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Test Subject
Original Poster
#1 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 2:57 PM
Default Sims 2 and Sims 3 (future) custom content
Hey this is my first time posting in this forum, let alone any forum at all and I doubt that my posting will continue on but that is besides the point.

not sure if this has been discussed by the way so feel free to delete the post if it has.

while the sims 3 may be cartoonish and boring at the moment think of the possibilities and potential it has in the near future concerning custom content.

the sims in the previous game went from this:
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/s...dc/Bella1&2.png
to this:



thanks to custom content


so in the sims 3, sims can go from this:



to maybe something like this:



(imagine it was a render not a drawn photo in photoshop :p)

it is a possibility in the near future and i'm definitely excited to see what custom content creators can really do!


any thoughts or opinions on the matter?
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Theorist
#2 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 3:40 PM
Anything is possible, but I think the in-game lighting would need some tweaking first.
It's not difficult to make sims look good in Sims 3 CAS, but they look completely different in the game... blotchy, less detail, overly contrasty, sometimes even creepy, makeup looks like bruises, etc. I almost think it's pointless when people post CAS shots because the sim almost NEVER looks like that in the game (except during Change Appearance). Although yes, with the right textures and LIGHTING, Sims 3 sims could look really good. Hopefully future expansion packs or patches will result in some changes to the in-game lighting.

Resident wet blanket.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#3 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 9:44 PM
even though that may be true it does not change the fact that the sims are made up heavily with downloaded custom content which creates a signficant difference in appearance in comparison to maxis made sims. it's just interesting to see that it could and most definitely happen to the characters and plus people were complaining about how ugly the sims are in sims 3 but looking back now at the sims 2, the sims also looked horrendous.


I guess people have a hard time waiting :P
Instructor
#4 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 10:23 PM
I'm keeping my fingers crossed. There are a lot of talented creators out there and I am sure they will tweak it all in time. Which is the main issue, time. Nobody wants to wait, myself included. XD

^_^
Test Subject
Original Poster
#5 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 10:37 PM
patience is a virtue i guess

i just wonder how they are going to do it. i mean the first skin custom content gets written over the first one right? hwo is anyone going to create multiple skintones and textures if there isn't an option for custom skintone? just keep replacing the file over and over again? what if one wanted to try two different skintones on one sim.....sorry i'm not really all too familiar on how custom content is created in the first place.

it will probably take over the course of maybe 2-4 years to get the sims in the 3rd game to match the quality of the custom content of the second one at it's best.
Test Subject
#6 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 10:47 PM
Yea, honestly, more people should look at the first picture, then try to complain about TS3 characters looking cartoony.
Field Researcher
#7 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 10:59 PM
(Heavily manipulated) Pictures of beautiful people... So what?

I don't want another fest of ideal puppets like in basically anything that you don't see with your own two eyes, whether it be TV, movie or magazine. I'm honestly fed up with this extreme lust for ideal perfection.


What I would like CC creators to create are textures that portray a much more realistic picture of people. Imperfect complexions, little bumps and pimples, birthmarks, oily skin, irregular beards, pores, rashes, different rates of pigmentation on enclosed parts of the body (e.g. neck), scratches, little wounds, red cheeks, etc. etc. Something to make my Sims truly unique and therefore individually beautiful.

I don't call for an extreme realistic portrayal of humans, as that would not be benificial for the sake of any virtual entertainment. But perfect skin and absolutely symmetrical faces are not reality either.

That last picture that you have shown is less close to reality than TS3 is. That's not how people look. Even women have hair in their faces.
Instructor
#8 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowKat
Yea, honestly, more people should look at the first picture, then try to complain about TS3 characters looking cartoony.


I can and will. I played Sims 2 for a great long while with no mods at all. No custom hair, no custom skin, nothing and I was fine with the way the models looked. The models for Sims 3 have something weird going on that makes them look not quite right, some people describe it as "pudgy". I don't know if it's inherent face fat or what, but I don't find the Sims 3 models as appealing.
Test Subject
Original Poster
#9 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 11:25 PM
[reply to theShady, sorry i forgot to press reply and i don't know how the quote thing worked and i'm too lazy to delete this so i will edit it =p]


unfortunately the mass whether it bothers you or not-want perfection, not sure of the statistics but i'm pretty sure the majority of players don't want bruised up sims who are undeniable reflections of their own imperfections =/
people want to indulge in the fantasy of beauty, that's the appeal of such game is it not?

sure people will get bored and annoyed by the perfection of the sims and there will be
creations of unique, individual looking sims that truely reflect the realitistic features on one's face. but those requests are few and far between and fails in comparison to the amount of demand for ridiciously perfect sims.

sims 2 custom content is a great reflection of what people are looking for because how many ugly or "normal" sims and pimples, blotches, scars were created in comparison to celebrity and cosmetics?

it's great to think of that as well i like that point of view as well
so maybe you,or anyone else on this forum, can show other pictures of a possible 'outlook' of the sims?
Lab Assistant
#10 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 11:44 PM
I'm not sure what people are complaining about. I don't find the sims overly beautiful but I like that. It seems more real to me than perfect sims or even no-cc sims 2 where you had monkey faces or giant noses. (thank goodness for face templates) I haven't seen any blotchy skin or makeup that looks like bruising so far. And I like the weight slider, I think the chubby sims are cute. :D
Test Subject
#11 Old 15th Jun 2009 at 11:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by alyria80
I can and will. I played Sims 2 for a great long while with no mods at all. No custom hair, no custom skin, nothing and I was fine with the way the models looked. The models for Sims 3 have something weird going on that makes them look not quite right, some people describe it as "pudgy". I don't know if it's inherent face fat or what, but I don't find the Sims 3 models as appealing.


By all means, if you want to play your sims without things like eyelashes, irises that are 1 shade instead of many, and hair that looks like it was made out of yarn, go right ahead. But to say that TS3 sims aren't an improvement over base TS2 sims is a ridiculous statement. The evidence is in the very first post.
world renowned whogivesafuckologist
retired moderator
#12 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 12:11 AM
I think a lot of the issue that people have with Sims 3 sims is the "uncanny valley" factor. They are much more realistic than TS2 - but in a kind of creepy, wax doll-like way. TS2 sims, even when loaded with custom content, were still unrealistic enough in style that they weren't, well, freaky. But TS3 sims have gotten closer to realism in a way that can be a little unsettling - that is, uncanny valley.

Once we have more control and can modify things a lot better, I think we'll be able to fix that. Lighting is a big thing - pixellation on skins and the huge mismatch in appearance from Create a Sim vs. the game's lighting and rendering itself... And to reduce the shadowing that happens on sims when they're in less than bright light, making any sim that's wearing blush look like they've gotten beaten. Plus the addition of facial texturing elements so you can add more realistic beauty marks, freckles, nose masks, etc....

In terms of completely vanilla game, I way prefer the look of TS2 sims. They may be bland, but at least they're not creepy.

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Test Subject
Original Poster
#13 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 12:36 AM
i'm sort of interested by wax-doll like figures or sort of creepy things, i'm a horror movie fan =p and those "uncanny valley" robots are creepy; look up genpets( it's a hoax but still a possibility in the near future)

has anyone played the movies by lionhead studios?

the sims kind of look like the actors and actresses if you maybe turn their heads 3/4ths view
the sims look more polished with less wrinkles and a more "plastic" smooth sort of look

maybe if someone finds a better picture

ok off topic lol
Instructor
#14 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 1:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowKat
By all means, if you want to play your sims without things like eyelashes, irises that are 1 shade instead of many, and hair that looks like it was made out of yarn, go right ahead. But to say that TS3 sims aren't an improvement over base TS2 sims is a ridiculous statement. The evidence is in the very first post.


It's an opinion. I like the T2 models better. How can my tastes be "ridiculous"? I didn't say I like raw worms over steak.
Test Subject
#15 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 2:23 AM
All I'm saying is that TS3 base models are a graphical upgrade (hence the word "improvement") from TS2 base models. To say that they aren't isn't the ridiculous statement. To say you prefer TS2 models is an opinion, nothing more. But it's hard to ignore the obvious differences between the two screenshots, but it seems that's all people are doing.
Test Subject
#16 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 3:28 AM
I think that, a little while from now, a better custom skin and or hair will come out, lighting will be revised or people will just accept it.

And then people will, once again, be happy with their little simlings.

Personally, I think mine are hawt as is.
Lab Assistant
#17 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 4:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anmlvr102
i'm sort of interested by wax-doll like figures or sort of creepy things, i'm a horror movie fan =p and those "uncanny valley" robots are creepy; look up genpets( it's a hoax but still a possibility in the near future)

has anyone played the movies by lionhead studios?

the sims kind of look like the actors and actresses if you maybe turn their heads 3/4ths view
the sims look more polished with less wrinkles and a more "plastic" smooth sort of look

maybe if someone finds a better picture

ok off topic lol


I have to say, I'm pretty happy with my little TS3 simmies now that I've seen THAT picture. xD
I'm gonna have nightmares...
Test Subject
Original Poster
#18 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 4:09 AM
lol imagine all that custom content and all it does is make the sims look even creepier xD then while you're playing the sim stares right at you for like 5 minutes (kind of like in the sims 2....)

now THAT will give you nightmares...
Theorist
#19 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 7:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by saphfire27
I haven't seen any blotchy skin or makeup that looks like bruising so far. And I like the weight slider, I think the chubby sims are cute. :D


You haven't? Here is an example of what I mean:


On the left, she just has the lightest pink blush. You can see on her pie menu face, it's real subtle. However, her in-game pic, the blush looks like someone beat her. Top right shows the weird lighting giving her skin a doughey appearance. Her pie menu face looks sooo much better. Bottom left shows there's too much light contrast giving her a creepy look, makes me think of when someone shines a flashlight on their face to tell ghost stories.
Most of the time it's much worse, it's just harder to capture a good example when I deliberately set out to. The in-game lighting needs adjustment before the sims can look good, but that's just my opinion.

Resident wet blanket.
Field Researcher
#20 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 1:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HystericalParoxysm
I think a lot of the issue that people have with Sims 3 sims is the "uncanny valley" factor. They are much more realistic than TS2 - but in a kind of creepy, wax doll-like way. TS2 sims, even when loaded with custom content, were still unrealistic enough in style that they weren't, well, freaky. But TS3 sims have gotten closer to realism in a way that can be a little unsettling - that is, uncanny valley.


Thanks for mentioning that phenomenon's name.

And I agree. :D


It reminds me of the Source engine's facial expression systems. They incorporated many many muscles that can be moved in Half-Life 2: Episode 1. But they reached a certain point where many of character's facial expressions seemed extremely weird and creepy. In Half-Life 2: Episode 2, they found the right balance and facial expressions look so very natural and realistic. However, if those virtual people would have absolutely realistic facial expressions, it would ultimately seem extremely repulsing as the models still are obviously virtual and animated.
Inventor
#21 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 1:42 PM
[off topic]

mhh I think I just found the title for the next Sci-Fi novel my Sim is going to write...

[/off topic]

The Grumpy Old Gamer's Blog

~Life is like a box of chocolates, just when you're enjoying it, you choke on it.
Test Subject
#22 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 3:28 PM
Haha I don't know about you guys but I agree with anmlvr102! I personally could never play with the original sims from Sims 2 without any custom content..I think they look ridiculous :P
And new custom content doesn't mean perfect, airbrushed sims like in the example from the 1st post. In Sims 2 you could have them look perfect or you could make them realistic and interesting, and I hope we can have custom content like
that for Sims 3!!
Lab Assistant
#23 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 4:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GnatGoSplat
However, her in-game pic, the blush looks like someone beat her.

Reeeeeeally going to have to disagree with that. Hollywood bruises are fake and look nothing like the real thing. That picture doesn't look like a battered woman at all.....
Test Subject
Original Poster
#24 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 5:40 PM
actually i don't mind the sims 3 looks. there are ways to make them appear less cartoony like minimize the eye size so they don't look like aliens or from some anime show, don't create ridiciously large noses, mouths, ears, etc, unless you want to make them look cartoony and by all means go ahead =) no need for custom content.

i never honestly thought the sims were gorgeous when playing the sims 2 base game with no custom content, in fact it was hard for me not to cringe at them.

if created and modified correctly in the CAS in the third sims, they can turn out gorgeous without custom content, but then again that's my own personal appeal =p


the only reason the sims 2 ever looked better than the sims 3 is because of all the custom content.
Theorist
#25 Old 16th Jun 2009 at 5:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AyaJulia
Reeeeeeally going to have to disagree with that. Hollywood bruises are fake and look nothing like the real thing. That picture doesn't look like a battered woman at all.....


Okay, okay, so I was exaggerating!
My point is there's something really wrong with the lighting in game. There's no reason subtle blush should ever show up blackened. Here's a pic (albeit, a small one) that probably illustrates the problem better.

Resident wet blanket.
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