slightly pixilated because the eyes are meant to be so large. Even contacts that use the face fakeup stretch with the eyes, so that didn't work for me either. Is there some other way to put the iris on the eyes, if I use a white eye, but not have it stretched by the larger eyes? Is there a way to put an accessory colored like the iris and place it over the eye location, or is that not possible for the game? Again, thanks for all of the help!


I tested out the eyes you made:

I also find that when I import the texture back into SimPE, it messes up the quality, which I think might be my biggest problem. I just click the import button, commit it, and it looks fine, but if I go to another part of the package, then back to the texture image, it looks slightly distorted. Is this normal, or am I doing something wrong?

I made a sim, which I submitted to this site, but because the character's eyes are meant to be bigger, it results in pixilation, which I was told to fix before I resubmit the sim. I feel like there is no real way around this, unless I was to remesh the head or something, which I have no experience in, and any attempt at meshing has ended in disaster.

And for the program I'm using, I'm using Gimp, but I only know very basic methods of using it. I'm probably the least artistic person on the planet
Screenshots
Mad Poster
#11 Old 27th May 2020 at 11:37 PM Last edited by simmer22 : 28th May 2020 at 12:21 AM.
I think it's the Import that does it for you. Import gives a rather crappy result and turns the prettiest textures into a pixellated mess.

I use DXT3 or 5 because it gives a much better result. It stays looking nice, and also updates the mipmaps (the small images), so you don't get any weirdness if you zoom out, especially on objects.

Enable DXT:
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/moo...impe-t1197.html

Recolor with DXT (ignore the default tutorial, it's the DXT parts you want) - step 4 to 6, then save your file.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/moo...simpe-t526.html

I added a file below you can test. I made a somewhat smaller version. It came out a little bit grainy in Bodyshop (happens occasionally, I think it may have to do with the colors used) so I replaced the texture with DXT3 in SimPE. Eyes are sometimes really picky with details...

As for drawing/painting in Gimp or Photoshop, it's something you have to practice to get good at. I don't practice much, but I know enough tricks to get by. It may occasionally seem I can draw stuff, but I really can't. I just keep poking at it until it vaguely resembles what I was after in a "trial and failure" kind of way, then poke at it some more, and at some point it looks enough like what I was trying to do, so I stop poking at it. Where other people pretty much do fancy oil paintings, I kinda get by with a hammer, a saw, a bucket of paint, and some masking tape... but eh - it works
(Color masking layers, marking tools, and an eraser - makes very adjustable and editable layers - handy tip for later)
Download - please read all instructions before downloading any files!
File Type: zip Theraven_NatsumiEyesSmall.zip (11.8 KB, 0 downloads) - View custom content
Field Researcher
#12 Old 28th May 2020 at 1:05 AM
Aw, don't be so hard on yourself, Natsumi. Drawing is hard!
To keep irises tidy, use the Ellipse Selection Tool to set up a Layer Mask. This will create a perfect circle, into which you can happily draw or shade or whatever, without getting blurry edges.
Any time you need really tidy edges, the selection and mask tools are going to be your best friend.

I could be wrong, I don't know if you made a custom outfit and skin that's also blurry: but It actually looks like your game might be running with low res textures as a whole. (The hair could be exempt from that, if it doesn't have associated low-res textures.)
What version of the game are you running?

Slightly separate from the texture thing, you might enjoy using one of the custom sliders from This Set.
It'll allow you to widen the iris, so that it can be more circular, even with the eyes opened that wide. That could be a style you dig, but just in case: that slider exists.

I dunno what this character is from, but it's a super cute design.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#13 Old 28th May 2020 at 5:22 AM Last edited by Natsumi : 28th May 2020 at 5:34 AM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
I think it's the Import that does it for you. Import gives a rather crappy result and turns the prettiest textures into a pixellated mess.

I use DXT3 or 5 because it gives a much better result. It stays looking nice, and also updates the mipmaps (the small images), so you don't get any weirdness if you zoom out, especially on objects.

Enable DXT:
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/moo...impe-t1197.html

Recolor with DXT (ignore the default tutorial, it's the DXT parts you want) - step 4 to 6, then save your file.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/moo...simpe-t526.html

I added a file below you can test. I made a somewhat smaller version. It came out a little bit grainy in Bodyshop (happens occasionally, I think it may have to do with the colors used) so I replaced the texture with DXT3 in SimPE. Eyes are sometimes really picky with details...

As for drawing/painting in Gimp or Photoshop, it's something you have to practice to get good at. I don't practice much, but I know enough tricks to get by. It may occasionally seem I can draw stuff, but I really can't. I just keep poking at it until it vaguely resembles what I was after in a "trial and failure" kind of way, then poke at it some more, and at some point it looks enough like what I was trying to do, so I stop poking at it. Where other people pretty much do fancy oil paintings, I kinda get by with a hammer, a saw, a bucket of paint, and some masking tape... but eh - it works
(Color masking layers, marking tools, and an eraser - makes very adjustable and editable layers - handy tip for later)



Thanks again! I tried that out and the eyes I made before turned out a lot better! They still don't look perfect, but I honestly don't think it's possible, at least for me, to make them any better. I just hope they accept it this time, because it's been a week wait each time I submit something, due to everything going on in the world.

And that's the way to do it, there's no proper method, just whatever works, eh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlfredAskew
Aw, don't be so hard on yourself, Natsumi. Drawing is hard!
To keep irises tidy, use the Ellipse Selection Tool to set up a Layer Mask. This will create a perfect circle, into which you can happily draw or shade or whatever, without getting blurry edges.
Any time you need really tidy edges, the selection and mask tools are going to be your best friend.

I could be wrong, I don't know if you made a custom outfit and skin that's also blurry: but It actually looks like your game might be running with low res textures as a whole. (The hair could be exempt from that, if it doesn't have associated low-res textures.)
What version of the game are you running?

Slightly separate from the texture thing, you might enjoy using one of the custom sliders from This Set.
It'll allow you to widen the iris, so that it can be more circular, even with the eyes opened that wide. That could be a style you dig, but just in case: that slider exists.

I dunno what this character is from, but it's a super cute design.


I have the game running in high resolution, the fur skin I used and edited looks like that up close, but they didn't seem to have an issue with it. I'm not even gonna try to make a skin for scratch, I'd probably have a meltdown or something My laptop only allows me to play that game at 1600 x 900, so I don't know if that makes a difference at all. I'm not sure of the game version, but I have all of the expansion packs and everything.

And omg thank you! That helped a lot! If I package the sim, when other people download it, will they need to have that slider installed in order for it to display properly, or will it look the same in their game even if they don't have it?

And as for the cloths, there was a default top and bottom that were fairly close to her outfit in the anime, so I edited the image file created by Bodyshop (this was before I learned I could replace the texture in the package file). I used Gimp, and they turned out fine, but now that I know I can do it in the package file and use a larger texture image, I might redo those as well.

And she's from BNA: https://myanimelist.net/anime/40060/BNA.




So, to both of you, what do you think of how the eyes turned out in the screenshots? Do you think this site would accept it, or do you think I'll have to work a bit at it? Eyes seem impossible to make perfect, at least for the Sims 2. I don't know anything about the Sims 3 or 4, I only played the Sims 4 for maybe 30 minutes.




Here are the eyes from submission, which are clearly too big, way too pixelated, and a train wreck. I'll probably end up redoing a bunch of things to other parts, but that won't be an issue. I just need to get these eyes to work well enough for it too be acceptable for upload.

Original eyes:
Screenshots
Mad Poster
#14 Old 29th May 2020 at 4:14 PM Last edited by simmer22 : 29th May 2020 at 10:37 PM.
Just a tip, but make sure your graphic settings are properly done - sim/object to high, texture detail to high. You may want to take a look at those Bodyshop textures again. If skin-applied textures come out at smaller than 512x512 (face/scalp/eyes/makeup/PU+BU body) or 1024x1024 (body CU and up) you may have to fix your Graphics Rules settings, as these could cause Bodyshop to output lower-res textures. It's also possible they could be outputting lower-res textures in your game, too. I did test the eyes in Bodyshop when I made the package file, and they did look a bit more detailed.

I'm kind of seeing it on the jacket VS the hair. The hair does have a higher resolution due to the fact it's not a skin texture and therefore manages to go around the skin problem, but the jacket (I'm guessing it's just a regular "body" mesh with texture applied directly to the skin) is a bit blurrier than I'm guessing it normally would be, possibly using the 512x512 map instead of the 1024x1024 map. The eyes could be using the 256x256 texture. I'm not sure, but it could explain a few things. The face texture isn't blurry enough to be using 256x256, though. There is a very noticeable mismatch between the skin/jacket and the face, which shouldn't be happening if the game is using the properly sized textures.
Field Researcher
#15 Old 29th May 2020 at 9:31 PM
Nice! It's definitely coming along!

Yeah, in the Sims 2, all of a sim's "genetic" data is stored privately: the slider isn't required for downloaders.
TS2 Sliders are actually just mesh manipulations, and the game instantly forgets/doesn't care which ones you've used (which is why you can jump between bodyshop tabs to repeatedly max out a slider and get huge eyes and such.)

Thanks for jumping in on the graphics thing, Simmer. I couldn't quite remember which details to look at.
Yeah, it's texture detail I was thinking of. I can't tell what's going on with the jacket vs the face texture. Such mixed messages. :P

Can you check if these settings are maxed out, and showing your textures in their full glory, Natsumi?
Screenshots
Mad Poster
#16 Old 29th May 2020 at 10:23 PM Last edited by simmer22 : 30th May 2020 at 2:08 AM.
Just so we're on the same page and all, this is the package file I posted above (Theraven_NatsumiEyesSmall.zip), as seen in Bodyshop. It should look pretty much identical to this ingame if your settings are alright and your game is handling textures like it's supposed to.

And yes, I did go a bit berserk with eye sliders on that poor woman...

It is a bit pixellated, mostly because I scaled down the original texture I made quite a bit. The original size would've been less pixellated (test out all you like). I also replaced the texture in SimPE (DXT3) because Bodyshop took the poor thing to the wringer with some added pixellation - it sometimes does for whatever reason.

It's the same eyes, just different sized eyeshape on the woman. Just in case it's unclear.

...

And add-on to my last post:
Screen resolution isn't the same as making sure the graphic settings are properly done. It could be your Graphic Rules settings aren't properly set and think a new-ish graphic card is a low-end card (even if it may not be) and forces low-end graphics. Basically the card/chip and the game doing a stupid together. Happens all the time these days with an old game trying to run on 5-15 years younger high-end graphic cards and chips the game can't auto-recognize without some startup help.
Screenshots
Field Researcher
#17 Old 29th May 2020 at 11:49 PM
Ah! Good test.
Yeah, those eyes are hypnotic. Ha!
(I've somehow gone this whole time without realizing who you are. Should have noticed "Little Fire Burning". Hey Theraven! Fancy meeting you here! xD)
Mad Poster
#18 Old 30th May 2020 at 1:54 AM Last edited by simmer22 : 30th May 2020 at 3:50 PM.
Hi there

My clever disguise is apparently working (see avatar)

(This is a very old username from my "I need a username and have no imagination" days. By the time I wanted to change, Theraven was already taken here on MTS, so this one kinda just stuck around).
Test Subject
Original Poster
#19 Old 30th May 2020 at 5:53 AM
I checked my settings, and I do have them set to high. For the jacket and skin, I just edited the texture file created by bodyshop, and not the one in the package file, so that is most likely the problem. I'll see if redoing them using the package texture will make a difference. I'm running the game on a laptop that has integrated graphics, rather than an actual graphics card, so I don't know if that could also be an issue. So for graphics rules, would that be the in game settings, or would that be referring to something I'd need to check with my graphics card itself?

I made another attempt at the eyes, and used the iris width adjuster. I made the image file 1024x1024, and imported it using the DXT method you mentioned, which already made a big difference.






I checked the size the skin and clothing are using, and it appears to be be using 512 x 512 because that's the size of the image bodyshop generated in the projects folder. I made them before I realized I could change them in the package file. I'll just have to redo them using a higher res image from the package file rather than the image generated by bodyshop, so that should hopefully solve that issue.

The only other issue I'm having that isn't eye related, or resolution related is the back of the hair.



The black tips on the sides of the hair also appear on parts of the back, as seen in the image. I assume the hair uses some of the same parts for the sides as it does that back. I couldn't really find any way around it, so I tried to keep it to a minimum. I don't know anything about creating a new hair or anything, so I'm not sure if there is a way to change or set which part the back of the head uses for the hair texture. I'll probably worry about that after I get everything else sorted out.
Screenshots
Mad Poster
#20 Old 30th May 2020 at 4:01 PM
There's the GraphicRulesMaker you can try: https://www.simsnetwork.com/tools/graphics-rules-maker
Video going through the steps: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TMmVE51uf4

(If you have Windows 10, you may want to try copying the needed files to your Desktop and running the program on them there, as Windows 10 doesn't always allow for changes directly in the programFiles folder - I had to do that).

These two files, found in the Config folder. When you're done, you can copy the files over to the CSConfig folder, which is where Bodyshop pulls its information from.
-Graphics Rules
-Video Cards

Game:
C:\Program Files (x86)\(wherever your latest EP is, mine is M&G since I have the UC)\TSData\Res\Config
Example: C:\Program Files (x86)\Origin Games\The Sims 2 Ultimate Collection\Fun with Pets\SP9\TSData\Res\Config

Bodyshop:
C:\Program Files (x86)\(wherever your latest EP is, mine is M&G since I have the UC)\TSData\Res\CSConfig
Example: C:\Program Files (x86)\Origin Games\The Sims 2 Ultimate Collection\Fun with Pets\SP9\TSData\Res\CSConfig

The program does take backups of the files for you, so if it doesn't work as intended, you can always replace the new files with the backup files and have it back the way it was.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#21 Old 31st May 2020 at 5:40 AM
I tried it out and it seems to have made a little bit of a difference in game. I'm also running the game on Windows 10. It takes forever to actually start the game, like at least 5 minutes for it to actually boot up after I click the icon on my desktop. Bodyshop doesn't take as long, but it still takes it's time to start. It would probably be easier to play The Sims 3/4 on Windows 10, but I was never really a fan of them for some reason.


Again, thanks for all of the help!
Mad Poster
#22 Old 31st May 2020 at 2:33 PM
Bootup can occasionally be a bit slow (clicking icon to first splash screen appears), and can for some take up to 5 minutes - but usually the game icon will show somewhere in the taskk manager, so the game is loading in the background.

Loading time (splash screen to neighborhood selector screen) depends on amount of CC, possibly neighborhoods, and various other things.

Bootup for Bodyshop (clicking icon to anything appearing on the screen) tends to be dependent on amount of CC, and usually takes a few minutes extra on the first run after a PC bootup. Second run tends to be much faster (I've had it loading for 30+ minutes with 10-15 GB of CC, then maybe 3-4 minutes on second bootup).

Bodyshop and the game will usually load and/or boot up faster if they've already booted up once before during the same bootup of the machine, and will be slower after rebooting the machine. Deleting the cache files can also cause the game to boot up a bit slower (but can also cause other problems).
Test Subject
Original Poster
#23 Old 4th Jun 2020 at 3:43 PM
I almost never turn my laptop off, I assume it starts up slower because I'm running it on Windows 10, and downloaded a cracked version of the game, so I play it without a CD. I own all of the expansion packs, but I have no clue where they are in our storage room, so downloading it just seemed easier
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