Dear simmers,

I have a fairly "old" neigbourhood where, sadly, some gliches are creeping in... I tried searching for this, but I don't think I've ever seen an identical problem described - and solved - so bear with me, and, of course, feel free to point me to a solution, if there is one.

For some time now, the neighbours from apartment units are invisible - I don't mean by this the flatmates, but the neighbours from the other units in the building. I can tell they're still there, because for instance, if I throw a party and it starts getting too late, they come and ring the door bell... Only, they're invisible, and hence I cannot interact with them.

Sometimes I'll hear the noise of dialogue between neighbours, and the elevators will go up and down, but the neighbours are not visible and not selectable. This extends to if I try to throw a building party, for instance - hence I've stopped throwing those...

From what I remember, what happens if I try to visit them (I've given up on this some time ago, so am not really sure about this anymore) is that I can actually see them, but then when I leave the apartment the unit won't go back into darkness, but rather stay lit - sometimes with furniture, sometimes without - and the neighbours will also stay visible in the apartment, but of course I can only interact with them again if I go back into their apartment. If I try to ask them to come out of the apartment and talk to me, they're just invisible, as per usual.

I know it probably sounds like I have a fairly corrupt 'hood and I know this might be the case - although I try to keep it as clean as possible, do 'Hood Checks, etc, I know I made mistakes way back when I started playing it - but it's a neighbourhood I love and I'm not ready to give up on it, or rebuild it again, at least at the moment, as I have lots of families and buildings I put quite some effort into, and it would take me quite some time to start it all from scratch...

Any suggestions as to how I can try to tackle this? Thanks in advance and happy simming!

Elawann

You could try fixing invisible sims with the FFS debugger:
http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/s....php?topic=72.0

But I'm not sure why they are all invisible... this sounds like there's an underlying cause. Does this just happen in one apartment lot, or all apartment lots?

I would also run Hood Checker and make frequent backups.

That looks more like a glitch with one or more of the apartment controllers than a corrupt 'hood. They are responsible for how apartment neighbours behave and when they should or shouldn't be visible.

If all else fails my Lot Cleaner (44kb) will wipe out all of the controllers so a fresh set will be made next time the lot loads.
To use it just select it in the catalogue (don't need to place it anywhere) then immediately save and exit the lot. I suggest you then remove it from your Downloads folder to prevent accidental use later.

Thank you all for the suggestions!

I do periodic "Hood checks" and back up the game - lately around once a month - but even after I've done several checks, the problem persists. I believe I also used the FFS Lot Debugger when the problem first started, but I will do that again.

As to the underlying cause, and whether it is a glitch or 'hood corruption - I am still hopeful you might be right and it might be a glitch - what worries me is that this did start on one specific apartment block (and then I did a check and when it still persisted I sort of shrugged my shoulders and thought it was just one of those oddities that might fix itself up), but it definitely has spread to other apartment blocks and now it seems to be everywhere...

I'm going to try your suggestions (thanks for the lot cleaner, by the way, I didn't know that one) and also do a thorough inspection of all the apartment blocks to confirm if it is widespread, and will report back!

P.S.: I'm not sure if this might be related or not, but I recently tried to do an apartment block, and actually, when I tried to move sims in - and put cheats on to have them rent the apartments furnished (I tend to pre-furnish all my apartments) - I got an error with the "apartment controller". I forget the full text, but it has to do with restoring objects... Even when I don't have debug mode on and only try to make them rent the apartment the normal way, without furniture, it still doesn't assume they have moved in and I start getting the "you still need to claim an apartment" message.... Not sure if it helps, but I'm thinking maybe it isn't a coincidence - or maybe I have too many glitches in my game!

Well, if ever you find this useful, I know I do since i never play with debug mode on. Works every time.
http://modthesims.info/download.php?t=325824

Thanks, Rosebine, I never noticed that existed! In fact, I only use debug mode for that particular situation - I turn it on, rent the furnished apartment, and immediately turn it back off (assuming there are no error messages). This a practical little mod, though, and I'll try to use after I tackle the current issue.

I have tried several apartment blocks today, and basically the pattern seems to always be this: invisible apartment block neighbours, made visible only if I visit their apartment (when that option is available), but then the apartment (and the neighbours) don't go back into darkness after I leave the apartment - and they don't come out afterwards, they just stay in their apartment, doing whatever they are doing. If I do "Ask to come out", the door opens as if the neighbours are coming out, but they are still invisible/non selectable, and the active sim or family just go back to their little life.

There was only one apartment block where I could see some neighbours walking about (in the other ones, I cannot see them), but the pattern in terms of interaction was exactly the same. And there's another little glitch: in one of the apartment blocks, a sim I created at a later stage and added to a household - let's call it X2 - appears stuck outside when I play another apartment unit (so, if I'm playing a sim in apartment Y, this will see X2 sitting in the lobby, complaining about tiredness, toilet/hygiene needs and/or hunger, and eventually collapsing on the floor). When I go back to playing the apartment unit X, though, she's perfectly alright, of course.

I've also noticed that the inactive apartments don't seem to be in complete darkness anyway, at least in some apartment blocks (I mean, I cannot see objects inside, but the apartments are not that sort of pitch black I think they should be, as in several cases I can actually see the wall paint and floors - am I being paranoid here?).

I used Lot Debugger - which, in theory, has by now removed all instances of "bad apartment units" or invisible sims, but all these issues persisted after I used it. I keep thinking if there could be a mod or an object affecting the apartment controllers... I suppose next step is doing another backup, another Hood check and then using the Lot Cleaner - and keeping my fingers crossed...

You are welcome and yes, this is normal. This is how other units should show.
I hope you'll get your issue solved asap!

Hi everyone!

I'm returning to this topic and updating the subject, as, after several attempts to fix this issue, and also after starting a new apartment block, and trying to rent it furnished, I feel that there are a couple of issues (symptoms?) in my game that probably are related to the same problem - although I still don't know what it is and how to fix it.

I've tried the different mods and tools suggested here, but with no (good) results. To summarize:

1) When using Chris Hatch's Lot Cleaner, what happened was that, on the lots where I had invisible neighbours, they were still invisible (I didn't try to explore further into other effects of the tool), and, on apartment lots where I had visited neighbours, who then remained visible after I had left, the neighbours did disappear after I've used the Lot Cleaner, but, in the process, the apartment I was playing stopped being recognised as an apartment - the telling factor being that I could no longer use the beds to sleep. I've also tested it in my new apartment block, before moving in new families, and what happened was that, when trying to use the "cheatsEnabled" to rent the furnished apartment, I got an "apartment controller error", and then the "you still need to claim an apartment to move in properly" message kept popping up.

Moreover, when I tried to simply rent an apartment, using no cheats (hence not renting it furnished), I still got the message about needing to claim an apartment. So, for all purposes, it seems that, in my game, the Lot Cleaner simply eliminates the "apartment controller function", if one call it like that. I believe I used theLot Cleaner properly - i.e., in the new apartment block, I used it buy mode, being careful not to leave the object on the lot, saved, went into the neighbourhood view, and then tried to move in sims; in the already inhabited lots, I used it without going into "live mode", as I always pause my games, so I just went into buy, selected the item, saved, went into neighborhood view, and then tried playing the lot. My question is, did I use it properly, or do I need to exit the game itself each time I use the Lot Cleaner? And if I did use it properly, what can be the issue?

2) I also used the mod Rosebine suggested, that enables the "rent furnished apartment option" on my new lot, which has 3 units (two with garage, and one without) - note, I did this separately from using the Lot Cleaner, as I had backed up my game and copied it back after the failed attempts with the Lot Cleaner.
Altough at first it seemed everything was working - the landlord checked the apartment and said it was okay, Mr. Humble came to drop the inevitable computer - I then noticed that 1) one of the apartment units had not been claimed by any NPC (one which had a garage, though I'm not sure this is relevant) and 2) the NPC that was supposed to have moved into the apartment block just stayed in the common areas, slowly getting desperate in terms of its bladder and higyene needs (peeing on the floor, getting that green smelly cloud we all know), which would suggest that the apartment was not recognised as such.

Also, in this case there was a third glitch, which was that, once I tried to buy a car and take my sim for a ride, to see if it came back - it didn't, and the game froze at 6.59pm; I then restarted the game, moved that sim out, moved another sim in - not using any cheat or the option to rent the furnished apartment - but the game still got stuck at 6.59pm.

Now, I've been trying to figure out what is the cause for all these glitches, and this last development makes me wonder, can it be caused by scriptorium (which I have), or by a lighting mod? I do not have GunMod's, but rather this one . Can that be the issue?

I also tried removing all my CC (by removing my downloads folder, which amounts to 18 GB at the moment), but even then, when I tried to move to my new apartment block, I still had the same problems: when using "cheats enabled" to rent the furnished apartment, I got the "apartment controller error", and when trying to rent it normally, I got the "you still need to claim an apartment" message. So, all in all, there seems to be an underlying issue with pretty much all of my apartments now...

In terms of configuration, I have a bit of everything: most of my apartment blocks have some units with garage and some units without, but even when I tried changing the new apartment block by removing the garages and making sure all the flats were on one floor and that there were no stairs either in the apartments or common areas, I still got the same errors. Also, most of my apartments have fireplaces, some "proper ones", some which show up as "ovens" in the inventory, so, again, can this be a possible source of the issues I'm having?

For the record, I am posting the error message I get on my new apartment building, and this, as you will notice, was done without CC - I've tried searching more about this error, but I cannot say I found anyone describing the exact same issues I have... I'm really at a loss, at the moment.

Thanks again to anyone who might have any ideas as to how to solve this!

Did you use Hood Checker like I suggested?

Have you tried using apartments that come with the game? Since self built could be built incorrectly.

Hi again!

Yes, I didn't mention it, but I did use the Hood Checker, and I frequently do - and backup my games. In terms of "errors" that I get from the Hood Checker scans, I often get memories and sims relation errors, on a first scan, and then, if I run it again, it's just memories - but actually, I can't remember (m)any errors affecting the families living in apartments. I should also mention I used the Lot debugger, but neither of these helped.

I haven't tried Maxis apartments, no, but I will. I have to say, though, I don't think I have any building errors. Some of these apartment blocks I've had in my game for years, and only recently did the problems start (invisible neighbours/neighbours staying visible in their apartments after I leave, if I try to visit them), and with the newly built ones, I've also been very careful. Yesterday, I tried with another lot that I was preparing to transform into an apartment block, and which has no garages, and, with this one, I didn't get any error when trying to rent the apartments using cheats - some of them were partially furnished, some were still empty - and all the apartments remaining in the building were taken by NPCs, BUT, again, once these NPCs moved in, they became invisible, and so I found my sims chatting to invisible neighbours...

I'm really glad you're documenting this so others can find it in future. I had a lot of apartment glitches after a long time of playing, weird views of inactive lots, out of sync sims so that they were at one stage when they were active, but a different when they weren't, etc. I hope you find a solution, but I finally gave up and made "apartments" for them that are really just residential lots that look like apartments. Might be worth considering if you just want to make sure your families are safe while you try to figure it out. Alternatively, have you restored a backup to before this happened? Maybe that would tell you something. You can always restore the current hood if the backup isn't better. You also haven't said, I don't think, that you've done a 50/50 or just checked if removing CC will fix it, have you?

Hi Sunrader,

Thanks for your kind words, and yes, part of the reason I'm sharing this is that it might be useful to other people in the future. I've been trying to tax my memory and remember when this started happening, but the question for me is that reverting back to a time before these glitches started means losing a few buildings (though I have packaged most of those) and families that I'm not too keen on losing.

Also, I want to find a solution, but I wonder if this is part of the "wear and tear" effect of playing the game over several years, and the "natural" corruption of the game, because I didn't start with a "clean" 'hood, and I did do things back in the days (before I knew better) that will normally/eventually lead to corruption - such as deleting sims from the bin... Hence, my question is whether restoring the game to a backup from six months ago or so will fix the problem or just lead to the same kind of glitches popping up again. I don't really do anything that will create further corruption these days (I think), I have very few mods, and have a fairly "conservative" way of playing, considering I play period 'hoods. So, no aliens, no odd interactions with NPCs, nothing I can really put my finger on.

Concerning CC, I did not do the 50/50 method, I simply removed all of my downloads folder, and even with that, I still got the error message you see in the picture I copied here - that picture was taken with no CC on, as you probably can guess by the bare walls and floors, and dreadful decoration (or lack thereof)... So, that would suggest it's not the CC, but something else. Again, the only thing I didn't remove at the time was scriptorium, but I'm not sure one can blame scriptorium for that. I don't know if anyone has horror tales of scriptorium creating glitches in their games, but I'm open to suggestions, in case it might be useful to test the game without it.

From what I see, somehow the apartment controllers are not really working as such, with a series of behaviours deriving from it - but this is just a broad statement, and it doesn't mean I'm any closer to understand why it is happening or what is causing it... I haven't been able to post a log of the error messages, because I basically deleted the TS2 folder every time I got one of these errors and restored to a backup over the last few weeks, but I will try renting an apartment with cheats on again and then copy the log here. Maybe someone will be able to decode it and find a clue to the underlying issue...

Hello again guys,

I'm not sure this will help, and I must say the error logs are much longer than I thought, but I'm posting one of the logs I got when I tried to use "cheats enabled" to rent a furnished apartment - I have edited down and removed the long list of objects in the apartments, because overall the log was a 76 page long document... So, you get the text at the beginning of the log, and a bit at the end, which mentions something about apartment tools - in case that can be of any use.

Build: 1.17.0.66
at Oct 11 2008,15:12:07

Object id: 202
name: Controller - Apartment
Stack size: 3
Error: Problem executing script (Apartment - Restore Objects): Run-time:
(none):0: attempt to compare number with nil
stack traceback:
(none): in function `RestoreApartmentObjectsFromLotInv'
(none): in function `Apartment - Restore Objects'



Iterations: 2598
Frame 2:
Stack Object id: 937
Stack Object name: Controller - Apartment Suite
Node: 20
Tree: id 4174 name 'Apartment - Object Updates' version -32742
from Controller_Apartment
Prim state: 1
Params: 1221 728 32000 Locals: 937 39
Frame 1:
Stack Object id: 1221
Stack Object name: Door - 1 Tile - Apartment - 0, 0 - Lead
Node: 71
Tree: id 4171 name 'Apartment - Update Families' version -32731
from Controller_Apartment
Prim state: 0
Params: Locals: 1 1 729 84 10 0 0 0 0 0 202 0 1 0 0
Frame 0:
Stack Object id: 0
Node: 16
Tree: id 4097 name 'Function - Main - Apartment' version -32669
from Controller_Apartment
Prim state: 0
Params: Locals: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 9 0


(...)

Other Simulator Details:
All Menus On = false
Move Objects On = false

(...)

neighborhoodEPJustInstalled = 0
dormSpecificToolsDisabled = false
aptSubLotSpecificToolsDisabled = true
aptBaseLotSpecificToolsDisabled = false
currentSim.age = 0
currentSim.species = human
currentSim.ageGroup = adult
currentSim.gender = male
currentSim.firstName = Gerald
currentSim.lastName = Lowen
currentSim.fullName = Gerald Lowen
testingCheatsEnabled = true

@Chris Hatch might know.

Maybe go back and look at the long list of objects. Is there anything new? Anything you placed with cheats? I've had borkiness caused by objects I wouldn't have suspected.

§11,229 per week rent? for a sim that currently has §8,771, are you sure that's what you want to do? He could buy a new home for just two weeks rent.

Difficult to work out lua script errors, the two parameters sent to it are definitely not nil values so I can only guess the nil value is from the lot inventory.
All of the behaves shown in that error log are consistent with the default M&G code so it does not appear to be any default replacement causing the bug.
Can you confirm the apartment doors are facing the correct way? One of the parameters is the room the lead tile of the apartment door is in so if a door is the wrong way around it may cause the problem.

Hi again,

The doors are facing the right way - and I didn't get any errors when first changing the lot zoning from residential to apartment base, so I don't think that is the problem. As I said, even when I removed all of my CC, the errors were still there, so that got me scratching my head...

I have tried with and without garages, with and without fireplaces - and otherwise, there are no other reasons I could think of for this. I have no balconies or anything else that I feel could be a cause for the error. I was hoping that there would be something in the log that might provide some clues.

As to the rent, yes, it is quite expensive because the apartments are very big, (it's definitely the biggest building I have in my game) and I tend to furnish before I move into the apartments (which is why I need a cheat or something that allows me to rent it furnished). I also tend to fill my sims' pockets with money before moving them in (I had forgotten about that one)! I'm currently working on some well-to-do families, so most of the houses being purchased are between 200 and 300 000 simoleons... In any case, after having tested with a much smaller apartment block, and some unfurnished units, the fact is that there are still issues with the invisible neighbours, so I feel there is an overall problem with apartment blocks/controllers.

The list of objects is quite long (the log itself is 76 pages in Word), and there's nothing I can think of that is "new" as such, although there are some items I probably never used in other apartments)... If there are other parts of the log that might be useful I can try to reproduce them here, I just need some guindance. My other question is, once I remove all the CC (as I have done), is it still possible for there to be "traces" of these objects that might explain why the errors still show up? It feels like an idiotic question, but I cannot think of anything else... Otherwise, is there a limit to the area and number of objects in apartment units that anyone knows of? Still, the number of objects in some of these apartments were minimal, as I decided to test before I finished furnishing...

I'll double-check about things placed with cheats (I basically use the "SnapObjectstoGrid" and "move objects" cheats) and I do have the "See them" program with 45 degree angles on by default, so I can just use the keys to put objects at angles. Can that be a source of problems? I always make sure, when I use the placement cheats, that I revert them back to the default values, and that, in the apartment units, the objects are well within the confines of the apartment.

You don't need 'See Them' to have the 45 degree cheat on, Just put the cheat in your user startup cheat file. For the censor blur, quaxi's is better or its also easy to set in simPE.

Hello again to all,

I wanted to make a last update about this building and my apartments in general, and letting you know what I've been able to "solve" and what I have just accepted as being part of my glitchy game - after about 10 years of playing the game, somewhat intermittently and in different computers, and making some mistakes early on, I suppose I can't have a perfect game.

1) Problems with the new apartment building(s) and the error with restoring objects

I tried starting almost from scratch with the big apartment building I had built - I had packaged it when I had only the structure and that seemed to work without problems when I reinstalled it in the game. I also remembered that I had reverted the glitchy version of the apartment building into a residential lot (I know, I don't need to, but I sometimes still do things "old school"), to add a few doors between some rooms, and then changed the zoning into apartment base again, so I thought that might have been the issue.

For a while, I was convinced that this had been the problem, and I kept decorating and testing by trying to get a sim moving in and using the cheats to allow them to rent the furnished apartment, but inevitably, at some point, after doing the furnishings/decorating it, I always ended up getting the same error - the error about restoring objects.

Feeling really distraught and at a loss as to what I was doing wrong, I packaged the lot and tested it in a clean neighbourhood (I use Clean Installer, naturally). Surprise, surprise, no issues with renting furnished lots using cheats.

So, I used the packaged lot, installed it with Clean Installer in my 'hood, and now I'm able to play the apartment building, using the cheat to rent the furnished apartments. I cannot understand what the problem is and why my game doesn't allow me to play the version that I furnished in-game, but as long as I package and install the finished version, I don't get any problems - except, of course, the second issue, which is the invisible neighbours...

2) Invisible neighbours

This seems to be "endemic" in my game now - all the apartments I've tried have the issue of the neighbours becoming invisible, including the latest one. They show up in the beginning, they go in to their apartment units, and they become invisible.

I have the Lot Debugger in my game, and I use it ever so often to fix invisible neighbours - they become visible during the period they are outside, and I can interact with them, but when they eventually go home, they come out invisible. You can tell they're active because you hear voices, you see "flying pillows" and other objects when they pick them up - including when they take away my sims' newspaper - but they keep reverting to invisible every time I use the Lot Debugger and make them (temporarily) visible.

At the moment, I'm trying to treat this as a minor annoyance, although it's not so minor. As always, one of the things I worry about is this being the symptom of a bigger problem, which will eventually make my game unplayable, but...


I'm not sure if anyone will find this thread useful, but I hope so, and that maybe my strategy of packing and installing newly-built glitchy lots - which seem glitchy for no reason - might help someone who has struggled with similar problems. I can also add that I used this strategy for another lot I had built ages ago (and checked and double-checked), and that had given me the same error, and it worked for that one too!

As to permanent fixes for the invisible neighbours, I'm still clueless, but hey, in real life, sometimes you actually don't see your neighbours for days on end anyway, so... :P

Are you on UC or disks? if UC make a back up, go into Origin, right click fix game.

If on disks I wonder if it's a corrupted object.package http://simswiki.info/wiki.php?title...Objects.package Invisible sims can be a sign.